Are you going upgrade to Windows 10

Tadawson, your rant is beneath contempt and I wont waste any.more time responding to it.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2015 02:33PM by dc42.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

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tadawson
Impossible unless you are stupid enough to screw with it while a job is running, and not that different than pulling out an SD card. That is not a technology limitation, that is user error, and dumbing things down because people won't (or can't) think is not a solution - it just creates and coddles more idiots . . .

I've said it prior, and I will reiterate: the chance of a failed print due to the use of an appropriate advanced platform to drive a printer is so small as to be 'in the noise' and irrelevant compared to the chance of a print failing due to the printer itself. And the advantages of having the next job prepped and good to go *immediately* without waiting for an upload, or an upload/print/oops! slice error/off to the computer to reslice/reupload (sneakernet of the SD, or connect to the printer/put the computer back/print/oops! needed to fix support/repeat. I don't know about, I'm not willing to waste that much time to fix what is primarily a theoretical problem. And you really can't fully decouple the printer and computer fully, since, as I just noted, printers don't slice . . . or edit designs . . . etc. There will always be an associated computer of some source.

Your experience doesn't mirror the experience others with significant experience printing over the last few years. Printing via USB can be problematic for some due to issues with the toolchain that are beyond the control of the user. The printer control board, as good a job as they do, isn't terribly smart when using serial communication over USB. Using an SD card is slightly faster and more reliable than tethering a host to your machine. Stating that SD card printing is unequivically unreliable is not a reflection of the reality for those using SD cards to print as well as those using printers in production environments.

It is indeed possible to decouple the computer from the printer. It's much the same for any machine tool. The design and CAM (in this case slicing) is done on a host and transfered to the machine. One notable exception is a CO2 laser engraver/cutter than uses a traditional Windows print driver but even many of those have SD capability once the job is prepared. I'll run a machine for testing having it tethered but the bots in the farm use an SD card to print from. The SD card in most cases is inside a Rasp Pi running Octoprint but I still have a couple of machines that have display/card readers. In the case of one of the machines it's an original i3 single that's almost 3 years old, still running strong.

Circling back to the OP, before you guys upgrade your primary machine for printing make sure at least three things are compatable with Win 10. Those would be your printer host (if you tether or use one) your slicer and the Arduino dev environment. Secondarlly whatever modeling software you use as well. Unless you've got a machine to dedicate or use for your printer until you decide if it works for you, hold off and see how others are doing. If you've got a machine that can be idle if there is an issue with the upgrade then go for it. Eventually, everyone the keeps using Windows will need to upgrade to Win 10 though you may not want to do it until the first service pack is available.

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Dave
Roaddog Labs Ltd
Las Vegas USA
roaddoglabs.io

have windows 10 pro x64 on my kids laptop first it seems to runs very well and smooth for what they do, and since I did a fresh install, it is faster than before ofcos

on my own laptop, everything says compatible except deamontools pro x64, who knows I will install it later on, for now I need to tune up the printer voltage for the bed... I also need my android dev to be working correctly too...

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2015 03:58PM by deaconfrost.

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I wish you continued luck in your computer controlled printing operations.

Solid technology requires zero luck, but thanks anyhow . . .

- Tim

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2015 06:00PM by tadawson.

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dc42
Tadawson, your rant is beneath contempt and I wont waste any.more time responding to it.

Translation: the facts presented are indisputable, so I won't . . .

Every request for help I see, you post a commercial, rather than anything useful. Frankly, the moderators should start dumping those posts for thier excessively commercial nature . . . It's so rampant, it makes the Chinese spam look good, and makes my rear end hurt . . .

- Tim

Were I in a production environment, making multiples of the same thing, I would likely untether as well. For one-offs that frequently need tweaking, it adds a lot of pain, as you somewhat noted referring to your test procedure. And, I note again, that when runnimg advanced platforms, absolutely *none* of the toolchain is outside my control . . . I maintain and can alter/keep/recompile any of it at any time. So surprises do not, and cannot happen . . .

- Tim

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vegasloki

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tadawson
Impossible unless you are stupid enough to screw with it while a job is running, and not that different than pulling out an SD card. That is not a technology limitation, that is user error, and dumbing things down because people won't (or can't) think is not a solution - it just creates and coddles more idiots . . .

I've said it prior, and I will reiterate: the chance of a failed print due to the use of an appropriate advanced platform to drive a printer is so small as to be 'in the noise' and irrelevant compared to the chance of a print failing due to the printer itself. And the advantages of having the next job prepped and good to go *immediately* without waiting for an upload, or an upload/print/oops! slice error/off to the computer to reslice/reupload (sneakernet of the SD, or connect to the printer/put the computer back/print/oops! needed to fix support/repeat. I don't know about, I'm not willing to waste that much time to fix what is primarily a theoretical problem. And you really can't fully decouple the printer and computer fully, since, as I just noted, printers don't slice . . . or edit designs . . . etc. There will always be an associated computer of some source.

Your experience doesn't mirror the experience others with significant experience printing over the last few years. Printing via USB can be problematic for some due to issues with the toolchain that are beyond the control of the user. The printer control board, as good a job as they do, isn't terribly smart when using serial communication over USB. Using an SD card is slightly faster and more reliable than tethering a host to your machine. Stating that SD card printing is unequivically unreliable is not a reflection of the reality for those using SD cards to print as well as those using printers in production environments.

It is indeed possible to decouple the computer from the printer. It's much the same for any machine tool. The design and CAM (in this case slicing) is done on a host and transfered to the machine. One notable exception is a CO2 laser engraver/cutter than uses a traditional Windows print driver but even many of those have SD capability once the job is prepared. I'll run a machine for testing having it tethered but the bots in the farm use an SD card to print from. The SD card in most cases is inside a Rasp Pi running Octoprint but I still have a couple of machines that have display/card readers. In the case of one of the machines it's an original i3 single that's almost 3 years old, still running strong.

Circling back to the OP, before you guys upgrade your primary machine for printing make sure at least three things are compatable with Win 10. Those would be your printer host (if you tether or use one) your slicer and the Arduino dev environment. Secondarlly whatever modeling software you use as well. Unless you've got a machine to dedicate or use for your printer until you decide if it works for you, hold off and see how others are doing. If you've got a machine that can be idle if there is an issue with the upgrade then go for it. Eventually, everyone the keeps using Windows will need to upgrade to Win 10 though you may not want to do it until the first service pack is available.

wow can you feel the lurv in this thread

Printing from SD is great. Printing from a PC is great. If you have issues with either, you are doing something wrong. Post a question to your relative issue under a relative title ie "problems printing with SD Card" etc, and you will get good answers. If printing from a PC turn off all auto updates/auto sleep/auto update etc so the machine doesnt interrupt itself during the print.

There are pros and cons to both SD Card and PC based printing.

Responses in this thread appear to be quite bullish and highly opinionated with self proclamation of god like status "i know best" type of responses. If you look at the length of membership and number of posts its hard to understand how these answers can be anything more than inflated egotistical opinion. This does no good for the community (but boys will be boys). There is some fact within these responses but it is heavily obscured by the piffle.

Going back to the original question "Are you going to upgrade to windows 10?"

I probably wont be due to privacy concerns raised in the 12000 word "terms of use" where buried within this text is a statement or clause stating Microsoft will keep detailed records of everything you do on windows 10 and will pass it onto law enforcement and other 3rd parties (unless you go through a very lengthy process of disabling key programs within the OS that support search results and targeted advertising - disabling these will also essentially remove much of the other features and benefits within the OS thereby nullifying the objective of upgrading).

Nope, I don't care much for Win7 and had zero interest in Win8.

I agree with Mutley3D on the topic...

Microsoft is moving in a (imo) trashy direction with the pre-installed apps (With advertisements... what else do you expect from "free" software?), forced background communication & other services/programs that you can no longer stop or cannot stop without stupid sh** warnings about Microsoft products I don't use &/or have disabled intentionally. Including automatic updates... that kept breaking programs/other drivers at microsofts will...

It's likely the small business I work for will upgrade to 10, because the owners son(aka "tech support") is a MS fanboy, and windows is all any of them have used... and BARELY function in. Outside of the CAD room all machines are DELL and have the double click speed&mouse sensitivity turned all the way down... to give you and idea. So I expect to have first hand troubles with it soon.

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Mutley3D
wow can you feel the lurv in this thread

Printing from SD is great. Printing from a PC is great. If you have issues with either, you are doing something wrong. Post a question to your relative issue under a relative title ie "problems printing with SD Card" etc, and you will get good answers. If printing from a PC turn off all auto updates/auto sleep/auto update etc so the machine doesnt interrupt itself during the print.

Unfortunately it's not quite that easy with all hosts for robust USB printing. I see it as being where we are in the tech curve right now. Some work great, others not so much. For example, running some hosts without the window in focus can cause the print to pause to catch up while on that same machine, in the same config running another host it prints fine. There can be issues with the UARTs on some motherboards with the printer controller. Some have issues with USB 3 while others don't. I think after a while as micro computers and SoC systems become more robust controllers will morph to more standalone machines with some of the heavy lifting done over the network, or "in the cloud" as the kids like to call it. Pick your job or file from your phone (most aren't making their own models), run it through your app that crunches the data on some virtual host and spits it back to your printer. Or a service bureau printer. I don't know that it will ever fully go to the network but one thing is for sure, it's early days now and what is hip and cool right now will likely get snickered at in a few years time (or less) for being some sort of "stone age" technology.

One of the things MS is hoping to do in Win 10 is to provide an API specific to 3D printing so that some of the issues we see now in connectivity and UX (as well as file handling) are minimized. We'll see..

As for the Win 10 TOS, your post makes me curious to actually read one just to see what they will try and claim. However, with all the data the NSA is getting without having to use MS it's likely they may already know that the last things I started this morning were another plate of printer parts and a Yoda.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2015 11:05PM by vegasloki.

"some work great, others not so great"

^^^ this is precisely what i mean, both approaches work. it depends on what works best for an individual and their setup.

But yes, there are some very disturbing clauses in the Win10 EULA.

Regarding compulsory updates, I have windows 10 tech preview and you can disable the windows update service from services manager. You just have to remember to turn it on and install updates every now and again.

I'm not keen on some of the features of Windows 10, such as compulsory updates in the Home edition. I am happy with Windows 7; but I will have to support my own software under Windows 10. So I need to install it on at least one PC and get to understand it. That's why I will be upgrading the machine I use to prepare models for 3D printing.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

FWIW I "upgraded" one of my Windows 7 systems to Windows 10 yesterday. Pronterface still finds the USB port on my Duet-controlled 3D printer and talks to it OK. I didn't need to install any new or updated device drivers for it. The Duet web interface doesn't work with the Edge browser (I didn't expect to to because it didn't work properly with IE either), but works fine with Chrome. S3D seems fine too.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Windows 10 runs fine on my desktops but not so well on my laptop. Maybe because my desktops have the pro version where laptop has the home version.

I only had Vista Business, so moving to Windows 10 Pro was a breath of fresh air! My main machine runs Linux Mint, with the Windows 10 machine for those times when only WIndows will do... rare occasions nowadays.

As far as I can see, anything that runs on Win 7 will run OK in Win 10.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2015 03:05AM by David J.

I have installed the Windows 10 update on 4 laptops and a tablet. The tablet is less than a year old and came with Windows 8.1; the laptops vary in age from about 12 months to 5 years old (that one came with Vista pre-installed, and a free voucher for Windows 7 which was released a couple of months after I bought the laptop).

Zero issues on any of my machines - all software on all machines works fine, and no data was lost on any of them. (But yes, I did back up before upgrading!)

The "compulsory updates" issue isn't really an issue at all - you can easily set it up to download updates in the background, but not install until you say so. Anyone who can find their way around the intricacies of installing the Arduino UI, configuring USB comms to a RepRap, compiling firmware and tweaking their printer's settings should be able to work this one out!

The oldest laptop (2 GB RAM, 2-core processor, Windows 10 Home, 32-bit) is my "man-cave" machine, and is used for creating and slicing 3D models, updating my RAMPS 1.4 firmware, and driving my RepRap via Pronterface and USB cable when I want a more comprehensive "hands-on" UI than I get with my LCD / SD Controller. It works fine, but for unattended "production" printing, I always disconnect the laptop and print from SD, because it eliminates a few factors from the risk of causing a failed print.

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Follow my Mendel Prusa build here: [julianh72.blogspot.com]

Recommend Octoprint for Raspberry Pi. I have Octo running on Mark I rasp pi over home network (LAN). Am running latest version of slic3r on newly upgraded win 10 laptop - there is the option to flick it straight through to the RaspPi Octo server in Slic3r. You then access octo control interface through browser - you just click print and watch the magic.
Really is TOO easy.
My previous workflow was:
windows 10 slic3r -> gcode -> dropbox over WLAN -> prontface on OLD Lubuntu linux machine connected to reprap.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2015 01:22AM by aegis1980.

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aegis1980
Recommend Octoprint for Raspberry Pi. I have Octo running on Mark I rasp pi over home network (LAN). Am running latest version of slic3r on newly upgraded win 10 laptop - there is the option to flick it straight through to the RaspPi Octo server in Slic3r. You then access octo control interface through browser - you just click print and watch the magic.
Really is TOO easy.

Even easier is to use Duet electronics. No need to use a separate board to run the web server, the Duet runs it as well as controlling the printer.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

I upgraded to Win10, doesn't change that much in Windows, but I use Arch to print with anyways because it's more reliable.