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The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?

Posted by kfootball15 
The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 01:08PM
My small business could benefit from being able to print some objects in multiple colors, so I was thinking about giving the Kraken a shot! It seems worth it, as the price is pretty fair and they offer stepper motors and a very low cost to accomodate the 'beta' aspect.

I was just wondering what peoples experiences with it were, and if anyone had a good Tutorial or Instruction Manual on setting it up, and maybe a list of any extra parts I may need (I am assuming I would need 4 stepper motors?)

Thanks guys!

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 01:23PM by kfootball15.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 01:10PM
Quote
kfootball15
My small business could benefit from being to print some objects in multiple colors, so I was thinking about giving the Kraken a shot! It seems worth it, as the price is pretty fair and they offer stepper motors and a very low cost to accomodate the 'beta' aspect.

I was just wondering what peoples experiences with it were, and if anyone had a good Tutorial or Instruction Manual on setting it up, and maybe a list of any extra parts I mean need (I am assuming I would need 4 stepper motors?)

Thanks guys!

Should have mentioned I have a Prusa Mendel i2 with a Gregs Extruder. Is it integrateable with my current X-carriage or would I need to print a new part?
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 02:17PM
Again the slicing software is not caught up to the hardware yet. Also the firmware does not support multiple extruders in a very good way (one entry for steps per mm for all the extruders, not one for each extruder). The firmware also only allows extruder offsets for two nozzles not four. So unless you want to do a lot of development and experimenting then go for it, but if you actually want a production machine then you should wait.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 02:27PM by Sublime.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 03:46PM
Quote
kfootball15
Should have mentioned I have a Prusa Mendel i2 with a Gregs Extruder. Is it integrateable with my current X-carriage or would I need to print a new part?
You'd need 3 more steppers as well as corresponding extruders (Wade's, Greg's, Waeg's, Grde's, whatever...). Those will need to feed into bowden tubes. That likely is going to result in needing at minimum a new mounting plate of some sort if not a whole new x-carriage. You'll also need the water cooling setup.

It also just began shipping late last month IIRC. WIth that, plus the £135.00/~$225 USD price tag, you're probably not going to find a large number of reviews yet.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 04:11PM
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 09:04PM
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 18, 2014 10:00PM
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 19, 2014 03:57AM
Quote
Sublime
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.

Repetier's firmware allows for more than two - I use three and you can add more if you want to- see the configuration tool =>Temperature=>Extruder=>Add extruder on [www.repetier.com]


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 19, 2014 01:37PM
Quote
Xabbax
Quote
Sublime
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.

Repetier's firmware allows for more than two - I use three and you can add more if you want to- see the configuration tool =>Temperature=>Extruder=>Add extruder on [www.repetier.com]

Thanks I and many more have no idea this is possible since it is not part of the firmwares config file. It would probably be good if they could add a note the firmwares config file that says if you want more than the two extruders defined in the config file to go to that calculator.

I will mention this to JimJimma (developer of Ingentis and beta tester of the Kraken) as well as a few others that have looked for a firmware to support multiple steps per mm on E.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 19, 2014 02:06PM
Quote
Sublime
Quote
Xabbax
Quote
Sublime
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.

Repetier's firmware allows for more than two - I use three and you can add more if you want to- see the configuration tool =>Temperature=>Extruder=>Add extruder on [www.repetier.com]

Thanks I and many more have no idea this is possible since it is not part of the firmwares config file. It would probably be good if they could add a note the firmwares config file that says if you want more than the two extruders defined in the config file to go to that calculator.

You need to look on the development branch smiling smiley

Please, before telling people what can be done find out the facts first, don't make assumptions.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 19, 2014 02:24PM
Quote
bobc
Quote
Sublime
Quote
Xabbax
Quote
Sublime
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.

Repetier's firmware allows for more than two - I use three and you can add more if you want to- see the configuration tool =>Temperature=>Extruder=>Add extruder on [www.repetier.com]

Thanks I and many more have no idea this is possible since it is not part of the firmwares config file. It would probably be good if they could add a note the firmwares config file that says if you want more than the two extruders defined in the config file to go to that calculator.

You need to look on the development branch smiling smiley

Please, before telling people what can be done find out the facts first, don't make assumptions.

If it is the development branch my original statement stands. Since what I said is this is not ready for productions use and to only do it if you want to be doing development. So please refrain from sounding like a dick unless you really want to.

So to reiterate my original statement. The software is not ready for production use. Also the slicing software is not ready (do not mention Slic3r supporting multiextruders since it is not usable even with a single extruder due to it being more bugs than a slicer).


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 19, 2014 02:31PM
@ Bobc

It looks like you spoke without checking your facts. I just checked [github.com] which is the config for Repetiers development branch and it has no mention of an extruder with a greater number than T1 which is two extruders. And Malrin does not have a development branch [github.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 02:32PM by Sublime.


FFF Settings Calculator Gcode post processors Geometric Object Deposition Tool Blog
Tantillus.org Mini Printable Lathe How NOT to install a Pololu driver
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 24, 2014 08:41PM
I just tried the config tool and it would seem to allow you to add as many as you want. I think you might need to do a bit of tweaking elsewhere to make it all work.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 25, 2014 02:43AM
Quote
Sublime
@ Bobc

It looks like you spoke without checking your facts. I just checked [github.com] which is the config for Repetiers development branch and it has no mention of an extruder with a greater number than T1 which is two extruders. And Malrin does not have a development branch [github.com]

It does state a maximum of 6 extruders in the config.

"/** Number of extruders. Maximum 6 extruders. */
#define NUM_EXTRUDER 1"

But not how to handle configuration for each.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 26, 2014 12:20PM
Stop using the development branch. The master version and the one in the config tool have merged that and are more up to date.

Easiest way to get more then 2 extruders set up is the config tool. Or copy EXT1_ parts and change them to EXT2_ ... EXT_5 to get more extruders.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 26, 2014 12:36PM
Quote
Sublime
Quote
bobc
Quote
Sublime
Quote
Xabbax
Quote
Sublime
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.

Repetier's firmware allows for more than two - I use three and you can add more if you want to- see the configuration tool =>Temperature=>Extruder=>Add extruder on [www.repetier.com]

Thanks I and many more have no idea this is possible since it is not part of the firmwares config file. It would probably be good if they could add a note the firmwares config file that says if you want more than the two extruders defined in the config file to go to that calculator.

You need to look on the development branch smiling smiley

Please, before telling people what can be done find out the facts first, don't make assumptions.

If it is the development branch my original statement stands. Since what I said is this is not ready for productions use and to only do it if you want to be doing development. So please refrain from sounding like a dick unless you really want to.

So to reiterate my original statement. The software is not ready for production use. Also the slicing software is not ready (do not mention Slic3r supporting multiextruders since it is not usable even with a single extruder due to it being more bugs than a slicer).

Ok, it is clear you were completely wrong about Repetier, but refuse to admit it, so why don't you stop being a dick.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 26, 2014 01:41PM
Quote
bobc
Quote
Sublime
Quote
bobc
Quote
Sublime
Quote
Xabbax
Quote
Sublime
Quote
jcabrer
Repetier Firmware supports multiple extruders. Have a look at Panucatt Devices line of controllers. They are in communication with the Kraken guys about getting these things working out in the wider 3D hobby printing world.

They only have a couple of the new boards in stock right now.

I just went through Repetiers config file [github.com] and it only has settings for two extruders as well.

Repetier's firmware allows for more than two - I use three and you can add more if you want to- see the configuration tool =>Temperature=>Extruder=>Add extruder on [www.repetier.com]

Thanks I and many more have no idea this is possible since it is not part of the firmwares config file. It would probably be good if they could add a note the firmwares config file that says if you want more than the two extruders defined in the config file to go to that calculator.

You need to look on the development branch smiling smiley

Please, before telling people what can be done find out the facts first, don't make assumptions.

If it is the development branch my original statement stands. Since what I said is this is not ready for productions use and to only do it if you want to be doing development. So please refrain from sounding like a dick unless you really want to.

So to reiterate my original statement. The software is not ready for production use. Also the slicing software is not ready (do not mention Slic3r supporting multiextruders since it is not usable even with a single extruder due to it being more bugs than a slicer).

Ok, it is clear you were completely wrong about Repetier, but refuse to admit it, so why don't you stop being a dick.

What the F are you talking about. I admitted I did not have all the information and thanked the nice person that provided it all before you started being an ass.
Quote
Myself
Thanks I and many more have no idea this is possible since it is not part of the firmwares config file. It would probably be good if they could add a note the firmwares config file that says if you want more than the two extruders defined in the config file to go to that calculator.
Yes it is possible but it is not mentioned as to how to do it in the firmware because there are no instructions on adding extruders. Even Repetiers response proves the only person that was completely wrong is you. He said do not use the development branch which is what you said to do. He finally gave instructions on how to configure it yourself just now but he has still not added the instructions (I just checked) to the readme on github. So as it stands if you look for the firmware and find the github page it does not explain to go the config generator or give instructions on how to do it manually so it is still a dead end unless you have read this thread or maybe found out by other word of mouth. I did my research and my answers were exactly what anyone would have found out if they had done the research. So please refrain from sounding like an ass and maybe try giving help. If the answer was so obvious to you why did you wait so long to pipe in. Why didn't you say 'actually Repetier firmware supports multiple extruders via the config tool' like the nice person did.

Last thing is my original statement was that the software was not ready and that still stands. Sure we now have a confirmed firmware capable of 4 extruders but no usable slicer to produce Gcode.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2014 02:03PM by Sublime.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 26, 2014 02:10PM
Quote
bobc
so why don't you stop being a dick.

Quote
Sublime
you started being an ass.

Please stop the personal attacks, both of you. It's fine to correct someone and provide a source to reinforce your point, but do not resort to name calling and accusations.

Thank you.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 27, 2014 09:27PM
kraken looks awesome
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
February 28, 2014 08:16PM
Quote
mrPrik
kraken looks awesome

I would agree, from a technical stand point the Kraken seems to be an awesome unit but does anyone here have any actual real-life experience using it? Would love to see some pictures of prints with the Kraken.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 04, 2014 05:31AM
Quote
Sublime
So please refrain from sounding like a dick unless you really want to.

Quote
NewPerfection

Quote
bobc
so why don't you stop being a dick.

Quote
Sublime
you started being an ass.

Please stop the personal attacks, both of you. It's fine to correct someone and provide a source to reinforce your point, but do not resort to name calling and accusations.

Thank you.

It was not I who started the personal attacks, and no action was taken even when it was reported.

When I respond in kind, suddenly it's not ok? Seems a bit partial....

I reiterate what I said, I wish people would research the facts before shooting their mouth off. As Sublime was clearly wrong, I await his apology.

I do have a Kraken, and would be happy to share experiences, but I will not while people are apparently free to call me a dick for no reason and get away with it.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 05:32AM by bobc.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 04, 2014 12:09PM
Quote
bobc
Quote
Sublime
So please refrain from sounding like a dick unless you really want to.

Quote
NewPerfection

Quote
bobc
so why don't you stop being a dick.

Quote
Sublime
you started being an ass.

Please stop the personal attacks, both of you. It's fine to correct someone and provide a source to reinforce your point, but do not resort to name calling and accusations.

Thank you.

It was not I who started the personal attacks, and no action was taken even when it was reported.

When I respond in kind, suddenly it's not ok? Seems a bit partial....

I reiterate what I said, I wish people would research the facts before shooting their mouth off. As Sublime was clearly wrong, I await his apology.

I do have a Kraken, and would be happy to share experiences, but I will not while people are apparently free to call me a dick for no reason and get away with it.

I said you sounded like a dick not that you were a dick because of this statement.
Quote

You need to look on the development branch.

Please, before telling people what can be done find out the facts first, don't make assumptions.
You made assumptions that I did not know what I was talking about and had not done my research which I had done. Your statement was arrogant and wrong. Since it was not factual it was nothing but an attack at me for no reason.

Also please please please please please please point out and quote where I was wrong. You have yet to point out how you think I was wrong since your very first comment in this thread was a response to me saying thank you to the person that actually helped out. Nothing you have said in this conversation has helped anyone.

If you are waiting until you get an apology from me you will be waiting for the rest of your life since I said nothing wrong (not even that you sounded like a dick which I am sure I do to at this point and would not argue with since it is the truth). Maybe you need to re-read my original statement and how my very first words were
Quote

Again the slicing software is not caught up to the hardware yet
followed by me mentioning the firmware at which point I had nice people come on and point out that Repetier supports more than two extruders. At which point I checked and found that the firmware had no settings for more than two extruders and I replied saying exactly that. Then another nice person pointed out the config tool which I then replied to with a thank you and a mention of how I would make sure others would know about the config tool. All of this was before you started to attack me for being part of a conversation of which apparently you are an expert but refuse to offer help.

I may not have a Kraken but I did spend a couple of weeks writing a post processor for a Kraken owner that can confirm that the slicing software is not ready and that Marlin is not ready. He also did not know about Repetiers config tool and its ability to be configured for 4 extruders.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 04, 2014 04:35PM
Sublime & bobc: You both are very well experienced individuals in the 3D print world. Please, let's let the past be done with (water under the bridge) and let's focus on helping everyone else grow the reprap world. Both of you offer much needed and appreciated knowledge.

bobc: I would love to learn more about your experience with the Kraken, and if you wouldn't mind sharing some pictures of some prints that would be super. smileys with beer

Sublime: What's a post processor for the Kraken? (sorry for such a noobie question) smileys with beer
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 04, 2014 04:59PM
Quote
NewKidOnTheBlock
Sublime & bobc: You both are very well experienced individuals in the 3D print world. Please, let's let the past be done with (water under the bridge) and let's focus on helping everyone else grow the reprap world. Both of you offer much needed and appreciated knowledge.

True and I do apologize for this thread going off topic and becoming less useful.

Quote

Sublime: What's a post processor for the Kraken? (sorry for such a noobie question) smileys with beer

It is a small program that allows you to change extruders for different sections of a print. It currently lets you select which extruder is used for (outer perimeters, inner perimeters, sparse infill, solid layers, support and support interfacing) as well as changing the retraction value for each nozzle since each plastic type has different properties. It also adds a prime pillar so each time you switch between nozzles it purges them so you have proper flow at the next paths start. The prime pillar should also give the previous hotend time to cool enough that it does not ooze all over the print. It works with Gcode files produced by Cura and Kisslicer. You can follow the link in my signature if you would like to have a look at it.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 04:59PM by Sublime.


FFF Settings Calculator Gcode post processors Geometric Object Deposition Tool Blog
Tantillus.org Mini Printable Lathe How NOT to install a Pololu driver
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 05, 2014 07:12AM
Quote
bobc
I do have a Kraken, and would be happy to share experiences

What slicer are you using?

Does it generate a wipe tower automatically?

How are the nozzles primed before a print?

What does your tool change g-code look like?

How are the hotends leveled?

Are you using AMFs with the Slicer or only STLs? If STLs how are they aligned relative to each other?

Thanks, Andy

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2014 07:13AM by ajayre.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 05, 2014 02:28PM
Quote
Sublime

It is a small program that allows you to change extruders for different sections of a print. It currently lets you select which extruder is used for (outer perimeters, inner perimeters, sparse infill, solid layers, support and support interfacing) as well as changing the retraction value for each nozzle since each plastic type has different properties. It also adds a prime pillar so each time you switch between nozzles it purges them so you have proper flow at the next paths start. The prime pillar should also give the previous hotend time to cool enough that it does not ooze all over the print. It works with Gcode files produced by Cura and Kisslicer. You can follow the link in my signature if you would like to have a look at it.

Thanks for sharing and being so informative. smileys with beer

(So much to learn.... I need to learn how to use GitHub now....I'm such a noob lol)
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
March 07, 2014 05:17AM
Sanjay here - I designed the Kraken and work at E3D etc.

kfootball15
If you're looking for a ready to go our of the box 4 colour printing solution that you can use in a production environment then this is not it. If you want to tinker, play with bleeding edge slicers, use electronics that have only just come out in the last few weeks, and tune things like anti-ooze settings during multicolour printing, then this is for you.

Kraken is a BETA product, and as such you really need to know what you are doing to get things done with it. I mean you no offence, but from the questions you have asked here initially I would say with some surety that you would have to do a lot of learning before you'd get anywhere with something like a Kraken.

Repetier
Awesome work on the firmware! This is the first firmware I am aware of that may allow us to use all extruders on ATMega boards like the Azteeg X3 Pro. I'll give it a go as soon as I have time.

Others
We did a little write up on using Kraken for multimaterial printing of support structures here: http://e3d-online.com/index.php?route=extras/blog/getblog&blog_id=20

In General
Sublime is quite right on the slicer front, they are the weakest part of the toolchain right now for multimaterial printing, however slicers are also the most rapidly developing part of the toolchain and are showing great promise. I really hope in some small way our release of the Kraken contributes to the acceleration of development of slicers by providing motivation and a testing platform. When we released Kraken there was no appropriate electronics, no appropriate firmware, and questionable slicing capacity. We now have multiple electronics solutions and multiple firmwares. You've got to step out of boundaries in order to break the "chicken and egg" problem sometimes.
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
April 18, 2014 09:45AM
Quote
Sublime
I said you sounded like a dick not that you were a dick because of this statement.

Whatever. The distinction is lost on me. It seems that both you and the moderators think abusive behaviour is acceptable.

Reprap is just a fun hobby for me, if it stops being fun I will do something else. Therefore after some consideration I think the best thing is that I do something else.

Have fun everyone.


What is Open Source?
What is Open Source Hardware?
Open Source in a nutshell: the Four Freedoms
CC BY-NC is not an Open Source license
Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
April 18, 2014 11:58AM
Quote
bobc
It seems that both you and the moderators think abusive behaviour is acceptable.

This is so funny. Whenever I would see your name as the last poster I would always be sure to read what you posted because it was always funny how you were a jerk so often and now you are upset that it was turned around on you. And yet you still haven't given the quotes of how you think I was the problem. Maybe try acting like an adult and make the conversation two ways so I can see what you saw. Just like I have pointed out to you how I thought you came across like a dick even if you were not trying, but you can not point out to me what I did exactly. Actually you have never once answered any of the questions I had for you in this thread so I am still lost as to what the problem was.


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Re: The KRAKEN quad Extruder - Experiences?
May 26, 2014 09:38AM
I've read this post describing an extruder that can drive 4 filament with 2 stepper motors:
Introducing the Coherent Extruder: A 4 Color, 2 Motor Cold End (github files)

Sounds like the way to go to use one stepper for switching what filament to drive and the other to actually drive it. Not sure how it actually works yet though. Anyone tried to use this and has any experiences?

Here is the original design for 3 filaments and 2 steppers on thingiverse.
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