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What heater for Mic6 plate?

Posted by Number_5 
What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 07, 2018 07:17PM
I'm in the process of designing my new printer. I've decided I want to try a 1/4" or 3/8" Mic6 aluminum build plate, but wondered about the heater.

I have a 300mm MK2a heat bed here that came with one of my printers. I was wondering if this was a suitable heater if I could somehow attach it properly to the bottom of the Mic6 plate. I'm not sure if this heater can be ran off of 24v or not, but I was more concerned with the size. If this style of heater is suitable, I think I can find a 24v easy enough if I go that route.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 07, 2018 08:14PM
OK well I kind of talked myself out of using this heater that I have here, I will go with a Keenovo type of heater instead.

I see where there are 30cmx30cm silicone pads available, so I guess I should order the Mic6 plate to be around 320mm.

I think this will end up being in the 300w-400w range. I don't really want a 750w heater if it's not needed, I think I would rather downsize to a 25cm bed instead, but I think 300w-300w should do it. It would be nice to use a 24v 350w Meanwell supply if possible, though I haven ruled out a SSR.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 07, 2018 08:52PM
I just ordered a 330mm x 330mm (13" x13") x 9.5mm (0.375") Mic6 aluminum plate.

Now I just have to decide if I want to go with a SSR and AC or 24V with a Meanwell PSU.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 07, 2018 09:27PM
I'm leaning towards the AC and SSR so that I don't have to buy the 24v PSU @500w.

The slight concern is all of the already made ones I am finding are 750w for a 30cm x 30cm 120VAC.
I see that they do have custom ones available, I'd have to educate myself on all the options to be sure to select one similar to the ones they already make for 3D printers. I'm not being lazy, just I'll still be sitting here days later if given too many choices lol.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 07, 2018 10:10PM
I ordered a 30cm x 30cm Keenovo 750w 120VAC heating element.
Next I guess I will look for a SSR. The Fotek SSR-25DA seems to be used fairly often.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 07, 2018 11:51PM
I ordered the Crydom D2425 that was suggested in the Duet hardware page. It was considerably more money then the Fotek, on the other hand it's a pretty important part. This way I know it is not a counterfeit as I purchased it from a Crydom distributor. It seems quite a few of the 25A Fotek on Amazon etc. may actually contain internals that can only handle half the current.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 07:10AM
I've never seen anyone reply to their own posts so many times, so quickly! No one can ever say you lack enthusiasm!

There seem to be a lot of crappy Fotek knock-offs around, so you did the right thing. You can get some idea of the time-to-temperature vs. power input relationship on this web site: [jscalc.io]

I use the same 750W heater on a 300x300x8mm plate and it gets to 100C for printing ABS in 4.5 minutes.

I put my printer's bed design on a blog page including the kinematic mount and info on a thermal cutoff to protect against SSR failure. I mounted the TCO on the bed plate, but it won't do its job if the heater comes off the bed plate, so it is best to put the TCO on the heater itself using high temperature silicone. I have recently found that the adhesive on the heater is starting to let go of the plate in my printer after two years of use. At some point in the near future, I'll peel it completely off the plate and reglue it with high temperature silicone.


Son of MegaMax 3D printer: [www.instructables.com]
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 07:57AM
Quote
Number_5
I just ordered a 330mm x 330mm (13" x13") x 9.5mm (0.375") Mic6 aluminum plate.

Now I just have to decide if I want to go with a SSR and AC or 24V with a Meanwell PSU.

Hi, great job updating your thread so fast. Can you give a link for the Mic6 plate? I am using the 750 watt keenovo pad with Cyrydom ssr too but my plate is only 1/8 thick.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 07:27PM
Quote
the_digital_dentist
I've never seen anyone reply to their own posts so many times, so quickly! No one can ever say you lack enthusiasm!

There seem to be a lot of crappy Fotek knock-offs around, so you did the right thing. You can get some idea of the time-to-temperature vs. power input relationship on this web site: [jscalc.io]

I use the same 750W heater on a 300x300x8mm plate and it gets to 100C for printing ABS in 4.5 minutes.

I put my printer's bed design on a blog page including the kinematic mount and info on a thermal cutoff to protect against SSR failure. I mounted the TCO on the bed plate, but it won't do its job if the heater comes off the bed plate, so it is best to put the TCO on the heater itself using high temperature silicone. I have recently found that the adhesive on the heater is starting to let go of the plate in my printer after two years of use. At some point in the near future, I'll peel it completely off the plate and reglue it with high temperature silicone.

Well I wasn't sure how long it would be for a response lol.

Thanks for the calculator link. It looks like with this setup I will get to PETG temperature (60C) in about 2.5 minutes. It would have been closer to 6 minutes with a 350watt heater. I guess I am OK with the 750watt now that it is ordered. In reality a 350watt may not be any safer then a 750watt, just depends on the failure mode I suppose.

If I am confident I can attach a TCO to the silicone pad securely I will do that, if not I will put it on the plate. It looks like the Keenovo pad has some fiberglass weaved into it, hopefully this is enough to grab onto some silicone.

I was wondering how long the glue would last, so your comment about the glue starting to let go is timely. I rarely go over 60C-65C on the bed so I could extrapolate that I should get at least the same amount of time.
I was wondering if i packed some fiberglass insulation underneath the heater and on top of the support underneath, if this pressure would help keep the pad pushed up against the plate. Perhaps a regular inspection for bubbles is a more pragmatic approach, as I wouldn't want to miss the heater starting to bubble if the fiberglass didn't hold it up.

I might have felt a little better if the heater was low enough wattage that it could run safely detached from the plate, although I don't know if that is the case. In realty I could always custom order a different one if compelled to do so.

I will check out your blog, I'm sure I've come across your material in the past.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 07:38PM
Quote
Holy1
Quote
Number_5
I just ordered a 330mm x 330mm (13" x13") x 9.5mm (0.375") Mic6 aluminum plate.

Now I just have to decide if I want to go with a SSR and AC or 24V with a Meanwell PSU.

Hi, great job updating your thread so fast. Can you give a link for the Mic6 plate? I am using the 750 watt keenovo pad with Cyrydom ssr too but my plate is only 1/8 thick.

Here is the link. MIC6 Aluminum Cast Plate

It set me back $100 Canadian before shipping and tax. I just went with something within the province because we have a rolling postal strike going on, I might not have saved much getting it from the States by the time I factor in potential customs etc.
Last night I did come across others who were getting ATP 5 plate from a place in the states for pretty cheap, I think it was Midwest metals and around $35 US plus shipping for 3/8".
That might have been the prudent choice for myself, but as I say the delay with mail strike and customs, I decided to splurge a bit to have what I wanted in a reasonable amount of time.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2018 07:39PM by Number_5.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 09:24PM
Thanks Number 5, I'm in Ontario so this good for me.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 09:36PM
That works.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2018 09:37PM by Number_5.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 08, 2018 11:15PM
Quote
Number_5
Last night I did come across others who were getting ATP 5 plate from a place in the states for pretty cheap, I think it was Midwest metals and around $35 US plus shipping for 3/8".

I bought ATP-5 from Midwest, and it came with multiple dings and substantial swarf in the box, poorly wrapped even though I asked for extra cardboard wrapping in the comments in my order.

I have since bought ALCA 5 from Howard Precision and it was less expensive, wrapped well, reasonably cleanly packed, and had no surface dings on multiple pieces.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 09, 2018 04:58AM
I kinda got the feeling that the pieces Midwest sold at that price may have been off-cuts or damaged pieces.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 09, 2018 10:06PM
Keenova sells genuine Fotek SSRs.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 09, 2018 10:23PM
Oh do they? I will have a look, thanks.

EDIT: DO you have a link, I found one combined with a P.I.D. controller, but not on it's own.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/09/2018 10:26PM by Number_5.
Re: What heater for Mic6 plate?
November 09, 2018 11:52PM
I found what is claimed to be a genuine 40 amp Fotek SSR.

The reason I switched is because DigiKey could not fulfill the order on the Crydom SSR. Kind of annoying but I suppose this Fotek is less money and has more headroom anyway, assuming it is in fact genuine.
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