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New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please

Posted by jdebuhr 
New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 05, 2020 01:12PM
Hello all,

My wife bought me a 3D printer for Christmas. I have been wanting one for awhile. Anyway the one purchased was a RepRapGuru Kit (She got it on eBay, link: [www.ebay.com])

It took me a couple days to assemble it, wire it and get everything moving in a proper fashion. I have a spool of PLA filament and I am now working on getting that set up and ready to print. this is where the problem is.. I can get it to feed and I get filament through the nozzle no problem. I then try to print an object. I downloaded a 20mm Cube object from Thingiverse to print.

I used repetier-host to convert it, I put the file on a SD card and then try to print it.. Printer gets to temperature everything starts moving and I find nothing is coming out. filament starts to feed then stops, but the feeder stepper still is moving, so I spent 2 hours yesterday trying to figure out where the problem is, did not find anything.. tried again today, heated the hot end up to 230, feed filament trhough, no issues, heated the bed, started the print, saw it was taking the filament as it was moving in then stopped. it is almost like the hot end is getting cool or something, as the filament jams int he finned part.. I have attached a picture of the extruder assembly,

I want to get this working, even if it is a small object I would like to see it work. If there is anything I need to replace I am all for it. at this point I am frustrated and don't know what to try next

Thanks
Attachments:
open | download - IMG_1305.jpeg (535.4 KB)
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 05, 2020 02:14PM
Welcome smiling smiley
This sounds very much as if the hotend is clogging. One of the most likely reasons is heat creep, which is a feature of many cheap hotends. The printhead has five main parts in order of filament transport they are
the extruder, which pushes the filament
the cold end (often cooled by a fan), which guides the filament towards the
hot end, in which the filament is molten
the heating, which heats up the hot end
the nozzle, through which the molten filament is extruded

Heat creep happens when the cold end and the hot end are not well enough isolated (usually called the heat break) and heat creeps up into the cold end. There the filament heats up to early, gets soft, cloggs the pathway and stops further transport.
Sometimes better cooling of the cold end helps, but often enough only the replacement of the rubbish hotend provides a final solution.
Be aware that the term hotend is nowadays used for the whole thing from cold end to nozzle.

I found this diagramm of an E3D V6 hotend that shows the general design
[www.dsm.com]
The E3D is also one of the more reliable hotends, if you make sure to get an original. Knock offs might or might not work.
Hope this helps
Björn


[www.bonkers.de]
[merlin-hotend.de]
[www.hackerspace-ffm.de]
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 05, 2020 05:31PM
Thanks,

Looking at the image diagram you linked I know mine is nice as nice and organized. I will order a new Hotend assembly.

Another question, my Z axis only goes from 0-20 and it hit the top of the machine. I am guessing the step settings are not correct and are off by a factor of 10.

Where do I adjust for this or is the correct? Bed moves 200mm each direction and I am assuming the 20 for the Z in firmware is CM, however I am not sure that it should be that way. I realized my printer is running Marlin 1.1.6, I should probably upgrade it to 1.1 9
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 06, 2020 02:02AM
If Z translation is of then either the firmware is incorrectly set up, or the microstepping of the stepper drivers is set wrong. Z being wrong by a factor of 10 is very likely a firmware issue.
In general mm are used for all things positions and length.
If the manufacturer of the kit delivers it with Marlin he should have made the sourcecode available. If not you need to determine the correct parameters for your printer yourself. This claims to be a Prusa i3 clone, but i would not bet on it having identical parameters to the real thing.


[www.bonkers.de]
[merlin-hotend.de]
[www.hackerspace-ffm.de]
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 06, 2020 08:43AM
Did you install your own Marlin 1.1.6 firmware. If so post you configuration.h file to a share service like google Drive then post a link here.

I would bypass Marlin 1.1.6 you revering to Marlin 1.1 9BF though Marlin 2 is the best.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2020 08:43AM by Roberts_Clif.


Electronics Technician / Computer Programmer
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 06, 2020 09:45AM
Marlin 1.1.6 is what was "shipped" meaning I went to a google drive link to get it. but I still had to change a couple settings. the Drive link had the instructions to build the unit as well but some of the directions were completely different for the parts I had in the kit.

on the display the version shows as "RepRapGuru Marlin 1.1.6" I can post the config file when I am at home.


I did get the printer further along, I still will replace the Hotend, but things are at least progressing
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 07, 2020 07:30AM
I think Sreks point is still valid.
PLA does have the issue with heat creep and you are using 230 temp which is at the hot end for PLA. Some are down at 180C.
I would try extruding at lower temperatures. You can do this directly without a print. When you get to a lower temp that it strugles with then go up about 20C.
Also check any retraction settings. Retracting hot PLA is another potential problem. Since you have a direct extruder I would expect your retraction to be less than 1.5mm. I would try and keep it as small as possible for PLA.
Hope this helps.
Happy new year to all.
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 07, 2020 07:53AM
Thanks for the info, I forgot to mention one of the things I did was drop the temperature to 200 which helped.. I have not gotten back to it but hope to have some time tonight or tomorrow..
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 07, 2020 09:56PM
First print.. 20mm cube.. the top in the picture without my hand is the top. I don’t think I checked the nozzle before the print from the last attempt, going to print it again now that the nozzle is clean. This was printed at 210, trying 200 next.
Attachments:
open | download - 8684DC46-777F-4B89-9D77-CD40787EE6AE.jpeg (327.3 KB)
open | download - 3AA17E36-1E1F-487C-A201-779CC6F5EF16.jpeg (366.1 KB)
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 08, 2020 09:34AM
When starting out would print a Temperature Tower to see the temp best suited for the filament.


Electronics Technician / Computer Programmer
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 09, 2020 05:12AM
Also show us a picture with better lighting when you show a successful print because it's hard to judge now. One of the interesting things would also to show the bottom of the print so we can see if the first layer height is correct.


http://www.marinusdebeer.nl/
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 09, 2020 07:02AM
Thanks for the tip. I found that the hot end was leaking, so I am waiting on parts to replace the pieces. I will set it up and try again. Here is a picture of the bottom, not sure if the lighting is any better though
Attachments:
open | download - C97C2682-3BB9-4782-AC60-84246F8A9D24.jpeg (180.9 KB)
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 09, 2020 07:29AM
Quote
jdebuhr
Thanks for the tip. I found that the hot end was leaking, so I am waiting on parts to replace the pieces. I will set it up and try again. Here is a picture of the bottom, not sure if the lighting is any better though

Ahhh yes, better! The z-height also seems too high. If the hotend leaks you can also rebuild it yourself! It's usually a case of not being put together right.

The E3D needs to be assembled after being heated up. Otherwise the hotend falls apart when heated up because metals expand when heated.

This might be the issue!


http://www.marinusdebeer.nl/
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 09, 2020 08:01AM
Do the print starts at .3mm from the bed. Like I said I have pieces coming to have extras and yeah planned on heating it to tighten it fully.. then try again..
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 09, 2020 09:43AM
Quote
jdebuhr
Do the print starts at .3mm from the bed. Like I said I have pieces coming to have extras and yeah planned on heating it to tighten it fully.. then try again..

E3D official website has a nice guide on putting the hotend together. I suggest checking it out for some additional info on the best way to achieve this smiling smiley


http://www.marinusdebeer.nl/
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 14, 2020 10:48PM
After a week of getting pieces and reassembling. I printed 2 objects. Another cube and 3DBenchy. I used painters tape on the bed and it stuck to the objects. I will try glue sticks next
Attachments:
open | download - D3EB65CA-5EB7-4C48-AD75-F7090E17BDAC.jpeg (180.6 KB)
open | download - D66E1C64-FB2B-47B0-A60D-104066534787.jpeg (171.1 KB)
open | download - CA861BB7-8751-484E-8FDA-056A7735B7A9.jpeg (194.3 KB)
open | download - 881C076A-7E4A-4AA8-90FB-420C8AFEB050.jpeg (211.9 KB)
open | download - 5B0381FE-26B9-42B0-BA71-FE60D1A7594C.jpeg (203.5 KB)
open | download - 853DA4C1-DF96-4520-9384-E5BC79149D4C.jpeg (189.8 KB)
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 15, 2020 10:30AM
Quote
jdebuhr
After a week of getting pieces and reassembling. I printed 2 objects. Another cube and 3DBenchy. I used painters tape on the bed and it stuck to the objects. I will try glue sticks next

Keep your replacement parts for when something goes bad, you do not need to rebuild this hot end at this point. smiling smiley
Getting your hot end built correctly is essential. If you were leaking, then you need to tweak that. The E3D site gives excellent directions for the initial hot end build. You may not have an "all metal" hot end so I wouldn't go to the temperature that E3D says to use for theirs. In general I don't go over 240C when I do the final tightening of the nozzle up against the heat break.

Your Benchy print looks about as good as you can get from a stock Knock-off i3 clone!

IMO, do not bother with glue stick. If you do not have a heated bed, then blue tape is about the best stuff that you can use. It works great for both PLA and PETG.
I occasionally print ABS or some more exotic stuff so I have a heated bed. For a heated bed, a 3mm borosilicate glass plate and "Aquanet extra super hold unscented" hairspray works great. Blue tape loses it "grip" when it gets hot, so don't use blue tape on a heated bed.

Have fun,
DLC


Kits: He3D K200 Kossel, Folgertech Kossel 2020 upgraded E3Dv6, Anet A8 upgraded E3Dv6, Tevo Tarantula enhanced parts and dual-head
Scratch: Large bed Cartesian, Linear slide Delta, Maker-Beam XL Micro Delta
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 15, 2020 11:35AM
Sounds like with a heated bed and PLA just use Hairspray? or are you just using hairspray for the ABS and more exotic stuff?

Thanks I am glad the printer is working well for me now
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 15, 2020 05:18PM
Quote
jdebuhr
Sounds like with a heated bed and PLA just use Hairspray? or are you just using hairspray for the ABS and more exotic stuff?

Thanks I am glad the printer is working well for me now

For a heated glass bed, I use hairspray for everything. I have to admit that I have not printed things like nylon since I don't have an environment that is safe for that. I have done most other stuff though. Hairspray on borosilicate glass has worked for most everything so far...
I have printed PLA and PETG on blue tape, cold, with no issues at all.
The thing is, you need to have your Z end stop right and the bed MUST be flat for anything to print reliably.

DLC


Kits: He3D K200 Kossel, Folgertech Kossel 2020 upgraded E3Dv6, Anet A8 upgraded E3Dv6, Tevo Tarantula enhanced parts and dual-head
Scratch: Large bed Cartesian, Linear slide Delta, Maker-Beam XL Micro Delta
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 15, 2020 07:04PM
Quote
dlc60

The thing is, you need to have your Z end stop right and the bed MUST be flat for anything to print reliably.

DLC

Yes, I have definitely found that out.. I check bed level first then print. I have been reading about the auto level stuff, just not purchased anything yet.

I do have a glass heated bed. I was also just given a Mini RAMBo 1.3 and a Full Graphic Smart Controller..
Re: New to 3D printing, some help is needed, please
January 16, 2020 11:34AM
Quote
jdebuhr
Quote
dlc60

The thing is, you need to have your Z end stop right and the bed MUST be flat for anything to print reliably.

DLC

Yes, I have definitely found that out.. I check bed level first then print. I have been reading about the auto level stuff, just not purchased anything yet.

I do have a glass heated bed. I was also just given a Mini RAMBo 1.3 and a Full Graphic Smart Controller..

I don't want to speak out-of-school, but, I feel that board leveling firmware is really only useful on really large beds where you can't count on it being flat. Spend a little time making sure your printer is built square and solid, and that your bed is square to your print head, and you never need to bother.
Rambo boards are great controllers. You can set stepper current in the firmware instead of tearing your machine apart and juggling a set screw and DVM. Very cool.

Have fun,
DLC


Kits: He3D K200 Kossel, Folgertech Kossel 2020 upgraded E3Dv6, Anet A8 upgraded E3Dv6, Tevo Tarantula enhanced parts and dual-head
Scratch: Large bed Cartesian, Linear slide Delta, Maker-Beam XL Micro Delta
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