LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Phuzzy Logic — Fri, 25 Oct 2013 15:08:52 -0400

Techzone went out of business. Their laser cut Mendel is documented by several links on the following page: "http://reprap.org/wiki/TechZone_InfoHub" . Some of the links document lists of materials.

Techzone included a printed BOM (Bill Of Materials) with my Huxley kit. But, although I received all the parts listed, it was not enough to complete the assembly. -Phuzzy

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

uncle_bob — Wed, 16 Oct 2013 21:37:59 -0400

I suspect you would do better to start a new thread rather than trying to revive one that's been dead for 2 years. I know this from personal experience at trying to revive dead threads ....

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

cycle365 — Tue, 15 Oct 2013 16:21:57 -0400

I am cutting the laser cut parts my self, and need a list of the other pieces I need to buy. Is there anywhere I can find a definitive list of the parts that come in a TechZone kit.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Nudel — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 08:06:35 -0400

brnrd Wrote:
> I used to have a similar set-up with the Gen 3
> Remix and I didn't find a ground pin in the
> motherboard that can be used to connect DIRECTLY
> to the extruder controller. I didn't see them in
> your picture either. The only ground path between
> the MB and EC in your wiring goes through the
> stepper controllers.

Well, those picture were only to show the main 12v and ground wiring (and as a bonus the stepper controllers wiring), and they still lack all the other wires. I have a shot of everything but it's terribly messy and you can't really make out heads from tails in it.

Here's a picture of my set with (some of) the ground pins marked: [reprap.org] I connected a wire from the pin on the MB to the EC.

But I do seem to recall seeing some motherboards without those extra headers? And if they left those out, yes you would have to solder a header on. But then you might as well just solder the wire directly to the board. Then again, there are plenty of ground pins going to the steppers controllers, and if you really don't like soldering I guess you could split the ribbon cable and hijack one of those.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

brnrd — Thu, 27 Oct 2011 15:55:13 -0400

Quote
Nudel
And there is no need to solder the extra ground wire from the motherboard to the extruder controller. There are several free ground pins on both pcbs, and for me it works fine with just using a arduino/breadboard male-male wire between them.

I used to have a similar set-up with the Gen 3 Remix and I didn't find a ground pin in the motherboard that can be used to connect DIRECTLY to the extruder controller. I didn't see them in your picture either. The only ground path between the MB and EC in your wiring goes through the stepper controllers.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Nudel — Thu, 27 Oct 2011 14:42:09 -0400

I connect the wires from the power supply into the chocolate block together with one of other wires alreday there, two wires in one terminal. They are not wired up in the pictures I posted, and I don't have a good picture showing that, sorry.

The chocolate block is not needed, but I find it useful if I move or transport my printer to be able to disconnect the wires coming from the psu.

And there is no need to solder the extra ground wire from the motherboard to the extruder controller. There are several free ground pins on both pcbs, and for me it works fine with just using a arduino/breadboard male-male wire between them.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

brnrd — Wed, 26 Oct 2011 22:22:33 -0400

You don't need the "chocolate box" connector to wire the Gen 3 Remix. You can just run wires between the screw terminals of the MB, EC and SCs and the power supply connector. The tricky part is connecting the ground between the MB and EC. You'll need to solder a wire into the MB since there's no ground screw terminal in that board.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

electrodruid — Wed, 26 Oct 2011 19:27:04 -0400

Aha! So evidently the missing piece of the puzzle is the chocolate block. I didn't get one of those in the kit, and none of the TechZone documentation that I can see mentions it. I just googled for "chocolate block connector" and it found a useful-looking wiki page about wiring Mendel electronics which I hadn't seen before :)

[reprap.org]

I'm still slightly confused (I know, I know, I'm slow)... In your pictures (thanks for those) I can see how you've connected everything together but I don't see where the power actually comes in (did you add wires going into the block after taking those pictures?), and the wiki pictures show the power coming in from the socket to the chocolate block but there are no shots of the other side of the block - is that just one pair of wires coming out of the middle two holes on the far side of the block, and nothing coming from the outside holes?

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Nudel — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 16:09:18 -0400

Yes, you need to wire all the ground terminals together, and all the 12v+ together.

I found a couple of old pictures where I just wired up the connections. Sorry about the glare and fingerprints.

Front: [localhostr.com]
Back: [localhostr.com]

I used fat single core wires, and since it was a bit difficult to jam three of them into one chocolate block I had to split them. So I hooked up one wire from the power supply to the + , and one to - . With thinner wires you can just latch them from one board to the next.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

electrodruid — Sun, 23 Oct 2011 12:24:23 -0400

I can see that power needs to get from the mains adapter to the extruder board and stepper controllers. What I can't work out is how. I've got a little black socket that the power supply plugs into, but I don't see what I'm supposed to attach the socket to. I could attach the socket to the wooden board somehow, but even if I do that I've got to get power from the socket to 4 seperate boards, and it's not clear how to do that. Do all the boards get hooked together so that power flows from one board to the next one, or is there some mechanism by which the power that comes in gets split up and sent to each board seperately?

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Nudel — Tue, 18 Oct 2011 20:46:36 -0400

In short: You need to find and hook up the 12v and ground wires from the psu to the electronics. That means to the extruder board and the stepper controllers. The motherboard gets power from the usb, but will benefit from an extra grounding cable to the extruder.

Pic of the extruder 12v supply: [reprap.org]

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

electrodruid — Tue, 18 Oct 2011 19:33:38 -0400

After a bit of a hiatus (some of it spent waiting for a replacement tip assembly which I was told by the UK supplier that I'd be getting, which hasn't materialised), I'm back trying to finish the electronics on my Mendel. I got the Generation 3 Electronics, and I've got the cables made, connected all the boards up, and hooked in the motors. I'm totally stuck with how to actually connect up a power supply, though. I have a mains adaptor (with a US plug, but I can get a UK one), a socket for the adapter to plug into, some yellow and black wire, a metal plate and a couple of screws, but it's not at all obvious to me how to actually hook it all up to the Mendel. I've found several photos showing how to assemble all the rest of the electronics (Example: [reprap.org]) but nothing that shows the power supply connections. I don't see a space on any of the boards to connect the socket to, or have any idea how to get the power from the socket to all the different boards that need it.

I'm probably missing something incredibly obvious, but can someone describe or show pictures for how they've done it? It'd be much appreciated...

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Devos — Sat, 03 Sep 2011 19:42:43 -0400

Here is the update, I have got all of the individual components working using repsnapper I can control the machine but I can't get any code out of my models using repsnapper on(win7 64). I have loaded Skeinforge but can't make heads or tails of it, I have tried to generate code in replicatorg and import that into repsnapper but it just moves to a corner and stays there making lots of small moves and not much else.

The learning curve has been brutal on this project. After going through the hassle that is know as bot maker we got a full mendel kit from techzone and was excited that it actually showed up although was very disappointed at the amount of modification that the parts took to make them work and the smoke when you get the extrude tip up to temp. I have been going to Metrics for a lot of help and that has greatly lowered my stress level although not my bosses who though we would be printing parts after putting the thing together.

Right now I am planning on hand coding for a bit just to make sure I have everything working correctly and then trying to figure out why my stl aren't getting sliced and coded in repsnapper.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

raldrich — Wed, 31 Aug 2011 21:43:22 -0400

Devos, you might want to visit the reprap IRC. There's plenty of helpful people there, some of which have already been through the "TechZone Experience" ;)

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

EtherDais — Wed, 31 Aug 2011 15:55:00 -0400

Devos,

I wish there was a subforum to direct you to for techzone help, but that seems to be this thread. =/

You may want to start off with a description of what they sent you, then we can work toward solving the problems.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

Devos — Tue, 30 Aug 2011 14:22:33 -0400

I just got done assembling my tech zone laser cut mendel and reading through this thread. The consensus I have come to is that I am in way over my head. I get some blinking lights and can't communicate with the machine all i get is a constant electrical whirl from all my motors it changes pitch when I open my reprap software but won't jog or do anything. I have downloaded more software than I know what to do with and haven't heard back from tech zone.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

EtherDais — Thu, 25 Aug 2011 21:41:43 -0400

electrodruid - We've been having HUGE issues with missing parts on our orders lately. Techzone is, thankfully, generally willing to correct their mistakes when informed kindly.

I believe you have an extra 3 pin connector that should be a 2 pin connector. This is not a big deal. Just use it for that and make sure you know what wire is going into what hole. 3 3 pin cables are used for the optos, and 2 2 pin cables are used for communication from the motherboard to the extruder controller/extruder stepper controller.

The documentation for the Gen 3 boards has some images which may help you.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

electrodruid — Tue, 23 Aug 2011 11:29:54 -0400

Hi guys,

thanks for the advice on the ribbon cable assembly. I've successfully built the 6 pin cable now. I have another question about the electronics - specifically, I'd like someone to confirm how many cables of each type I should end up with, and what each of the cables is used for.

This is what I got in the kit:

1 * 10 pin ribbon cable
1 * 6 pin ribbon cable
1 * 3 pin ribbon cable
1 * 2 pin ribbon cable
6 * 10 pin connectors (black)
2 * 6 pin connectors (blue)
8 * 3 pin connectors (7 green ones, 1 blue one)
3 * 2 pin connectors (blue)
4 * opto endstops

From the quantities of the parts and the instructions, it's easy to infer that I should cut up some of the cables and make 3 * 10 pin cables and 1 * 6 pin cable. The 3-pins and 2-pins are more confusing though. One of the 3-pin connectors (a green one, FWIW) is attached to the CAT5 cable in the tip assembly, so I'm left with 7 * 3-pin connectors and 3 * 2-pin connectors. The instructions seem to imply I need to build 3 * 3-pin cables and 2 * 2 pin cables - which I could do if I cut one of the 3-pin connectors down to a 2-pin, but it would leave me with one endstop I can't connect to anything. If I actually need 4 * 3-pin cables then I'm missing a 3-pin connector and a 2-pin connector. What am I supposed to be doing here?

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

DeuxVis — Sun, 21 Aug 2011 16:37:37 -0400

I find it makes an easier result with those connectors to first remove the insulation from half a centimeter of the wires and fold the stripped metal onto the insulated part.
You then proceed as recommended on the wiki, making sure the stripped part is under the plastic, so that even if you don't pierce the plastic the contact will be made anyway.

Make sure to check for shorts before using the cable then.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

tcool1008 — Fri, 19 Aug 2011 20:40:35 -0400

electrodruid,

Hi sorry to hear you are having trouble with the ribbon cable connectors. This was also somewhat of a problem for me because the screwdriver kept slipping and hitting my fingers! If you look at the top of the connectors there should be sharp metallic slots. I would recommend putting the the connector in a vice then positioning the wire over the slot, then press the wire very firmly down into the slots with a small flat head screwdriver.

In between the slots are sharp, this should cut the wire insulation and make contact between the wire and the terminal. I would definitely check each connection with a multimeter after you are done.

Here is a top view of a 2 pin connector(look for the metallic slots):
[i205.photobucket.com]

If you have any further problems post a pic of what your doing and hopefully we can figure it out.

hope this helps,
Trevor

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

electrodruid — Fri, 19 Aug 2011 20:03:37 -0400

Hi,

It seems like a few of you have got further than me with the TechZone kit, which is encouraging for me :) I started very slowly with mine but have been making more progress since the new set of instructions went up. The problem I'm having at the moment is with assembling the 2, 3 and 6 pin ribbon cables as described here:
[www.reprap.org]

I split the ends of the cable, tucked them into the space past the contacts, folded them over the tops of the contacts and into the slots on the other side of the cable that hold everything in place, and then poked the wires into the contacts with the smallest screwdriver I have, which seemed to be easily small enough to do the job. The resulting cable has no electrical connection between its ends. The description seems to imply that if you do it right, the contacts will somehow pierce through the wires (or at least through the insulation to make contact with the wires), but I don't see how that can happen. There are no sharp points I can see on the contacts, and the wire fits comfortably into the space in the contacts without anything getting bent out of shape or coming close to piercing the insulation.

I tried stripping the insulation off some of the ends, but then the wires are so thin that they simply fall out of the connector. I can't see any way to keep them in short of soldering them, which looks like a pretty fiddly and difficult thing to get right.

Where am I going wrong? Can anybody describe the process in more detail, and/or with better pictures? Failing that, where can I buy some suitable pre-assembled cables of the right length with the right connectors? I'm in the UK

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

owism8 — Thu, 14 Jul 2011 05:51:55 -0400

Hey Shaywalters,

Ive had similar experience with techzones poor tip design. I purchased the following from CdnReprap
[reprap.org]

Just PM him and tell him you want to purchase one. He makes them and sends them from Canada.

This is more reliable and only 45$

ShayWalters Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I got things apart and found that the hot end
> hadn't pushed out of the wood, the oak block seems
> to be a lamination of several layers and the
> interface between two layers split apart. There
> was a single screw through the layers to hold them
> together, but it spread apart on the end opposite
> that screw. Now that I've removed some of the
> PLA, I can see that I was mistaken, it's a solid
> block of wood, and it split along the grain.
> There is some charring around the hot end, but not
> enough that it had pushed out of the wood. The
> split began at the upper edge of the hot end.
>
> On the plus side, considering the construction, I
> think I may try just getting a piece of wood (for
> now) and trying to re-build it as-built, just so I
> can get through a Linux User Group demonstration I
> have scheduled for this evening. Long-term, I
> will try to find some other material to replace
> the wood.
>
> Apparently the wiki doesn't like picasa photos -
> they aren't showing up in the preview of this
> message. So here are the links to them:
>
>
> Here's a photo with the hot end attached to the
> extruder:
> [picasaweb.google.com]
> EZvl5_oVKA?feat=directlink
>
> and a close-up after taking it off:
> [picasaweb.google.com]
> LD1UjzvkNQ?feat=directlink
>
> and here's a photo after cleaning out the PLA and
> separating the broken parts:
> [picasaweb.google.com]
> KzxdXKp55g?feat=directlink
>
> I wonder if my feed rate is too high? I was
> definitely getting too-thin an extrusion the last
> couple of parts, and it didn't seem that it was
> too thick previously.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

izzy84075 — Wed, 13 Jul 2011 16:47:36 -0400

Okay. So I'm back to working on this after another several months. I've switched over to a thermistor now, and I'm looking for firmware to put on it. I've got a patched together version of the 'plain old' reprap firmware mostly working, in that it moves the X, Y and Z axes and reads temperature, but the extruder stepper doesn't turn. I'm still poking at getting that working, but I'm wondering if anybody what you guys would recommend.

I've got the techzone remix electronics(Not the monolithic board).

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

ShayWalters — Tue, 12 Jul 2011 05:49:24 -0400

I got things apart and found that the hot end hadn't pushed out of the wood, the oak block seems to be a lamination of several layers and the interface between two layers split apart. There was a single screw through the layers to hold them together, but it spread apart on the end opposite that screw. [edit] Now that I've removed some of the PLA, I can see that I was mistaken, it's a solid block of wood, and it split along the grain. There is some charring around the hot end, but not enough that it had pushed out of the wood. The split began at the upper edge of the hot end.

On the plus side, considering the construction, I think I may try just getting a piece of wood (for now) and trying to re-build it as-built, just so I can get through a Linux User Group demonstration I have scheduled for this evening. Long-term, I will try to find some other material to replace the wood.

Apparently the wiki doesn't like picasa photos - they aren't showing up in the preview of this message. So here are the links to them:

Here's a photo with the hot end attached to the extruder:
[picasaweb.google.com]

and a close-up after taking it off:
[picasaweb.google.com]

and here's a photo after cleaning out the PLA and separating the broken parts:
[picasaweb.google.com]

I wonder if my feed rate is too high? I was definitely getting too-thin an extrusion the last couple of parts, and it didn't seem that it was too thick previously.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

ShayWalters — Sun, 10 Jul 2011 05:23:34 -0400

EtherDais, thanks for the tip about bamboo. I will see if I can work up something using it. As fate would have it, I ran into this problem printing out some parts in preparation for a demonstration of the printer at a local Linux User Group. Perhaps I can get things working again in time for the demo.

Looking back over some of the earlier messages in this topic, I see that there was some discussion about communication problems possibly affecting the temperature readings. I am seeing quite a lot of errors. There is a constant parade of checksum error messages in the terminal window that I launched repsnapper from. The most common error is

** (repsnapper:2304): WARNING **: Error (-4) 'Serial Error: Received a LineNr code without a Checksum code
 or Checksum without LineNr' - user popup?

Occasionally I get a pop-up window that says "Error reading from device! Resource temporarily unavailable". Printing stops when this comes up, but usually printing resumes when I close this window. When it doesn't, I click the "Kick" button in Repsnapper, and usually that gets things going. Once in a while, it will not start back and I'll have to just start over.

But things should not be this way, and perhaps it is contributing to my hot-end problems by causing problems reading the temperature. So if anyone has suggestions about how to resolve these comm errors, I'd be grateful.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

EtherDais — Sun, 10 Jul 2011 03:14:28 -0400

I'm sure when you dissect your failed oak tips, you will find that there has been some crack or leak which originates from the porous bands which permeate their blocks. This is after something like ~5 of my own tips, and ~5 tips we've gone through in the course of last semester's class.

We believe that even using an Oak branch, with the 'center bore' drilled through the center of the branch would provide a significant improvement, as it wouldn't have the pore structure of the oak blocks which techzone generally provides.

We've considered using other types of wood as a replacment for the oak block design.
Gary Hodgeson suggests bamboo: [garyhodgson.com]

There are a number of discussions about using different hard woods for such things, inclusing references to this table: [en.wikipedia.org]
But, it's important to balance hardness (higher being better) with thermal conductivity (lower being better).

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

ShayWalters — Sat, 09 Jul 2011 21:25:24 -0400

> With experience of some ~10 wooden hot tips, these
> are the failure modes we've identified:
>
> 1) charring of the wooden threads, leading to the
> brass hot end popping out. This is exaccerbated
> by having a tip overheat and start smoking. If
> you can avoid this, it is less likely to happen.
>
> 2) cracking of the wood near the brass, letting
> the brass slip out
> 3) cracking of the wood between the brass and the
> teflon tube insert. Typically this is preceeded
> by polymer oozing from the pores connected to this
> juncture.
>

Unfortunately, you can chalk up one more that has failed this way. I haven't disassembled it yet to see exactly what's going on, but it has pushed out several mm, and has been oozing PLA other than through the nozzle.
Is there a reasonable repair that can be made with the existing parts? Are there some types of plastic that would stand up to this temperature? What about MDF instead of oak?

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

raldrich — Wed, 22 Jun 2011 15:44:27 -0400

EtherDais Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The oak tips from techzone have a few typical
> routes toward failure, though they usually hold up
> for a period of time, and would probably be better
> with a different choice of wood. I suspect they
> went with Oak due to the low thermal conductivity,
> but Oak maintains this property through a network
> of rather large pores, which tend to fill with
> polymer over time.
>
> With experience of some ~10 wooden hot tips, these
> are the failure modes we've identified:
>
> 1) charring of the wooden threads, leading to the
> brass hot end popping out. This is exaccerbated
> by having a tip overheat and start smoking. If
> you can avoid this, it is less likely to happen.
>
> 2) cracking of the wood near the brass, letting
> the brass slip out
> 3) cracking of the wood between the brass and the
> teflon tube insert. Typically this is preceeded
> by polymer oozing from the pores connected to this
> juncture.
>
> This is all using PLA - I'm sure results using ABS
> would be worse. I recently recieved some of
> their metal tip designs, and they seem quite good
> in comparison.
>
So far, the oak block on mine is holding up, I think because of two reasons.

1) I've been very careful to avoid overheating the tip - I made sure to solve hot tip communication problems before attempting a print.

2) I believe that the Nylon liner in my tip is pressed very tightly to the brass tip, keeping plastic from leaking into the wood.

> I'd like to suggest to techzone (maybe we can all
> sing a chorus to them together) that their kits
> include a 4th stepper controller and metal tip
> from the get go - even if they have to up their
> price to compensate, there's no reason not to sell
> the most complete product you can and i worry that
> this isn't happening, but could easily be
> happening with some input.

TechZone appears to be transitioning to a "monolithic" design for their electronics, which uses a real stepper controller for the extruder. I suspect that they also intend to discontinue the wooden hot end.

The question is, what do they plan to do with their current stock of gen 3 electronics, and wooden hot ends? Keep sending them out to unsuspecting new customers? They'd do better to stop shipping them in kits, and sell them all as repair parts.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

EtherDais — Sat, 18 Jun 2011 10:22:03 -0400

The oak tips from techzone have a few typical routes toward failure, though they usually hold up for a period of time, and would probably be better with a different choice of wood. I suspect they went with Oak due to the low thermal conductivity, but Oak maintains this property through a network of rather large pores, which tend to fill with polymer over time.

With experience of some ~10 wooden hot tips, these are the failure modes we've identified:

1) charring of the wooden threads, leading to the brass hot end popping out. This is exaccerbated by having a tip overheat and start smoking. If you can avoid this, it is less likely to happen.
2) cracking of the wood near the brass, letting the brass slip out
3) cracking of the wood between the brass and the teflon tube insert. Typically this is preceeded by polymer oozing from the pores connected to this juncture.

This is all using PLA - I'm sure results using ABS would be worse. I recently recieved some of their metal tip designs, and they seem quite good in comparison.

I'd like to suggest to techzone (maybe we can all sing a chorus to them together) that their kits include a 4th stepper controller and metal tip from the get go - even if they have to up their price to compensate, there's no reason not to sell the most complete product you can and i worry that this isn't happening, but could easily be happening with some input.

Re: LaserCut Mendel by Tech Zone Remix (:D

nophead — Sat, 18 Jun 2011 04:14:26 -0400

Quote

NOPHEAD:
What temp are you running your bed at for PLA, I looked at your blog and I thought 55C should be OK.

Yes I do PLA on a bed at 55C. When using glass I do the first layer at 90C. For PET and blue tape I use 55C for all the layers.

To make blue tape work you have to do the first layer a bit low and the plastic a bit hotter on the first layer so it is liquid enough to soak into the tape. Adrian also used to rough up the tape and change it for each build I think.

Glass is by far the best for PLA. The only reason I use PET or Kapton is they also work with ABS. The first layer temperature required for glass seems to vary wildly according to the glass. The temperature for the rest of the build should be just below the glass transition of the plastic.