230/110 V~ PCB Heated Bed

I just found these [www.tindie.com]

The idea just scares me lots!!

Anyone been brave enough to try them?

Interesting...

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Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]

That is a very healthy and good reaction.

I use silicon 220 Volt heater, but to my opinion is a lot ore save than this.
The paint is not that thick and a scratch can open up the 220V.

silicon heaters are around the same price.

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P3steel DXL, with Due/RADDS/Raps128 dual Wade's extruder

Why not? Were comfortable with silicone rubber filled with hot wires at mains voltage so why not a PCB?

I think this just looks scary as we characterise PCB heaters as low voltage and therefore safe devices.

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Simon Khoury

Co-founder of [www.precisionpiezo.co.uk] Accurate, repeatable, versatile Z-Probes
Published:Inventions

At a glance it looks pretty solid to me.

@DJDemonD- I agree, people think of low voltage as 'safe' and I think are careless as a result.

The #1 problem I've seen with guys wiring up line(mains) voltage is they aren't careful with low voltage either. As a result you see plenty of fires @ low voltage.
Grabbing wires out of an old shoe box like 'oh, its just low voltage, what could go wrong?'

@amigob- I'm not an expert in PCB construction. The PCB's I have broken, however, are covered with the same material at its core. The white(text/labels) is usually ink applied using silk screen. The material that makes up the core is not typically easy to 'scratch off' I would say even the standard stuff is pretty tough to get to copper unless you're trying.
FR-4 Wiki
"made from temperature resistant FR4" - from 'Makertum' website

My opinion on most of the line(mains) voltage & water cooling etc. is that this is common in the walls of ALL of our houses. Ice maker on the fridge, water filter under the sink, and garbage disposal right next to it. High voltage with limitless water in the same tubing/pipes&connectors, same plugs & wire that one would/could use in a 3D Printer or a high end PC.

I am far more concerned with a pipe leaking or a bad connection in my walls or crawl spaces than I am a $1,000-$10,000 metal box on my desk or out in the garage. My house cost over fifteen times that much, small leaks or bad connections in either case can cause damage but more costly damage is done directly to the house than through an appliance in the house. But in 3D printing communities the opinion has been spread that because [reasons and stuff] line(mains) voltage is somehow dangerous in a 3D Printer... but is somehow safe to use in EVERY other household appliance we have.

I think there should be more concern for those that watched 'some guy' on youtube or read an instructables.
When those people think because they watched 'some guy' do it, it must be that easy and that's all there is to pay attention to... I don't think it ever ends well.
My old shop teacher always said " You heard from "Some guy"?... well... "Some guy"... is always an idiot."

My concern is that the 'insulation' on the top of a normal PCB bed heater is just a thin coating of solder resist, intended more to prevent solder getting on the copper traces than to insulate the traces from something on top. This thin layer is not intended to be a mains-voltage insulator. If this mains voltage PCB has the same construction, then I would be very concerned. In particular, putting an aluminium heat spreader on top of the bed heater would be dangerous.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

my main concern is the connecting mains cable.

Most beds move in the Y direction, connected by a flexing cable

All flexing cables eventually break...

I would highly recommend finding the best quality double insulated flexible cable you can.

I'm also concerned over the insulation on top just being quite thin... but I would mount 2-3mm aluminium over it, and make sure the ALU is earthed.

> but I would mount 2-3mm aluminium over it, and make sure the ALU is earthed.

This is important the thickness of the resist on top of the copper structures can be less then 13um. With a scratch it is possible that
an ark can form to the aluminum on top.
And make sure that a cable never flexes at a solder joint, it will break over time. Mount the cable to fixed point so that the cable flexes where there is no solder.
[removeandreplace.com]

With a silicon heater this a lot less problematic because the silicon is a lot thicker and the solder joint, if any is not on the side.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/12/2016 05:05AM by amigob.

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P3steel DXL, with Due/RADDS/Raps128 dual Wade's extruder

Just make sure you keep it sandwiched between 2 glass plates, insulate the connections properly (electrical tape and heat shrink tubing) and, as Dust mentioned, make sure you place the wiring safely.

Glass is the best electric insulator I know of. It is not used in high voltage transmission lines (13kV+) just because it is brittle.

I wonder how to set the firmware controllers for such a fast heater, though.