Need help adding heated bed.

I have store bought printer (Tinkerine Ditto pro) that didn’t come with a heated bed.
Recently ordered the parts on eBay to install a standalone controller (110v digital thermostat called a XingHe) and heated silicone pad (200mm x 200mm 200w 110v). Unfortunately the thermostat is either faulty or I can’t figure out how to work it (heats up once but won’t stay hot)

So I’d like to tie into the main board instead. It appears the main board is a RAMPS 1.4, AT mega 2560 and the power supply is a Meanwell RSP-100-12.

The slicing software I normally use is Cura based but a modified version called Tinkerine Suite. This version does not give the ability to add g-code, instead it gives a handful of standard settings to change. The firmware I believe is Marlin v1.1.07b.

Can I trust this printer and use an aftermarket slicing software and add modified heated bed g-code? Or do I need to request the firmware from Tinkerine and use Arduino IDE and modify?

If this helps I can view all the g-code from every print done in the Tinkerine slicer. Over 1000 pages. All the end.code shows
“M140 S0. ;heated bed heater off (if you have it)”

So does this mean the Firmware is designed to receive an M140 command and doesn’t need to be changed? Anything I need to do or know? Just not wanting to cook any electronics


Thanks in advance and sorry if my lingo is incorrect in any way, new to this!

Well, your control board has an output for a heated bed, so there are a couple of things that you need to determine.

Can you update your firmware to support it? Marlin is more than capable, provided that you got the standard configuration files. Actually recompiling and updating the firmware is another matter, but it certainly should be possible. That probably means that the control board is a Mega 2560/RAMPS 1.4 (Actually looks like that's exactly what it is.)

A thermistor so that the printer can monitor bed temperature and a solid state resistor is probably better than the external thermostat. Or get a heated bed that runs from 12V, though you'll probably have to upgrade your power supply to do so. The silicone heat pad is better though.

Once you update your firmware to read the thermistor, you can use the heat bed output to control the SSR. That will allow you to set the heated bed temperature in the slicer. If the modified version doesn't support it, the standard one certainly does, as does Slic3r.

---

MBot3D Printer
MakerBot clone Kit from Amazon
Added heated bed.

Leadscrew self-built printer (in progress)
Duet Wifi, Precision Piezo parts

First of all I wanna thank you for saving me some grief SupraGuy! You mentioned a solid state relay which I totally missed out adding. I had the heated bed hooked right up to the D8 port. DOH! Grabbed one yesterday and have it all hooked up. Now to figure out the firmware dilemma
From what I can tell they don’t offer support for a heated bed in their firmware. I can’t really ask them because I told them off a while ago for voiding my warranty after using “3rd party filament”
I can’t even get this thing to print anything with Cura to try adding heated bed g-code for it. And Slic3r was a bit over my head last night.
If I create a file to export to the printer with Cura and Slic3r on an SD card it saves the file as a .gcode. Instead of with the Tinkerine software which saves files as .g
When I insert the SD card into the printer it normally shows a list of files on the card with a print time beside them, with the Cura and Slic3r they show 0:00. So something is amiss either with by way of user error with my slicer settings or the printer is so proprietary they have some sort of block function for attempting an alternative slicer

Not sure what my next step is

If anyone is good at transferring g-code into Slic3r let me know, I can show you what I have

If you have anything connected to D8, you need to have power plugged into the second power input (the 4 pin power plug, you only have half of it wired)
What ever voltage you put in the second half of the power plug will be on the output of d8 (dc 5 - 12v, not ac, not 110v!)

you need some sort of temperature measuring device the controller can use.. 100K @ 25c Thermistors are common, and can be directly connected to the controller
Thermo couples can be used but you also have the amplifier board for them.

Your firmware will need updated regardless, to set up the temperature probe.
And It looks like they don't provide any firmware source... Even though it says its marlin based and they have to provide source, its part of the license.

to see if a bed is set up at all request the temperature, send the machine a M106 It will tell you a bed temperature if it is setup. (but note: it will not be setup for your temperature probe, unless you somehow fluke it age get the same probe type)

Thanks for the reply Dust
Is this not the correct way to wire a bed? I understand the thermistor will probably read wrong. I have a spare to try that came with the digital thermostat or will find the appropriate one

Which program would you use to send an M106 and get a reading?

Will send an email to support on Monday unless someone has the source code kicking around to share

Looks good apart from the second power supply on the ramps I mentioned



The lower powers plug is for D9, D10, steppers motors and the mega
The upper power plug is for D8, so you also need to add 12v here
Your picture above shows the upper power plug empty.


As for software, I prefer printrun/pronterface Simple, great for diagnosing issues... multi platform... etc

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/2019 03:22AM by Dust.

... another possibility is to control the bed with a separate temp-controller -- did this sometimes with a heated bed or even with the extruder ... had then to remove all temperature relevant (feedback) G-codes from the printfiles ...

---

Viktor
--------
Aufruf zum Projekt "Müll-freie Meere" - [reprap.org] -- Deutsche Facebook-Gruppe - [www.facebook.com]

Call for the project "garbage-free seas" - [reprap.org]

Ahhh that’s what you were talking about! Thanks for the clarity
Do you think it’s ok to use either of these methods to power the other half? Looks like the ssr requires only 7.5ma to trigger



Off to install printrun. Thanks!

Both will work fine

I received the firmware and have the heated bed up and running! Thanks to the advice from here and 3dprintforum!

Now just trying to get the bugs worked out with how I’ve modified and uploaded the new firmware to the printer.

Issues right now.
1. I’d like to add code from the newer version of Marlin that has “thermal runaway protection”. Is it as simple as copy pasting that portion into the version I have in configuration.h... or are there tabs elsewhere that need to be modified...

2. With the modified Marlin uploaded I’m able to use the Tinkerine Suite slicer and have a heated bed that works, however when the print is complete or stopped the heated be stays on. Not sure which line to edit in the firmware to turn it off after printing. It can’t be done within that slicer due to limited functions.

Tempted daily to just buy Simplify3D as they have support for this printer, wish I was rich


If anyone knows Marlin source code I can send over the stock version and modified one to see if there’s any issues

The printer only does as it is told

no way to turn off bed other than a turn off bed gcode

is there no sort of end.gcode file to edit that all switch off command are added to?

You should publish the firmware you got somewhere... so others dont have to fight for it.

If the firmware really is v1.1.07b it does probably have thermal runaway inbuilt, not sure when it was added.

the current version looks like

/**
 * Thermal Protection provides additional protection to your printer from damage
 * and fire. Marlin always includes safe min and max temperature ranges which
 * protect against a broken or disconnected thermistor wire.
 *
 * The issue: If a thermistor falls out, it will report the much lower
 * temperature of the air in the room, and the the firmware will keep
 * the heater on.
 *
 * If you get "Thermal Runaway" or "Heating failed" errors the
 * details can be tuned in Configuration_adv.h
 */

#define THERMAL_PROTECTION_HOTENDS // Enable thermal protection for all extruders
#define THERMAL_PROTECTION_BED     // Enable thermal protection for the heated bed

and all you have to do is make sure the last two lines are not commented out.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/31/2019 10:13PM by Dust.

looking at the software Tinkerine Suite it uses cura internally (which is free)

and there is a

;End GCode
M104 S0 ;extruder heater off
M140 S0 ;heated bed heater off (if you have it)

this is from the end a a test slice with Tinkerine Suite
So it should turn off the bed

If you look in Program Files (x86)/Tinkerine Suite 2/Cura/current_profile.ini you can see the current settings and End GCode

Gonna have to come back to this. I may have killed something in the printer
It was missing some functions that it used to have like the nozzle purge and lower bed level and home X and Y axis. I then tried installing the firmware again and it was giving some “avrdude: stk500v2_ReceiveMessage(): timeout”
Then tried putting the original firmware back on and got a different set of errors and timeouts
Now all it will do is timeout, timeout, timeout blah blah. Ughhh

In way over my head now. Will likely post another thread later when I can figure out how to explain what I did when it happened

Good call on sharing the source code. Here it is

Tinkerine Marlin 1.1.07b source code

[s000.tinyupload.com]

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2019 01:12AM by Go.fish.

Interesting it may say version 1.1.07 but it looks like a much earlier version (v1.0 ish) no sign of any thermal protection code.

your probably going to have to get a copy of the latest marlin and copy and transcribe the setting from the old configuration.h to the new (nb they are not compatible, do not copy one over the other) but go through it and work out what each setting does and where it goes in the new configuration.h

Once you sort out the other issues...

Woohoo it works again, woke up this morning and deleted everything off the Mac... reinstalled everything starting with the USB driver. Then Arduino IDE, then the newest marlin firmware. Hooked the printer up, verified, installed, worked. Then uploaded the original marlin with some heated bed functions and tadaaa. No idea what was going on last night...
Just finished running a "M303 E-1 C8 S70" autotune command in pronterface (changed S90 to S70 to be safer)
Results:
"Classic PID
Kp: 135.03
Ki: 23.90
Kd: 190.71
PID Autotune finished! Put the last Kp, Ki and Kd constants from above into Configuration.h"

Do I simply change these number with results? they seem a fair bit different. Can't find my infrared thermometer right now and have no other way of verifying how accurate the current parameters are but it feels about right to the touch
Currently in the configuration.h file on the printer has this section uncommented.

#ifdef PIDTEMPBED
//120v 250W silicone heater into 4mm borosilicate (MendelMax 1.5+)
//from FOPDT model - kp=.39 Tp=405 Tdead=66, Tc set to 79.2, aggressive factor of .15 (vs .1, 1, 10)
#define DEFAULT_bedKp 10.00
#define DEFAULT_bedKi .023
#define DEFAULT_bedKd 305.4

Theres a new set of thermistor options in the newer version of marlin 1.1.9 that has a thermistor that would I would choose over option 1
currently using
" * 1 : 100k thermistor - best choice for EPCOS 100k (4.7k pullup)"
Should be?
" * 75 : 100k Generic Silicon Heat Pad with NTC 100K MGB18-104F39050L32 thermistor"

Thanks for clarifying that simply copy pasting the thermal protection wouldn't be compatible with the older version that it's running. I'll revisit this when I feel more comfortable understanding what everything in configuration.h means (likely never haha)

You rock Dust!

Quote
Go.fish
Do I simply change these number with results? they seem a fair bit different. Can't find my infrared thermometer right now and have no other way of verifying how accurate the current parameters are but it feels about right to the touch
Currently in the configuration.h file on the printer has this section uncommented.

yes you just change it in configuration.h

PID doesn't change the temperature, it adjusts the power to the heating element to get to the desired temperature rapidly and maintain it without over shooting or under shooting etc. (it profiles the characteristics of the heating element, to use it better)

yes you should set the correct thermistor for your hardware... With the wrong one the temperature shown may be different from reality. But the bed doesn't need to be that accurate.
Another good reason to upgrade to a current firmware.

Quote
Dust
yes you just change it in configuration.h

PID doesn't change the temperature, it adjusts the power to the heating element to get to the desired temperature rapidly and maintain it without over shooting or under shooting etc. (it profiles the characteristics of the heating element, to use it better)

yes you should set the correct thermistor for your hardware... With the wrong one the temperature shown may be different from reality. But the bed doesn't need to be that accurate.
Another good reason to upgrade to a current firmware.

Cool. Thanks for the PID explanation. This theory makes total sense if i were to use a 12v bed powered off the Ramps D8 port directly. However I’m only using the D8 port to give the SSR a signal to be either closed with 12v or open with less than 3v (3-32VDC input). From my understanding the switched (24-380VAC) side of the Relay provides power to heated bed with 120v on or off.
Either way changing or leaving the current PID settings may achieve the same results or better so not against changing them. Just for clarity do the PID settings in this case really effect the end result. ON/OFF vs. Variable voltage/watts to a 12v bed

Hey guys,
I stumbled onto this thread while looking for Tinkerine Ditto + (not DittoPro) configuration files and firmware to do exactly the same thing. I see I can just download and edit the DittoPro firmware, but not the Ditto +, and I'd like to start with the real original configuration if I can rather than just dumping new firmware on and feeling my way through the config... Anyone know where I could find some Ditto+ configuration files? Thanks