which printer?

Hello everyone,

For roughly the last 7 years I have been completely facinated by the idea of 3d printing, but very quick searches turned up machines that were obviously for industry in the >$10 k range. Until a friend of mine told me about reprap a few weeks ago.
What a brilliant comunity of people!

I am really interested in getting a 3d printer, but i just dont know where to put my investment. I am a student of ME, so i am not affraid to assemble the mechanical parts of the machine, but have almost zero knowledge about electronics/coding. I am completely willing to learn, but at the same time, do not want hundreds of dollars worth of hardware/software that I can't figure out how to use. What is the learning curve here?

I will be getting an FDM machine soon, but need some expert advice. Should I build a printer (the 2 I'm considering are the printrbot LC and the mendel) or just buy a functioning makerbot/cube printer?
I like the idea of building and maintaning these amazing machines, but I feel like the more mainstream companies offer a product that is more reliable. Is this true? or just their marketing hype?
I realize this is not a perfect technology, but I still don't want to feel like I am spending more time fixing the machine than using it, and I'm willing to shell out a little extra money for this.

[makemendel.com]

Its a pretty good price and they ship fast. (I got mine 4 days after payment cleared) The only downside is their customer service sucks, it could partly be due to the language barrier.

If you get this printer you will want to do some upgrades right from the start.

First get a PCB heated print bed, a piece of glass, and some binder clips. The heated print bed that the printer comes with only gets up to about 45c so its not hot enough to keep ABS from warping.

Second get a new J-head, or J-head compatible hotend. There are some all metal options available for around $50 or $60 but if your not going to be printing nylon or polycarbonate then a MK4 or MK5 J-head will suffice. The one that comes with it is a MK1 or MK2 J-head and it jams often unless it has a fan pointed at it.

The big thing that sets this printer off from all of the other prebuilt models is that there is no lead time. No need to wait a month or 2 to get your printer. I did alot of shopping b4 I bought my new printer and all but this one had a lead time.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/04/2013 01:19AM by hendo420.

There are lots of options for 3d printers. Yu can build your own from the parts or buy from builders, resellers, and manufactures. Most of the commercial ones are just expensive versions of the same thing you can build yourself, with so e tweaks thrown in that could be good or bad. For instance the replicator 2 has a nice look, display, sd card slot so you can just save your file on it, put it in the printer, select and print not needing the computer. The downside is no heated bed, so PLA is about the only thing you can print reliable. There is Solidoodle, but support and customer service (especially getting the machine) is a pain. There are the Cube line, which is easy to use but requires their software (included) and special filament cartridges which are more money. Then there are the gang of companies (mostly start ups) that basically just take open source designs and tweak and sell kits. I picked the Lulzbot AO-101 because of the policies, 30 day return, 90 day warrantee, and 1 year support. It is basically a MendalMax with some changes, mainly a different hotend and electronics. It also came with a large amount of filemant, tools, printed manual, etc. got it in less than a week, they have them in stock and ship within a couple days, usually the next day.

If you buy a pre-built machine most are not too cheap, over a $1,000 for good ones with reasonable shipping times. Some of the smaller startups can take 8-10 weeks and trust me, you cannot wait that long once you decided to get one and pay the money.

Look around the Internet and forums and see which one offers you what you want and has good support and community, most of the parts are the same.

Thanks for all the input.
I had not heard of the lulzbot, so now i am leaning toward that due to the fact that they are open hardware/software and are based in colorado, my home.
Are there people on this forum that are running these who would be able to lend support if needed?
How upgradable is this machine? i notice that the print area is 200x190x100, can the z-axis be increased? 100mm doesnt seem very high.

hendo420 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> [makemendel.com]
>
> Its a pretty good price and they ship fast. (I got
> mine 4 days after payment cleared) The only
> downside is their customer service sucks, it could
> partly be due to the language barrier.
>
> If you get this printer you will want to do some
> upgrades right from the start.
>
> First get a PCB heated print bed, a piece of
> glass, and some binder clips. The heated print bed
> that the printer comes with only gets up to about
> 45c so its not hot enough to keep ABS from
> warping.
>
> Second get a new J-head, or J-head compatible
> hotend. There are some all metal options available
> for around $50 or $60 but if your not going to be
> printing nylon or polycarbonate then a MK4 or MK5
> J-head will suffice. The one that comes with it is
> a MK1 or MK2 J-head and it jams often unless it
> has a fan pointed at it.
>
> The big thing that sets this printer off from all
> of the other prebuilt models is that there is no
> lead time. No need to wait a month or 2 to get
> your printer. I did alot of shopping b4 I
> bought my new printer and all but this one had a
> lead time.


To be honest, if you need to upgrade the printer right away you probable end up with a lead time on those parts besides the added costs

nickw Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks for all the input.
> I had not heard of the lulzbot, so now i am
> leaning toward that due to the fact that they are
> open hardware/software and are based in colorado,
> my home.
> Are there people on this forum that are running
> these who would be able to lend support if
> needed?
> How upgradable is this machine? i notice that the
> print area is 200x190x100, can the z-axis be
> increased? 100mm doesnt seem very high.

If you want a higher build area you might want to take a look at Nopheads Mendel90 (http://forums.reprap.org/read.php?94,196585) It has a 200x200x200 build area, comes with a J-head MK5B and a good heatbed. Imo one of the more balanced kits at the moment.

if u want to build ur own printer then go ahead and start wit hthe prusa mendel i2.. its well supported - documented and easy to do it yourself!
also the price is slightly lower than other options.. u can prolly get all the stuff needed for that for around 550$.

Lulzbot released his new version TK0, i think it has a buld area of 30x30x22.50 which is awesome! lulzbot like u said is an open source printer which makes it awesome-er
[devel.lulzbot.com]

anyways.. if u want to save some cash and have more fun.. i would recommended building ur own printer

You can build your own if you want. Lulzbot has the TK-0 coming out sometime that has a larger print area. They also release all the build of materials and STLs for their machine so you can build your own if you want.

If you build your own you will learn the working of the printer a little better but you will have to know electronics, building, programming, etc. I didn't feel comfortably building my own, at least my 1st one. I will probably build my next one.

I totally understand what you are saying about building my own printer, and it would be nice to know all the detailed inner workings of the thing, but I am very intimidated by the idea of doing the electronics work. Especialy the coding/uploading firmware aspect. I have worked on computer hardware before, but that is just unplug old, plug in new and not much else.
I know its best to build it, but as I said before, I dont want to get stuck and have wasted time and money.

everything is based arduino..
and arduino is one of the easiest things around even for beginners... anyways its all up to you!

Nick,

the electronics really aren't that bad. You'll probably wind up with a RAMPS or RAMB0 board, both of which are plug and play. The firmware can be a little challenging at first, but is gets easy fast. And don't worry about support - between the forums and IRC someone will be around to help you out.

As far as machines go you really can't go wrong with a mendel90 - inexpensive and rock-solid. Lulzbot is great too, I order stuff from them and haven't had a bad experience yet.

Since you're a ME student do you have access to a 3D printer at one of your university labs? If not maybe you can parlay building one into a grant or something - get some experience building it for the ME department to use then use it to print your own larger machine. Everyone wins.

Honestly a Prusa i2 would be a great, inexpensive entry point if you were going to source it all yourself.

---

- akhlut

Just remember - Iterate, Iterate, Iterate!

[myhomelessmind.blogspot.com]

Thank you for the advice.
We do have a 3d printer at the university, but it is not the easiest thing to get use of. I love the idea of getting the ME department to pay for me to do this, and actually plan to go talk to the department people on monday to see if thats possible.
One more question, and then I will stop noobing up this thread and get started.
Where can I order a complete prusa kit? I have found reprappro.com for the mendel, but cant seem to find a source for a prusa kit.

thats because all the ones selling the prusa mendels are actually selling their own "design" so its called differently.. very few call it "Prusa mendel" - but they are all the same - but differ slightly in size.

nickw - do you have gmail chat? if you do then add me ybadran@gmail.com (send me an email first so i know its u) - I have finished building my prusa mendel i2 not long ago and the biggest problem i have found at first was that there is no proper manual and BOM.. what i mean is like this: everyone tells u to get smooth rods of lengthes X, but then in the manual they ask u to use rods of different lengthes - so things are messed up in that matter.

If you like - contact me and i will send you a proper manual with a proper BOM - buying all the parts will require u to contact 2-3 sellers, its better than buying the whole kit as u will also save around 150$ maybe even more..

If you like, msg me, and ill be happy to help!

-Joe