Repraps / 3D printer price comparison - is there any seller not listed?

Hello everyone. I made a list of 3D printer price comparison, including DIY Reprapped Kits and fully assembled Repraps, together with other 3D printers, and their vendor and price. Does anyone know more sellers? Individual or companies or websites? Who is not listed? If you know any, is it possible that you can give me a note? Many thanks for the help.

The price list is here. http://www.3ders.org/3d-printer/3d-printer-price.html

Best regards,
Anja

Just saw this recently. [www.indiegogo.com] $350 full kit? Amazing. And the fact that they actually do injection molding as a buisiness makes it believeable.

bryanandaimee Wrote:
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> Just saw this recently.
> [www.indiegogo.com] $350 full
> kit? Amazing. And the fact that they actually do
> injection molding as a buisiness makes it
> believeable.

I don't know, they say it's a 3d-printer but at the same time they say that they test it with the mach3 CNC software? Doesn't sound like they are really sure what they are doing? Or am I wrong here?
Mach3 and EMC2 does not work with USB... A lot of questions... but the price seems good.

I didn't see MakerGear's Mosaic on there.

Another problem is that a lot of Mendel and Prusa Mendel kits are listed as having 200mm in Z. The 140 listed on others is closer to correct for most Mendels.

bryanandaimee: Thanks. I have temporarily added in the list.

Malx: I will contact seemecnc.com to see if I get some answers.

Dale Dunn: Thank you. MakerGear's Mosaic are listed. The Zs with 200mm are data from the vendors. I will confirm with them next week.

Thanks guys.

Regards,
Anja

I am making Prusa's here in New Zealand but only one at a time, they are kits flat pack with Sanguino boards see my website here I also sell some parts and as money becomes available I will be stocking more parts..
I only supply Prusa kits with linear bearings though as I find them better

Gary
Acronum.com

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/03/2011 04:08PM by NelsonRap.

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__________________________________________________________________________
Experimenting in 3D in New Zealand

It's a 3D printer. It has an extruder and is based on Huxley. They are using a parallel port based electronics so it's not compatible with current reprap electronics but others have done the same on repraps before. It means current reprap firmware and software won't run it but CNC stuff will. If you want sanguinololu or something instead you could get the $100 kit and then supply motors and electronics yourself. I have no affiliation with them I just thought it was cool that they were doing injection molding and getting the price down so cheap.

"It has an extruder and is based on Huxley"
" It means current reprap firmware and software won't run it but CNC stuff will"

I really don't get it. Is it really a 3d-printer if there is no software that can be used to print with it? I might be wrong but I have not seen any extruder control in Mach3 (I havn't worked that much in it but made a few CNC cuts). Then a extruder is sort of worthless...or as you say you will need to add a couple of 100 bucks to get it working...Not so cheap anymore. (Remember that Mach3 cost a lot as well and you will need to find a computer with a parallel port that's normally not present on new PC:s)

You are not tied to Mach3. EMC2 is also listed which is open source and free. I'm sure they'll be able to figure out how to run the extruder. It's really just another axis. You can look here to see some others that have used EMC2 on a CNC repstrap :

[forums.reprap.org]

So for those who like the CNC paradigm and have a parallel port on their computer (almost everyone?) $350 would be the total cost to get started.

If you wanted reprap electronics and reprap software you would just get the $100 parts kit (Which for plastic parts/belts/ rod/nuts/bearings etc. is a great deal too.) and then buy $75 worth of steppers and your favorite electronics. So total cost that route would be something like $250-$350 depending on your choice of electronics.

Please add the Fablicator to the list.

www.fablicator.com

~$3000 (exact price tbd by Jan when sales begin)

7x7x7in area.

Fully Assembled.

Thanks.

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www.Fablicator.com

Got feedback from seemecnc.com.

"We are using mach3 with our prototype machines.

Reprap controls will work with our kit in place of our electronics. Our hardware is compatible with arduino control electronics.

Mach3 can control the ectruder motor, and our standalone controller actually drives the stepper and controls the hotend temps. If you go the arduino route, you can buy our plastic parts and hardware kit for $100 and source steppers anywhere, and your srduino setup will drive the machine. "

Sorry for the poor spelling in my reply email to 3ders, it was on my cell while i was riding home. Yes guys, our machines are built from our injection molded parts, that's the deal with us being able to cut alot of the cost's out of these machines, as well as our buying power for alot of other hardware that goes with them. We are using Mach3/EMC2 setups with our prototypes because we think it's a great start into our other CNC designs we are going to work on getting out there later on.

As far as "I really don't get it. Is it really a 3d-printer if there is no software that can be used to print with it?"

Yes, it melts plastic out of a toolhead, and moves around to extrude said plastic in precise locations. We are printing on ours right now LIVE, go to ustream.tv/channel/seemecnc and see for yourself. We are using mach3 to drive our machine. As far as "rep-rap" software to be used, well, the only thing needing to be changed out would be our stepper controller for your arduino/etc... and you have the exact same physical setup.

Also, I have been reaching out to the rep-rap community. We are going to be putting up all of our design files/configs/etc... when we finish our production run, but because we have not made all of the parts, and are making changes as we go, we havn't yet. You can keep an eye out on our seemecnc.com website for them.

Thanks again for the positive replies,

And as always, feel free to email us with any questions,

John "oly"

bryanandaimee Wrote:
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> So for those who like the CNC paradigm and have a
> parallel port on their computer (almost everyone?)
> $350 would be the total cost to get started.

Almost nobody has a parallel port these days, do they? USB - sure - but parallel?

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Follow my Mendel Prusa build here: [julianh72.blogspot.com]

Sorry for sounding so negative!
I just found that the description on the indiegogo is very easy to misunderstand for a not experienced person, just the people this campaign seems to aim for with its low price approach.

"Our H-1 machine is based on a famous open source RepRap machine named Huxley."
For me it sounds like I get more or less a RepRap. Some rows below they says that it's not a "replica" but the only things they mentioned there is the molding plastics and the bearings, not the electronics and software that I think many will be disappointed in if the only thing they want is a reprap/3d-printer.

It would have been easy, and HONEST, to just write down what you need and what it cost to make it a reprap compatible machine. I think that it still might seems like an affordable solution, but I will never recommend something that tries to seem like something it isn't.

How about an explanation on the steps to get EMC2 to print a 3d stl file? What is the speed it is printing with?

(I like the idea of a combined CNC/3dprinter but all people I have talked to says it always a back side, speed vs. stability)

"parallel port (almost everyone?)"
Not event close, I have 5! computers at home from various time and only one desktop computer has a parallel port (from 2002). Today, no laptops have them (ok, it exist exceptions on larger laptops) and very few desktop PCs. But to talk against my self it still fairly easy to find an old working PC with parallel port on a nearby junkyard.

Well, Malx, thanks for the reply.

I'm sorry if it sounds confusing on the Indiegogo campaign? Maybe you could elaborate and I can change the wording so it's not too hard to understand. We say there as well as on our website that we give the credit to the Huxley design, so I don't understand your comment about "For me it sounds like I get more or less a RepRap. Some rows below they says that it's not a "replica" but the only things they mentioned there is the molding plastics and the bearings, not the electronics and software that I think many will be disappointed in if the only thing they want is a reprap/3d-printer. "

As far as a "rep-rap", maybe I need you to clarify the definition, because on here it says a rep-rap is " RepRap is a free desktop 3D printer capable of printing plastic objects. Since many parts of RepRap are made from plastic and RepRap can print those parts, RepRap is a self-replicating machine - one that anyone can build given time and materials. It also means that - if you've got a RepRap - you can print lots of useful stuff, and you can print another RepRap for a friend... " Now, I don't personally agree with the first comment of it being a "free desktop 3D printer", as I bet not one person got one totally free.

You can order our hardware ($100 dollar perk) and use your own arduino and steppers, and you have a "3D printer" as you say. There was never any intention of being anything other than "honest", and we apologize if you read it that way?

As for the parallel port issue, because we are doing more home-based CNC projects, the parallel port and mach3/EMC2 route is the way we feel will be most adaptable to all our machines.

I hope this clears up any confusion, if not, feel free to email us at our seemecnc gmail address, and we'll be more than happy to answer them.

Thanks again,

John "Oly"

Ok, to begin with it was not about not giving credit to the RepRap community. It was more that I (I'm a newbie) would after I first heard about RepRap expect certain things from the various RepRap machines, one of the things is the USB-connection and some of the software compatibility. This of course differs between RepRap/Repstraps models, both kits and home builded but some of the compatibility seems to exist on most of them.

I just know that I would have been very disappointed if I bought what I thought to be a fully ready "RepRap"-like variant and then found out that I cannot use most of the software being discussed on this and similar forums.

Therefore I suggest that you should mention what you plan to offer in ready-to-print software or not (And the cost of that software). And also tell the "full" story when it comes to difference to the most Huxley's instead of just the mechanics now that you start the text by mention the Huxley.

I still think your molded plastic to get cost down and easier manufacture approach is very good. I'm just afraid that your CNC software variant may do for a poor 3D-printer, if not by quality then by poor user friendliness and no community software upgrades (Development is still strong). Please prove me wrong .

OK so the world has passed me by and it is actually harder than I thought to find a modern desktop motherboard with a parallel port. My two year old ASUS core 2 duo motherboard has one as well as a header for a plain vanilla serial connection. But while you are amazed at all my old computers that actually have a parallel port on the motherboard, you and I are down-converting that shiny new USB connection to an even older standard called serial RS-232, setting port numbers and baud rates, and generally getting all retro with our own bad selves. (And causing some comms headaches in the process) It seems like a parallel port based electronics is at least as viable as an RS-232 based electronics.

And let's not get too ahead of ourselves regarding the state of software/firmware in the reprap community. Yes there is lots of development going on, but I would guess that a lot of that development is going into adding features that the CNC software/firmware stacks have had for quite some time. As an example see the addoption of grbl into Marlin.

All that being said, I think the audience for this printer is geared more to the CNC guy who also wants to do 3D printing, rather than the RepRap guy who wants a starter kit. And that's cool too.

P.S. I'm pretty new around here too, and I didn't have much trouble figuring out that the electronics/software were not reprap based.

> It seems like a
> parallel port based electronics is at least as
> viable as an RS-232 based electronics.

Nope, that's the problem. While USB->serial connections works fine with most 3d-printer software, Usb->parallel does not work with EMC2 or MACH3. Don't ask me why, I think it is very strange. (I have CNC-building friends that has put several not so good words in the air when they have found that out)

And as I said, I think it seems like a very fine product. I just find the information a little short handed. I also hope that the speed can be increased over the 15 inch per minute (6.35 mm/s) they are using now but I'm quite sure that they can do that when they start getting used to the machine.

Usb->parallel adapters let you run a conventional 2D parallel printers by sending the character data but CNC use the pins of the parallel port as general purpose I/O and pulses them with microseconds accuracy, something that is impossible over USB, which has milliseconds of latency.

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[www.hydraraptor.blogspot.com]

@Malx I was actually thinking "viable" in terms of the many people already running CNC machines on a parallel port who might be a market for this kind of machine, but since you bring it up, how is a $15 PCI or PCI express card that adds a parallel port to your shiny new computer that much different from the $15 USB to serial adapter that adds a serial port? And not to start a flame war or anything but aren't we (reprapers) supposed to be problem solvers and innovators? OK that was a bit rude, but seriously, do we need to spend all this time wringing our hands when a little research will show anyone who cares that the tool chain is viable?

@Nophead Thanks for the info, I wondered about that

@Johnoly99 I actually agree in part about making it more clear how the electronics and software differ from what a reprap enthusiast would expect. I imagine a quick addition to the description would suffice. Maybe something like

Our H-1 machine is based on a famous open source RepRap machine named Huxley, but we use parallel port based electronics compatible with more conventional CNC software like Mach3 or EMC2. So if you want to use the reprap created software, get the $100 parts kit and use any of the great reprap created electronics platforms, but if you're a CNCer like us then get the full kit and print using your favorite CNC software.

Also consider a variant of the SeeMeCNC machine that is bundled with one of the RepRap electronics boards for those who want the machine but already know reprap software and don't want to change, or a more complete kit with motors and only electronics missing. And congrats on 648% funding!

@nophead
Thanks, that made it clear.

@bryanandaimee
That is great information and exactly the type of information that should be available. It's not me you need to "convince", as I said, it's seems to be a nice product and at a fantastic price point. It's just the lack of information I'm against.

I just give my own opinion and experience.
I got "fooled" and thought it was suppose to work as most of the repraps with any computer with usb-connection the first time I found the Indiegogo page. It was first when I did a more full research (a couple of days) on the whole 3d-printer stuff that I did realize how the product was delivered. (with CNC electronics). And I would have been really disappointed if I had bought it at first sight since I only work with small light laptops nowadays, something I probably wouldn't be now since I know what I get and can prepare for it. Sure, many people might be smarter than me and understand everything directly but I think I can promise that the opposite is true as well. Not everyone that search for a 3D-printer has worked with CNC:s or similar machines before.

Think so much pain you could avoid if all this information in this thread is being provided (in some form) on the Indiegogo. To think that everyone else have the same knowledge as you is not a nice way of doing business, at least in my opinion.

@bryanandaimee:

Thanks, if you go check out our indiegogo campaign, you'll see I pretty much copied and pasted your sentence

"We are using parallel port based electronics compatible with more conventional CNC software like Mach3 or EMC2. So if you want to use the reprap created software, get the $100 parts kit and use any of the great reprap created electronics platforms, but if you're a CNCer like us then get the full kit and print using your favorite CNC software. "

Also, you're spot on! We are geared more towards a guy who has/wants to do more with CNC control, and USB connections aren't it. We have millions in CNC's and not one USB connection anywhere. Coincidence? Now, the few times a USB--->serial adapter has been tried, I myself have made up 4 letter words!


@Malx:

No harm No foul bud, I totally support other people looking at it and helping us see it from a different perspective. I'd LOVE for someone to take our hardware kit and get it running with an arduino. I'm a little embarassed to admit publicly here, but we actually have an ultimaker RAMPS setup, but couldn't figure out how to work it in one night, so we downloaded mach3 and started printing that night! Is it perfect? No, Is reprap based software? No. I love the abilities that an arduino based controller has, like printing from SD (that's just flat out awesome) However, you have SOOOO much more control over all aspects of your machine with a mach3 install. Not to mention, you can have a 3D pritner, a CNC mill, CNC lathe, CNC wire EDM, CNC plasma cutter, CNC laser cutter ALL running the same user interface. Talk about easy to remember which button does what.


We're not software guys, we're hardware guys. We really didn't want to do the electronics all that much. But, we thought it would help to supply what we know we could provide support for.

Thanks again all you guys,

John "oly"

@Johnoly99
A small change that made a great improvement, thanks!

I'm still interested on how you use those CNC softwares to make the prints. (Not negative in any way, just real interest). But I suggest to put that in a separate thread since I made this thread go out of subject, sorry 3ders!

I learned a lot from your discussion.

OK sorry for the detour, here are a couple more I didn't see on your list

sumpod.com though I'm not sure how long it will take to fill orders from the three initial indegogo campaigns and start selling from the web site or what the price will be.

[reprappro.com] though now that they are done with the indiegogo campaign you may only be able to buy wholesale lots of 10 or more from them now.

[www.solidoodle.com]

bryanandaimee: Many thanks. I have added, will update from time to time.

I have also added a new one: Felix 1.0 kit. speical price now €799, around $1,070

Hey, thanks for doing all that market research!

Here is a newcomer to the scene: www.makemendel.com. They are out of India. I am considering buying an Orca kit from them, but would like to know if anyone has dealt with them before(?)

Thanks,
David

@malx

mach3 takes gcode and does what the gcode tells it to do. skeinforge generates gcode. mach3 takes the extruder commands as just another black box "axis". put them together an bobs your uncle.

the arduino electronics are also taking gcode commands as well. the difference is the gcode decoding happens on the board whereas for mach3 +parallel the gcode decoding happens on the computer and only ouput stepper drive pulses via direct manipulation of the parallel port.

I would like to point out that mach3 does SOOOO much more than that. Does arduino have a VGA display, that you can see in realtime what all (up to six) axes are doing, movement, position, speed etc..? Mach can also generate some basic 2D toolpaths right in the software itself! Take that, and some good gcode skills, and make a 2D print build UP with a subroutine called program.

How are you controlling the extruder temp?

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www.Fablicator.com