VIDEO POSTED! Details about the BerryBot3D

I also am using a modified qu-bd. I have the nozzle, heater block and m6 ss ferrule from the kit. I then made the large heat sink on my friends lathe out of 1 1/4 round stock and drilled all the way through it and taped it with a m6 tap. When threaded on the ss ferrule there was still 10mm of the ferrule sticking out the top. I made a smaller piece from 7/8 round bar with the bottom tapped for m6 to accept the top of the ferrule ands the top tapped for m5 for a push to connect fitting for the 4mm OD hose for the Bowden tube, both from McMaster. I reused the delrin block from the kit also mounting it on a 5:1 Nema 17 as per Werner's recommendation. It required a little modification to take a mk7 drive gear, I'm using a trinity labs which is available in a 8mm bore which means no modification of the drive shaft or pulley. I have both the black and silver and the black seems to be a little nicer. I also have the maker farm drive gear which isn't quite a nice in my opinion, it has a flatter curve more suited for 3mm filament . I drilled and tapped the delrin to accept the other push to connect fitting. There is a 1/4-20 hole which I dropped a 3/16 ball bearing and spring in and used a thumb screw to press the filament into the drive gear. I wouldn't say it's ideal but it's good enough to get up and printing. I'm still dialing in the long Bowden tube (~1m) for higher speeds but I can get some nice prints at 50-60mm/s perimeters

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2013 03:04PM by natecampbell.

Worm extruder in action on youtube

Hi Werner,

How's progress on the dissemination of Berrybot info, helping us to fill the world with perfectly formed clones of the wonderful machine, and also more info on that interesting looking rocket? What filament do you think will be needed for a 3D printed warp drive? Has it reached escape velocity yet?

Details on either, or both please.......Whenever you can tear yourself away from the play bench

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/10/2013 03:08PM by silverbrewer.

Werner,

Just wanted to say a huge thanks to you for sharing your entire build process. I'm about to start building a relatively simple little delta with a simple goal - low cost and locally sourced parts where possible.

I think I may have just decided what I'll be building after the delta. A new, big shed. Shortly followed by all sorts of awesome toys such as a CNC! I get the feeling you've inspired me into a new life-long hobby!

im not sure if this has been brought up yet but logically a delta printer would be one of the ideal setups for hexagonal infill, because of the way the axis' are configured.

also a sort of interesting though ive had is if you had a delta setup, and you link all three carriages together with one belt, you only need two motors to control the x and y position of the head, and the head always remains on the same plane, the third motor is then simply used to change the length of the belt, or leave the belt the same and move the platform up or down. the advantage of this is that you control the z axis seperate from the x and y axis, and you can get more z steps then.

What happened to the video??

All Werner's videos are on YouTube...just search for "BerryBot3D"

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Rad Racer
All Werner's videos are on YouTube...just search for "BerryBot3D"

Correct, although it seems that two videos have been deleted. I was looking for the video with a more detailed overview of the berrybot unit. Something more helpful towards building one, in addition to the information already posted here.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2014 09:56PM by Ketchup.

if anything give him thumbs up in youtube, and thank him for his videos. they are well produced, edited, and professional. I'd actually like to see more videos!!



thanks Werner!!

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jamesdanielv
if anything give him thumbs up in youtube, and thank him for his videos. they are well produced, edited, and professional. I'd actually like to see more videos!!
thanks Werner!!

Me too

More videos, Werner! You have so much to teach us!

Eric

12 videos shown....I believe that is all he has produced.

First and foremost thank you for sharing your innovative upgrades to the Delta design.

You have built a beautiful machine, Werner.

I was wondering if it is possible to upgrade this current design to utilize the E3D Kraken 4-nozzle hotend for mutiple material/color printing?

Also, if one was to scale up the BerryBot design to have a build envelop of 18"x24" (DxH) what would need to change besides the print surface and longer pillars? Lastly, is there a difference between using T-Slot versus V-Slot extrusions for the pillars?

Again, thanks for sharing your innovations and designs with the community. Looking forward to building one of these badboys myself someday.

Hi Guys, I am in the process of designing/building a new shop for myself and it is consuming all of my time. I am thinking it should be done sometime around June if I am lucky. It is so much fun designing where equipment should be placed, how to run, electrical, air and dust vacuum lines……. NewKid, sure you can run the E3D no problem!! Scaling the BerryBot3D to 24” circle should also not be a problem using the all the same components. By T-Slot I think you are talking about OpenBuild extrusions-linear system? I love OpenBuild components. I am building a special use CNC router type machine with all OpenBuild for the linear parts.
Thanks again for the nice comments Guys! I hope to have another fun video up soon talking about designing and processing parts to be 3D printed, Also talk about a new plugin I wrote called the Berry Nice Start to get a great first layer down.
Happy Building and Printing!
Werner

I just recently stumbled on Mr. Berry's delta design. I make things for a living and I am thoroughly encouraged by the clever ideas. I just dig the heck out of this stuff.

Who knows if I'll ever build one, but I did build an Ord bot a while back and just recently dug it back out to blow off the dust and attempt to tweak it for success. I think it's very possible that I will eventually steal Werner's ideas and make one for myself. I usually add a few ideas of my own, but this one is already so well thought out that I don't see any obvious things to change or add.

I did order up some magnets though because even if I don't use them on a printer, magnets bring out the child in me and they are just plain fun to fiddle with. Just to illustrate the strength of these little bad boys, here's a picture I snapped earlier. Just for reference, I have huge hands so these things dangling from a magnet force through my finger is no small feat. Very impressive little buggers. The stack isn't just barely hanging on either - I can move my arm around freely and they stay there pretty firm.


I also received a couple 5:1 gear steppers today. Excellent solution for the extruder feed and several other applications as well. I've been fiddling here and there with stepper motors for probably close to ten years and I am embarrassed to admit I wasn't aware before a couple weeks ago that geared steppers existed. Obvious now of course, and at least I finally learned myself about them. I'm looking forward to playing with these and seeing what I can make them do.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/25/2014 09:44PM by vinny.

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vinny
I did order up some magnets though because even if I don't use them on a printer, magnets bring out the child in me and they are just plain fun to fiddle with. Just to illustrate the strength of these little bad boys, here's a picture I snapped earlier. Just for reference, I have huge hands so these things dangling from a magnet force through my finger is no small feat. Very impressive little buggers. The stack isn't just barely hanging on either - I can move my arm around freely and they stay there pretty firm.

mag.jpg

I also received a couple 5:1 gear steppers today. Excellent solution for the extruder feed and several other applications as well. I've been fiddling here and there with stepper motors for probably close to ten years and I am embarrassed to admit I wasn't aware before a couple weeks ago that geared steppers existed. Obvious now of course, and at least I finally learned myself about them. I'm looking forward to playing with these and seeing what I can make them do.

Vinny: Where did you purchase your magnets from (they look super strong), and with regards to geare- stepper motors, does a bigger differential difference mean better for filament extruder (ie, 10:1 > 5:1)?

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NewKidOnTheBlock

Vinny: Where did you purchase your magnets from (they look super strong), and with regards to geare- stepper motors, does a bigger differential difference mean better for filament extruder (ie, 10:1 > 5:1)?

There is a trade off between torque and speed. I think vinny is talking about the 5:1 geared Nema 11 steppers that Werner uses for his direct drive 1.75mm extruder. In this case, the 5:1 ratio gives the right balance between torque and speed. A 10:1 ratio would give better torque (more extrusion force) but the max speed would decrease. You just have to find the right balance between torque and speed that suits your application.

For a direct drive extruder, a 5:1 geared Nema 11 stepper seems like the perfect match

Eric

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RP Iron Man

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NewKidOnTheBlock

Vinny: Where did you purchase your magnets from (they look super strong), and with regards to geare- stepper motors, does a bigger differential difference mean better for filament extruder (ie, 10:1 > 5:1)?

There is a trade off between torque and speed. I think vinny is talking about the 5:1 geared Nema 11 steppers that Werner uses for his direct drive 1.75mm extruder. In this case, the 5:1 ratio gives the right balance between torque and speed. A 10:1 ratio would give better torque (more extrusion force) but the max speed would decrease. You just have to find the right balance between torque and speed that suits your application.

For a direct drive extruder, a 5:1 geared Nema 11 stepper seems like the perfect match

Eric

Eric: What would be the proper differential for a geared-stepper motor if it is to be applied to a bowden-style extruder? Would NEMA11's still be enough or would 14's or maybe even 17's be better? Distance from the filament extruder to the actual hot-end would be about 4.5' - 5' long.

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NewKidOnTheBlock

Eric: What would be the proper differential for a geared-stepper motor if it is to be applied to a bowden-style extruder? Would NEMA11's still be enough or would 14's or maybe even 17's be better? Distance from the filament extruder to the actual hot-end would be about 4.5' - 5' long.

Hey New, I assume that you plan on using this bowden extruder on the huge BerryBot printer that you were talking about building, am I right?

Since you said that the distance fro the extruder to the hot end would be about 4.5' to 5' long I really don't think that you should use a bowden extruder. In a bowden cable that long the hysteresis would likely lead to miserable print quality. Since you are going to build a large machine, I recommend that you stick with a direct drive extruder like Werner Berry's that uses a 5:1 geared Nema 11 stepper. The geared Nema 11 is not very heavy and on a large deltabot the added moving mass would not be a problem. Plus, using a direct drive extruder will save you the infinite headache of trying to calibrate a 5' bowden cable

Werner reported great results using his new compact direct drive extruder. You should also check out his videos on his YouTube channel as I think they will really help you with your build.

Here is the link: [www.youtube.com]

Good Luck!

Eric

I agree with Eric I think. I can't be sure since I've never had a Bowden extruder and in fact I'm barely scratching the surface with my one printer build as it is, but it seems like the hysteresis would be an issue.

Regarding steppers, the 5:1 ratio is similar to the gear ratios folks are getting with their printed gear set drive systems (i.e. Wades extruder), so it seems just right. 10:1 might work but would be on the extreme end and is well outside the envelope of the successful Wades extruder ratios, so unless you are already getting good results as a beginner, then reserve that kind of experimentation for a later theory or something. Anything beyond that, and maybe within that even, will have the torque but not the speed necessary to reliably do filament retracting and un-retracting. And on a Bowden type, you really need some speed to deal with the hysteresis I think.
My direct drive 1:1 cold end doesn't seem to have any problems pushing filament (though I have a few other unrelated problems) with a NEMA 17 stepper. A gear stepper will have more torque than direct drive so I would confidently try a much smaller frame gear reduction stepper if I had the desire. I'd be tempted to even try a NEMA 8 if it helps to bring down weight on a non-Bowden (direct) system. Note that the driver board makes quite a difference on how well the motors perform. For example I have a little CNC engraver I built and at first I tried a cheap 3-axis stepper driver board off eBay. It kind of worked, but didn't have much torque and had other little issues, and after a while it just seemed to get worse so I replaced it with a Gecko driver and that made the first board look horrible in comparison. I have a ramps board & the little Pololu drivers for my 3D printer and it seems to work OK with my NEMA 17 steppers. I haven't done any systematic testing or anything because it seems to work fine so I don't know how it would compare to a Gecko drive, but I suspect it's probably somewhere in-between. It's adequate for the purpose. Just some FYI.
edit to add: I like the idea of the gear reduction for more precision on feeding filament. I'm not sure if that matters significantly compared to variations in filament diameter through a spool, even though my spools seem pretty decent on roundness and diameter. But a gear reduction seems like it would have to perform better. My 1:1 extruder drive spins so slowly it is pretty much holding torque most of it's time. I think it would be better if the motor actually spun a bit.

Regarding the magnets, I got them from magnet4less.com for about $2.50 each. Amazing Magnets has them for about the same price.
I don't know Gauss from guess so I can't offer any learned opinions about magnet specs.. But I would think any of these Neodymium magnets will have similar strength and be just as effective.

On a side note of my own, I made a list of the stuff I need to aquire to pull off building one of these printers. I'm also considering a lithographic/resin system for the higher resolution. So I'm still weighing which direction I want to send my efforts and time. I'm a cheap bastage though so I imagine in the end I'll probably build a BerryBot of my own since it will be 1/10 the cost of a resin printer. I'll probably wait for new ideas and plans on resin printers to evolve so the price comes down to a more reasonable point. They've come a long way up in quality and down in cost over the past couple years and I'm guessing that trend will continue pretty dramatically over the next couple years.

edit to add: I got to digging in my pile o' stuff and I think my decision just became easier. I built my printer about a year and a half ago and bought enough to make three because some friends thought they might want one too and making three is just a little tougher than making one (setup is most of the battle). Well their interest faded. So I just found that I have 10-feet of maker slide and plenty of V-roller kits. I was just looking up that stuff on instructables's page and vaguely remembered maybe having the rollers so decided to review my inventory. That sure makes things cheaper. I also have plenty of regular NEMA 17 steppers for the positioning, some adequate 3/8 o.d. tubing and the magnets and geared steppers I just bought, so my major remaining components are hot and cold ends (probably machine myself), electronics, plates and stuff (definitely machine myself), and... uhhhh... that's just about it isn't it? Looks like I might get this going with less than $100 more investment. Kind of a no-brainer.
Hoarding pays off again.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2014 11:29PM by vinny.

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I also have a new design using high precision linear bearings that is very high-end nice. I have an opportunity to sell quite a few BerryBot3D’s and my business partners suggested that I pull the design videos until I have decided if I want to jump into it. Since you Guys had already seen them I didn’t think it would be a big deal to pull them. The videos hit 15K views so fast I figured everyone and there whole family had already watched them. Just PM me if you are really stuck about something and I will help you out assuming there aren’t thousands of you. Haha…..

Are you going closed source, then?

Hi

My magnets arrived two days ago from www.supermagnete.com
They're awesome!

Regarding geared stepper, I've been considering to order a NEMA14 5:1 [www.omc-stepperonline.com]
instead of NEMA11 5:1 [www.omc-stepperonline.com]
Both have same declared weight but the second one is slightly shorter that might be better for the mass balance of the end effector. (Not sure if it matters so much)
It is cheaper and has a lot of more torque (more electrical consumption also)
Cons are that the mounting dimensions are not the same.
What do you think?

Regards

If you're doing a bowden drive then the mass nor bulk of the stepper should make much difference either way. If you're going with direct drive then any weight savings would be better, though I don't think size difference would be significant enough to make much difference.

One wrinkle with steppers is the electrical specs make a difference and need to be suited to the driver. I'm just guessing but I would think most steppers in the range we're dealing with would probably work with the standard drivers.

Regarding the mount size difference, I think you will be facing that regardless of the geared stepper you use. I bought two different NEMA 17 versions and while they both have a similar mount pattern, they are quite different from a direct drive NEMA 17 mount pattern. It shouldn't be too big a feat to adapt things to match. If it is a big deal, then find a friend or neighbor who is skilled in that field to help. They will be a helpful future asset to have in your arsenal anyway.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2014 12:33PM by vinny.

At what point does hysteresis not become a factor when using a bowden style filament extruder?

Werner: Could you please list the vitamins that are required to build a BerryBot?

Hi
I was thinking how to make the bowden shorter without loading too much the print head. I really don`t know how bad it is with hysteresys because I am just designing a berrybot style printer, so I have no experience yet. Just an idea - another stepper could move the extruder in Z axis... not sure if the firmware would support this. This way the bowden could be shorter. Just an idea...

Hey Werner,

I was wondering about what you have been working on over the past few months?

It's been a while since you last posted a video. Any further news/developments with the BerryBot3D? A while ago you mentioned starting a Google Group for people who want to build their own BerryBot. I am looking to build a delta bot and I really want to build a BerryBot3D It would be great if you could let us know what you are up to!

I am a big fan of your work

Thanks,
Eric

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I designed the Prometheus V2 Customizable All-Metal Hot End. Buy online
Prometheus Hot End discussion thread

I have been a fan of the BerryBot3D for quite a wile and like Werner I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I thought that I would share this with you which could help to simplify construction and enhance tolerances at the expense of cost.

Check out these bad boy magnetic ball joints and look at their power [www.frenergy.com.au] up to 20Kg holding force that's 44Lbs

I have been strongly inspired by Werner`s printer so I decided to design a clone of BB myself. I am waiting now the alu parts to be cut and see how they fit together. Instead of welding I will use L-shaped alu extrusions to bolt the parts together. The picture is a render of the project, not a photo ... and there is a lot of things missing because I am too lazy to instert bolts etc...

That is impressive! What software did you use and how did you get the LCD read out to look so real?

The LCD screen is just a screenshot I found somewhere on the web, and is applied as texture on the LCD face... with no other special treatment...
All is done in solidworks.

My silicone platen heater has arrived from China... these guys can make anything! The heater is 2mm thick, 350mm diameter, 230V/340 Watts, costed 51,50$ inclusive DHL shippment! Should make 140°C easily. I will see how long it will survive, but the quality looks pretty good.