Re: Use of open source designs June 17, 2015 02:50PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
bold was yours, btw.Quote
Matt
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Just admit you are wrong Andrew. And also, please stop falsely accusing people of violating the GPL until you can provide actual justification for your unique and personal interpretation of how the GPL applies to hardware.
...
Re: Use of open source designs June 17, 2015 04:14PM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 82 |
Re: Use of open source designs June 17, 2015 07:38PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 04:32AM |
Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 283 |
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MattMoses
No. Registering the copyright does not magically increase its power. It just creates a paper trail that shows a copyright exists:Quote
MotoBarsteward
Now, if Greg or Wade had registered their design then this would be different.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 04:42AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 257 |
Quote
http://www.eucopyright.com/fr/quelle-est-la-difference-entre-le-droit-d-auteur-et-un-brevet-d-invention-ou-une-marque-deposee
Le droit d’auteur protège les ouvrages originaux des auteurs, tandis que les brevets d’invention protègent des inventions et des découvertes.
Les idées et les découvertes ne sont pas protégées par la loi du droit d’auteur, mais la modalité dans laquelle elles sont exprimées peut être protégée par le copyright.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 09:13AM |
Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 283 |
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kimented_
I'm sorry for the french quote
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http://www.eucopyright.com/fr/quelle-est-la-difference-entre-le-droit-d-auteur-et-un-brevet-d-invention-ou-une-marque-deposee
Le droit d’auteur protège les ouvrages originaux des auteurs, tandis que les brevets d’invention protègent des inventions et des découvertes.
Les idées et les découvertes ne sont pas protégées par la loi du droit d’auteur, mais la modalité dans laquelle elles sont exprimées peut être protégée par le copyright.
It say: An invention, an idea, cannot be protected with copyright. For me, this means that a new feature on an extruder can be copied: this is an idea. But the binary file or the source code cannot be copied without respecting the licence.
The GPL applies on the files, but not on the idea. And the GPL will never do that, because it is impossible (the copyright cannot do that), and because it's bad (this is why the open community are against the software patent).
I advise you to read the GPL, Andrew
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 09:27AM |
Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 283 |
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 09:38AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 257 |
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MotoBarsteward
According to GPL V3 Q&A, the output of GPL V3 software can only be GPL V3 licensed if that output contains a significant portion of the licensed code. STL files contain none of the original OpenScad source at the moment. Is there a way of adding it as a comment into the STL file? I ask this because tools exist that can modify STL files which then circumvents the original authors wish for his copyrightable creation to be made GPL in all derrived forms.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 09:56AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 344 |
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 09:58AM |
Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 283 |
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 10:48AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 344 |
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 11:00AM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 82 |
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AndrewBCN
Hi Craig,
Thanks for joining this thread.
Answering your question, you can check a link I posted earlier here in this thread, to a page written by Eben Moglen:
Enforcing the GNU GPL by Eben Moglen. Note the text dates back to 2001 (14 years ago).
So apparently the GPL has legal validity and is enforceable in court, at least in the US and at least in some cases.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 11:22AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
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CraigMoberg
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My question was whether violation of an open source license is actionable in court,
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Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 11:44AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
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kimented_
...
It say: An invention, an idea, cannot be protected with copyright. For me, this means that a new feature on an extruder can be copied: this is an idea. But the binary file or the source code cannot be copied without respecting the licence.
...
I advise you to read the GPL, Andrew
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 12:00PM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 82 |
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AndrewBCN
In the hope that this answers your question more precisely than the previous link I posted. Note that all it took to find this was a single query in the usual search engine...
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 12:59PM |
Admin Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 730 |
There are tons of case law examples in Michael Weinberg's article "What's the deal with copyright and 3D printing?". Here is the link again for convenience.Quote
CraigMoberg
I was wondering if there was actual case law behind some of the assertions
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 01:01PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
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kimented_
Quote
MotoBarsteward
According to GPL V3 Q&A, the output of GPL V3 software can only be GPL V3 licensed if that output contains a significant portion of the licensed code. STL files contain none of the original OpenScad source at the moment. Is there a way of adding it as a comment into the STL file? I ask this because tools exist that can modify STL files which then circumvents the original authors wish for his copyrightable creation to be made GPL in all derrived forms.
If I understand your answer, you means that the STL cannot be covered with the GPL? Of course, it can be. The STL can be compared to an executable binary (.exe): it is directly the result of compiling a code (or interpretation/export of the design in CAD software). Like firefox.exe is covered by the GPL licence, the STL can be too. if you put STL under the GPL licence, you should diffuse the source (cad files or code).
But this does not prevent someone to make similar software or design without copying any portion of code or binary (this is the main debate here...).
Some other licences like the CC does not require to diffuse the source. It is like: "use my STL or whatever as desired, I let you modify it if you can". The most permissive CC just have an attribution clause.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 01:37PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 344 |
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AndrewBCN
Misconception 1.
Misconception 2.
Misconception 3.
Misconception 4.
Misconception 5.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 02:53PM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 82 |
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MattMoses
There are tons of case law examples in Michael Weinberg's article "What's the deal with copyright and 3D printing?". Here is the link again for convenience.
Re: Use of open source designs June 18, 2015 03:16PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
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cristian
...
Hey, you forgot Misconception 6, about the fact that a CAD file (source or not) does not necessarily contain what is legally needed to define a design. With this I mean that the architets who register their designs do not just submit a CAD file (look here as a random example of what is required, which is more than I usually put in my OpenSCAD files).
Quote
US Copyright Office
Do I have to register with your office to be protected?
No. In general, registration is voluntary. Copyright exists from the moment the work is created. You will have to register, however, if you wish to bring a lawsuit for infringement of a U.S. work. See Circular 1, Copyright Basics, section “Copyright Registration.”
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cristian
And there is Misconception 7 too, about the fact that even if you are (morally) the original creator of a design and you release it under some licence, in some (most?) countries this is not legally equivalent to registering your design or filing a patent.
So even if Misconceptions 1,...,5 were false, releasing an OpenSCAD file under GPL may not be enough to protect somebody's design from being registered (or patented?) by somebody else. (Orcs never give up )
Re: Use of open source designs June 19, 2015 08:21AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
Re: Use of open source designs July 20, 2015 06:28PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
Re: Use of open source designs July 20, 2015 08:41PM |
Admin Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 1,063 |
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AndrewBCN
I am revisiting this thread to mention that I am reorganizing the page RepRap and Open Source in the wiki, since I believe that the subject matter and the discussion around it in this thread are related.
The question of RepRap and Open Source can be examined from various angles and I am trying to bring all the previously available points of view into this single page.
The RepRap and Open Source page is still very much work in progress right now and apparently there is not a single coherent opinion (which may be a good or a bad thing, depending on how you look at it) on this somewhat vast and controversial subject. So feel free to voice your opinion, either in the RepRap and Open Source page itself, in the Discussion tab in the page, or in a newly created page and add a link to it.
I have added a link to this thread in the Discussion tab in the RepRap and Open Source page, for reference.
Re: Use of open source designs July 20, 2015 09:35PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 977 |
Re: Use of open source designs July 21, 2015 04:19PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 3 |