Taulman T-Glase

New material available for pre order from Taulman: [www.taulman3d.com]

Sounds very interesting. Low printing temp, high strength and rigidity, food safe, high clarity, low shrinkage. I like their T618 and T645 a lot so I ordered a spool of this to try.

$59.90 Shipping.... Okay, well, since I am not a big buyer.. this is nothing for me, sad enough
Damn, I really want to try this out!

Btw I can't find out how much kg is on one spool. $30 seems doable, so I'm going to ask friends if they want to buy in a group and split the shipping cost.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2013 07:12PM by Ohmarinus.

i would love to try that stuff it looks very interesting.

but then i saw the shipping rates, i am in canada and i would get 20 back, and it is still painful.

please companies look into more options for international shipping.

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[mike-mack.blogspot.com]

It doesn't seem to say anywhere on the page how much is on the spool, but the label on the spool in the photo on the order page says 1 pound.

thats a good point i never caught that one.

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[mike-mack.blogspot.com]

The home page lists it as $30 for a 1 lb spool. Here I thought $11.30 was kinda high for US shipping. Those international rates are terrible. IIRC they have some distributors overseas that should be better for shipping but I expect they won't get the newest stuff right away.

i would think they have lost more than a few orders because of those shipping rates.

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[mike-mack.blogspot.com]

They obviously don't wanna sell it!

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_______________________________________
Waitaki 3D Printer

Ah, yes I was looking at the 3mm order page (since I'm printing with 3mm haha)

I will send them an email, if they offer discount for buying a certain quantity and are able to use another shipping company to keep the shipping cost down, then maybe we'll try it. With the current pricing and shipping cost it's very hard to find others who want to buy the filament with me and mind you, we also have to pay high taxes when something is shipped from the US to the Netherlands...

And I thought we all lived on 'one world', well, it's not, we have imaginary borders, taxes and other problems


I have calculated the price in euros what it would cost us to buy 10 rolls in the Netherlands.
This will be around 350 euros or in dollars: $469.83 dollars.

You can imagine that 10x30 is 300. So, an additional 169 dollars are added if we order ten rolls.

Which basically s*cks really bad. I hate the world.

Edit:
Also, turns out the shipping cost is only for max 6 rolls, above that you have to pay extra. So it is completely not doable for us here. Forget about it.


extent Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It doesn't seem to say anywhere on the page how
> much is on the spool, but the label on the spool
> in the photo on the order page says 1 pound.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2013 11:04AM by Ohmarinus.

I was thinking of ordering some too to test, but when I can get free or $5 shipping on a 2.2lb roll, couldn't see paying almost triple that.

FWIW, if you click on the buy 618 or buy 645 pages, at the top is a list of resellers. Quite a few are in the EU and one is in Canada. For folks in those areas, I'd contact a reseller about availability.

We have already been contacting them, thanks for the advice though.

For the two resellers and one new vendor, they all let us know that even for them it is too expensive to buy it as-is, so they have contacted Taulman if there is a solution for shipping cost.




drawcut Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FWIW, if you click on the buy 618 or buy 645
> pages, at the top is a list of resellers. Quite a
> few are in the EU and one is in Canada. For folks
> in those areas, I'd contact a reseller about
> availability.

I really wanna try some of this but I can't get past the shipping price either

I ship products all over the world and I can tell you that it's all linked to oil prices for fuel and yes it's getting so that many times the shipping is close to or greater than the cost of the item being shipped.

I needed some small transformers from China they sell for $3.80 but after shipping 100pc the end cost was $8.25ea. Almost $5 each just in shipping.

USPS is the cheapest other than by sea freight and I am pretty sure Taulman uses USPS Priority Mail.

I just ordered some, looks like it is pre-order (the site sort of hinted at that). I didn't see an expected ship date so I emailed to get some idea as there are no dates on any of the postings on the site. I got a reply back within 30 minutes, looks like my 3mm T-glase will be shipping next week. Yay!

International shipping can be very tricky. I occasionally ship from the US to Canada and the EU. USPS global priority is actually a fairly good deal but no tracking once it leaves the US, and to get decent rates you need some software (paid) that provides wholesale rates.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/13/2013 08:45PM by papergeek.

For all of you who live in Europe, there is a PET filament available: plastic2print
I have tried this product out, but to my surprise, it was rather brittle and I could extrude it at 170°C already (while the melting temperature should be at 270°C according to Wikipedia). Also, I couldn't get it to go into semi-crystalline configuration although the base of the prints was kept hot at >=60°C.
Guess this is a blend that differs from engineering grade PET since the PET sample rod I bought from a plastics vendor is nearly indestructible.
The optical properties are outstanding, though. A single, flat layer behaves much like glass and I thought that a solid layer was missing at the top or bottom of the print until I noticed the fine boundary lines of the extrusion.

To all on the topic of shipping costs... First, everyone's complaint is similar to ours! Actually, you're all much kinder than we are to the shippers..!
Your concerns, however: are being addressed. But rather than just a "we'll fix it blurb that doesn't sit well with the technically savey" an explaination.
1. We have only been shipping for 8 months. Other great reprap component and line resellers have been online for years and have built up discounts.
2. When we started, most carriers laughed at us, even though we had "probable volume"...it was "come see us when you can prove it"
3. Most of our customers want a trkg#. While the carriers say it's free......it's only free on a certain "rate of parcel"....anything less and no trkg #.
4. On starting taulman3D, we opted to go trkg # as we wanted to make sure customers got product. "We assume everything will go wrong".
So....that said, here's what's happening:
1. We sent a shipping log of over 6,000 shipping purchases (and that was just a sample) to the ups folks...
2. Nothing get's their attention more than the loss of 6,000 payments....! This falls into that "prove it" catagory.
3. And it actually worked..! In three days, we not only got a bunch of "how can we help" emails, but we were assigned our own local ups rep.....actually 2 of em
4. The UPS reps are now working out rates to all corners of the world for us. They need one last bit of info and that's the spool and box size for our new 3mm t-glase.
5. 3mm t-glase is scheduled for main run in the mfg plant 9/16. This Monday.
6. We would like to use our standard spool as it is small and helps keep shipping down when ppl order multiple spools.
7. If we can't use the current spool, we will ship as noted on the site...a "wrap' untill the new spool arives... note....we don't like that either...
8. A new larger spool is in tooling, but not available for 3-4 weeks or so.
9. All that said....when we determine how 3mm t-glase ships, we give that to the UPS ppl and shipping discounts are applied, and boom....you get a decent rate w/tracking #..... Can't come soon enough for us either..!

Always check our list of resellers....we have resellers all over the world.

Next....weight... Nylon is lighter than ABS/PLA. with 1 pound of 1.75mm 618, you get almost 500' and ~200' in 3mm
While we have been asked about 2.2lbs, it's not often at all. So, please don't hesitate to drop us a comment on the site.
We take every one of em like you would! Actually, I came here today as someone mentioned it to us...!
Thanks to everyone!
Tom

Tom,
I'm a bit late to this topic but the subject caught my eye. I am already printing with your 618 filament, and would love to try the t-glase just like everyone else. As a U.S. buyer, I have one simple question. Why couldn't you ship 1lb wraps or spools via USPS Priority mail? The 1lb wrap of 618 that I have would easily fit in a 9.5"x12.5" Padded Priority Flat Rate envelope and would ship for $5.95 with a tracking number included. Their online rate is actually $5.70, and they'll supply the envelopes for you. It wouldn't surprise me if there were additional volume discounts available as well.

To take it a step further, I think that the $41.30 it would cost me to get 1lb of t-glase is just far too much. It's just too much of an investment to play with 1lb as a novelty, especially knowing that I've printed yards and yards of 618 just getting all of my settings dialed-in. Obviously the shipping break helps when you're ordering multiple rolls, but $71.30 is still hard to swallow for just 2lbs of material when I can get twice as much high-quality ABS or PLA for the same rate. I can't speak for anyone else but I feel like a price of $50-$55 for a 2.2lb spool, with shipping included, would make it much more attractive. Right now, I would only buy it if I needed it for a very specific application where no other filament would work.

I'm certainly not trying to beat you up, but I hope that you can appreciate my perspective. I've browsed your website many times looking at the 645 and t-glase, but I have stopped short of pulling the trigger every time because of the cost. It's nice to see that you've taken the time to reply in the forum, and I hope that you can sell enough volume to eventually reduce the price.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/15/2013 11:26AM by stonedcoldskier.

No problem as I fully "get it". There are some other events coming shortly that will also help us reduce the base costs of Nylon.
While I can't get into the facts here, I only ask that you realize we're a constantly transitioning development organization. Simply put, when we get a discount, on either our raw materials or mfg cost, we transition that discount to the community. You will start to see this in Oct when we hit chemical tiers.
Next is a standard check-out store. while we would all like to think that these are a "go do", we found that the newer stores are collecting more info than needed to simply process a CC buy. And that some have jumped on the "sell purchasing info" wagon. In additon to their CC processing. Nothing miffs us more than to go to a site, buy a product and get asked a zillion ?'s just to buy a widget. We will be rebuilding the site over the next few weeks to add a easy chk-out with new prices and rates for shipping.
Tom

Thanks for stopping in, Tom. Good to hear that shipping rates are being worked on. I'm waiting for some 3mm T-glase, a couple of ?s while I wait...

Does T-glase need drying, if so, how much?

What surfaces are best for printing on? (Several are listed but with no ranking, is heat needed, etc.)

When you say 'wrap' I assume that is a loose coil of filament and not the earlier 'clamshell' container that you had? I just put together a coil 'spool' for my printer and if that works well I might end up preferring the unspooled filament. Any chance you may offer this as an option? Might help cost / shipping.

Thanks,
Scott

Scott,

I just got some t-glase a week or so ago. No drying needed. Unlike Nylon, PETT isn't hygroscopic.

Taulman recommends heated bed (60C).

I tried 60 and it didn't seem to have the adhesion that I wanted. Bumped it up to 70C and it sticks pretty well. I had a tricky print with a small footprint, and some hairspray on a heated bed worked wonders for adhesion.

Definitely a cool filament, but it's a little tricky to dial in the settings. Pretty different than ABS/PLA. Similar in ways to Nylon, but it's got some differences.

I recommend trying Kapton tape + glue stick as print surface. It works very well for the PET I got from plastic2print (FormFutura seems to be selling the same filament) and PLA. As PLA and PET are rather similar in properties apparently, techniques to get one material to stick are sort of transferable.
There are some differences in glue stick performance: UHU brand holds the parts extremely well, PLA has to be rather forcefully broken/chiselled off. Tombow's glue stick holds parts well at >=60°C and releases them when cooled to ~40°C. The surface is re-usable multiple times while the UHU one has to be re-applied before every print.

Cope413,

Thanks for the info. Once I get my filament, we'll have to compare notes.

ETA: Ugen - we're typing at the same time. I've been experimenting a bit with glue stick and ABS - very promising. I'll definitely try some with PET as well. I'd love to find a setup that works with a cold bed. I've modded my printer to a 6 x ~10" bed but I only have a 6 x 8" bed heater so the extra length is strictly for Nylon so far.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2013 06:12PM by drawcut.

I see the recommendation to dry T-glase at 50-60C for 12 hours or more before use.

I'm in Southern California which usually has low humidity (less than 50%, sometimes lower in summer) except for rainy periods (usually in winter). I've been trying to figure out some guidelines for storing and using nylon-6 in general and I hear recommendations such as using slight heat from a small lightbulb to keep the material dry, but I can't find anything about what relative humidity levels have a measurable impact.

All I know (from WIkipedia) is that nylon-6 is hygroscopic but what I don't know is what humidity levels would be low enough to keep it from absorbing enough moisture to create a problem? Drying it in an oven at 60C basically raises the temperature which has the effect of reducing relative humidity (and total moisture in the air). Gas-powered ovens will probably not dry as well as electric ovens (because the gas burner is typically just below and above the oven and some water vapor is produced as a result of combustion).

Has anyone come up with a table for how long you store nylon-6 at specific temperature / RH values before it needs to be dried again?

Usually when I run a temp chamber at 60C without humidity control (unlike an oven it is relatively sealed to outside air) the RH drops to 5-10% fairly quickly (from what is a typical starting point of 50% RH here).

Can someone point me in the right direction to get more detailed info on this? Thanks!

uGen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
As PLA and PET
> are rather similar in properties apparently,
> techniques to get one material to stick are sort
> of transferable.



Eh,not really. I suppose they have some similarities, but not much beyond being thermoplastics.

Perhaps the most important differences as they pertain to 3D printing are:

PLA - low flexural modulus
PETT - high (relatively) flexural modulus

PLA - hygroscopic
PETT - absorbs almost no moisture

This article (linked from the wiki) suggests the opposite. Sure, there are differences, but if they were that distant, PLA wouldn't be considered in several applications to replace PET.
The PETT (t-glase) polymer as well as the blend that I have got seems to differ a little bit from the PET that is used as engineering and bottling plastic. A sample of PLA behaved much like engineering PET when I destruction-tested it, by the way.
That being said, I have had extremely brittle ABS (more so than PLA, which I found to be extremely robust) and there is also flex-PLA, so I guess we can't generalize and just say any material/polymer behaves in a certain way without explicitly stating which blend we are talking about.

No need to get into the depths of polymerization - as I did far too much of that in college - but yes, there are certainly similarities between the two.

However, to your point about specificity of materials - PLA filament and T-Glase filament don't have many similarities beyond being thermoplastics.

I say that not as a chem-major dropout, but as a consumer and manufacturer.

In the picture you can see a gear that I produce made out of PLA (on the left, white) and out of T-Glase (on the right)

The PLA gear will either break or soften from heat and melt after no more than 2 hours of use.
I've had the PETT gear running for over 80 hours now with zero signs of fatigue or wear.

They print VERY differently.

I've also made single walled vases out of both

Single walled PETT is both flexible and very strong, with excellent interlayer adhesion

Single walled PLA? Not so much. Brittle as a dry toothpick, and delams fairly easily.

@cope413

What size nozzle orifice diameter are you using to print your T-Glase parts? On their website, Taulman recommends 0.5mm to 1mm nozzle orifices for best results. I am experimenting using a 0.4mm orifice and 3mm filament and I find that it requires A LOT of force to extrude. I am currently printing at:

225C
0.4 layer height
0.6 layer width
12mm/s

Thanks in advance

Eric

I will add my 2cents.

I've been printing with 618, amazing stuff, but almost impossible to do a large warp free print. Particularly what I was trying to print (solid object, quad frame). I contacted Taulman and he was more than willing to help. At the moment he only had his machines set up for t-glase and printed out my part on 3 different machines, and 3 different resolutions and sent them to me. I gave one of them a torture test. Without getting scientific, I just put the piece in a vise and clamped away, then took a pliers and pulled it apart. I found it to be a few times stronger than ABS, but no where near as strong as nylon. I also noticed how nice and straight the prints can come out (low shrinkage) not to mention the colors they have seem really nice. I will be ordering a few rolls.

If you look on his site, I believe you can get 6 rolls at the same shipping cost, and buy a mix of his different filament, so time to stock up.