Folger Tech Kossel Delta 2020 Full 3D Printer Kit w/Auto-Level

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fuubar67
The arm are cut to 230mm from center of eyelet to eyelet, The manual asked that the rails to be set 170mm from the bottom, checked that 3 times. The resulting Z height ended up to be 264mm, I can adjust that and see what happens.

I still have an issue that the software allows the soft end stops reach the corners even if the build area is circular. Is there a max bed radius setting?

This is the section Tim is referring to above The radius is created autoamtically from all of the settings that you enter at this location. The location of your probe also makes a difference in what your build location is during the bed leveling routine. If you have your location off then it will try to reach a point it shouldn't. The picture should correspond to the X/Y coordinates of the z probe in relation to the settings in your firmware for the location of the z probe.

Also, this is described in the configuration manual located at the google drive in step 15 utilizing the Folgertech firmware.

[drive.google.com]




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/04/2015 10:01PM by thevisad.

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tadawson
There is in 1.0.3 . . . not sure about the stuff Folger provides, since I walked away from it about 5 days in . . . but in the new stuff, at least, you set DELTA_PRINTABLE_RADIUS in the Delta section to set that limit.

- Tim

The folger tech version of firmware does not have the DELTA_PRINTABLE_RADIUS, they are using the soft end stops and the machine over travels, thinking it has a square work area. I'll start moving to later version firmware or try to configure version from repetier. I looked for revision of the FW but cant find anything in the source code.

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fuubar67

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tadawson
There is in 1.0.3 . . . not sure about the stuff Folger provides, since I walked away from it about 5 days in . . . but in the new stuff, at least, you set DELTA_PRINTABLE_RADIUS in the Delta section to set that limit.

- Tim

The folger tech version of firmware does not have the DELTA_PRINTABLE_RADIUS, they are using the soft end stops and the machine over travels, thinking it has a square work area. I'll start moving to later version firmware or try to configure version from repetier. I looked for revision of the FW but cant find anything in the source code.

The version they use is based off of 1.0, the firmware I linked you is my branch of 1.0.3 dev that has all of the settings for the Folgertech moved over as well as additional settings for rail offsets.

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thevisad

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fuubar67
The arm are cut to 230mm from center of eyelet to eyelet, The manual asked that the rails to be set 170mm from the bottom, checked that 3 times. The resulting Z height ended up to be 264mm, I can adjust that and see what happens.

I still have an issue that the software allows the soft end stops reach the corners even if the build area is circular. Is there a max bed radius setting?

This is the section Tim is referring to above The radius is created autoamtically from all of the settings that you enter at this location. The location of your probe also makes a difference in what your build location is during the bed leveling routine. If you have your location off then it will try to reach a point it shouldn't. The picture should correspond to the X/Y coordinates of the z probe in relation to the settings in your firmware for the location of the z probe.

Also, this is described in the configuration manual located at the google drive in step 15 utilizing the Folgertech firmware.

[drive.google.com]

83e0452490.png

Thanks for pointing out the location of the servo. Their manual insists on servo being on the back, so if you apply probe offset y=15 the machine runs out of room during auto leveling.
I rotated the servo facing front and now the machine will complete the auto leveling.

Thank you for your help. The major issue was the orientation of the probe. The build manual shows the probe oriented to the back of the machine.

Now that I have the basic working machine, I can start making improvements.

Again, thank you very much

Situation:

The instruction document mentions a 7/8 (= 0.875) inch blue painter's tape. But that size is not sold in my country. The only similar size I can purchase here, is the 0.94 inch blue painter's tape. Can this diameter work, or not? Who can assist me with the answer? Thanks.

PS: why is the word "melborP" (read backwards) banned?

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2015 06:47AM by Sven.L.

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Sven.L

PS: why is the word "melborP" (read backwards) banned?

Somethings wrong, i can't type anything that isn't banned. I had a hard time with the next sentences. It's just creates a bed for you to build on, be aware ABS doesn't stick to that tape very well. You need the K tape for ABS, I don't print in PLA but I think K tape works for that too?

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2015 08:51AM by thevisad.

Thanks.

Banning: hope the staff recognizes something is wrong.

Hi

I've been using my 2020 for about a month now. No real problems other than errors in the installation documents. THEN, I tried to install the LCD display that I purchased from FolgerTech. I have not found any documentation on the display installation. I did use a flick from youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wP0LlOF8z58) that led me to the proper way to plug the device into the RAMPS board as well as a hint about configuration changes that may or may not be required. I tried using the config changes suggested in the flick. No go. So I reverted back to the FolgerTech provided Marlin. As a result I have the following results:

With the PC to Arduino USB cable unplugged, powering up the Arduino gives me cooling fan rotation but no life in the display (as if not attached)
With the PC to Arduino USB cable installed, PC on, but the power supply for the printer off, I get the display illuminated, but with no display content. (Arduino not powered ???) The contrast pot works as expected.
With the PC to Arduino USB cable installed, PC on, power supply for the printer on, the printer works as it did prior to the installation of the display (Repetier controls the printer).

If you have that bit of knowledge that I am missing, I would really appreciate your assistance.

Bill

Ok, I have to ask. The pictures here show small carriers running on a track/rail attached to the extruded aluminum. The pictures in the folger 2020 Kossel on ebay, and at the Kossell site, show wheeled carriers running in the groves of the 2020 extrusions. The folger site says nylon slider wheels. Which actually comes with this printer?

And which works better? Linear track, or wheeled trucks? I see both on delta printers, but most of the larger ones seem to have wheeled trucks.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2015 06:10PM by Bert3D.

Quote
robodog
Hi

I've been using my 2020 for about a month now. No real problems other than errors in the installation documents. THEN, I tried to install the LCD display that I purchased from FolgerTech. I have not found any documentation on the display installation. I did use a flick from youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wP0LlOF8z58) that led me to the proper way to plug the device into the RAMPS board as well as a hint about configuration changes that may or may not be required. I tried using the config changes suggested in the flick. No go. So I reverted back to the FolgerTech provided Marlin. As a result I have the following results:

With the PC to Arduino USB cable unplugged, powering up the Arduino gives me cooling fan rotation but no life in the display (as if not attached)
With the PC to Arduino USB cable installed, PC on, but the power supply for the printer off, I get the display illuminated, but with no display content. (Arduino not powered ???) The contrast pot works as expected.
With the PC to Arduino USB cable installed, PC on, power supply for the printer on, the printer works as it did prior to the installation of the display (Repetier controls the printer).

If you have that bit of knowledge that I am missing, I would really appreciate your assistance.

Bill

Arduino/RAMPS is well known for its inability to supply much current on the +5V rail. Looks like the LCD backlight is overloading the voltage regulator on the Arduino. Fixes include:

1. Feed external 5V power to the printer, either via the USB port or directly.

2. Replace the Arduino by a Taurino, which has a better voltage regulator.

3. Rewire the LCD backlight to take power from +12V through a series resistor instead of from +5V.

4. Ditch the crappy Arduino/RAMPS clone electronics and get something better.

As the LCD doesn't work when you provide 5V power from USB, you also have a firmware configuration problem.

If it is a graphical LCD, then you won't get to work on a delta under Marlin without messing up the print quality. Some people say that Repetier handles it better.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2015 06:57PM by dc42.

---

Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Quote
Bert3D
Ok, I have to ask. The pictures here show small carriers running on a track/rail attached to the extruded aluminum. The pictures in the folger 2020 Kossel on ebay, and at the Kossell site, show wheeled carriers running in the groves of the 2020 extrusions. The folger site says nylon slider wheels. Which actually comes with this printer?

And which works better? Linear track, or wheeled trucks? I see both on delta printers, but most of the larger ones seem to have wheeled trucks.

Looks like they finally "designed" their own printer. What I noticed in the new post is that the printer they are now using metal corners. They did away with the rails and went to the wheels, which would have lowered the overall cost 30-40$, but they added the sensor and the corners and that is offsetting the cost. Rails are more precise at a higher cost, wheels are better for using the full length of your rails and cost a lot less to repair/replace.

Holy shit. They just upgraded all the parts I've been having trouble with, AND drop the price? Talk about a kick to the crotch. They just gave me flack about asking for more T-nuts cause they shorted me.

Got it two weeks ago and I still can't get the damn thing to even move the motors...

Fantastic.

(yes i'm gonna whine and cry about it)

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fattmann
Holy shit. They just upgraded all the parts I've been having trouble with, AND drop the price? Talk about a kick to the crotch. They just gave me flack about asking for more T-nuts cause they shorted me.

Got it two weeks ago and I still can't get the damn thing to even move the motors...

Fantastic.

(yes i'm gonna whine and cry about it)

I don't think they are using openbuild v wheels, the wheels in this picture look rounded, not v notched. Says they are nylon wheels, which are not these (poly) http://openbuildspartstore.com/xtreme-solid-v-wheel/ I am considering buying 20 of those, but only need 9.

Ironically, you can see the gap due to the corners being extruded wrong in thier photos . . . for those of you whonhave read my thread on that topic . . .

The good news is that they finally got rid of the crap extruder block thatbate bearings!

And myself, having gotten my rails smooth with nothing more than ample lube and use, I'm not sure I see the wheels as anything other than a downgrade . . . and not having the linear rails bolted to the frame (9 places each) will likely reduce the overall rigidity of the frame.

- Tim

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2015 12:22AM by tadawson.

Hey, and it's me again! With the next problem:

Instruction:
Base and Top Corners
Slide the 300mm aluminum extrusion on to the T-Nuts, tighten the screws from the other side, the T-Nuts will swivel and lock in place.

Alrite, done. I tightened the bolts as much as possible, and as far as I was able to ensure when sliding the aluminum extrusion into the right place, the T-nuts are all at the right position, too. But still, some of the aluminum extrusions are able to move in and out. What's wrong? And how to solve? Are there spare bolts I can use or are the bolts counted and included to the exact number as needed?

Even worse: on attempting to fix them firm, a fine metal dust appears, and the result is that these bolts cannot be fastened anymore nor opened, as the hexagonal hole for the hex key is now too widened. The metal of these bolts appears as way too soft. Not a good quality. I have now even the problem to get those widened bolts out, in order to exchange them with other bolts. Any idea?

Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2015 05:31AM by Sven.L.

If the bolts are not bottomed out in the channel when the t-nuts are tightened as much as possible and the extrusions are still loose, you will need to place a shim between the extrusion and the corner bracket to take up the slack.

Vise-grips work to grab the outside of the bolt head if the socket is stripped.

Rick

Quote
Sven.L
Hey, and it's me again! With the next problem:

Instruction:
Base and Top Corners
Slide the 300mm aluminum extrusion on to the T-Nuts, tighten the screws from the other side, the T-Nuts will swivel and lock in place.

Alrite, done. I tightened the bolts as much as possible, and as far as I was able to ensure when sliding the aluminum extrusion into the right place, the T-nuts are all at the right position, too. But still, some of the aluminum extrusions are able to move in and out. What's wrong? And how to solve? Are there spare bolts I can use or are the bolts counted and included to the exact number as needed?

Even worse: on attempting to fix them firm, a fine metal dust appears, and the result is that these bolts cannot be fastened anymore nor opened, as the hexagonal hole for the hex key is now too widened. The metal of these bolts appears as way too soft. Not a good quality. I have now even the problem to get those widened bolts out, in order to exchange them with other bolts. Any idea?

We stripped several hex bolts during our build- we found that a left-hand drill bit worked very well. You can pickup a set of smaller ones at Harbor Freight.

Quote
tadawson
Ironically, you can see the gap due to the corners being extruded wrong in thier photos . . . for those of you whonhave read my thread on that topic . . .

The good news is that they finally got rid of the crap extruder block thatbate bearings!

And myself, having gotten my rails smooth with nothing more than ample lube and use, I'm not sure I see the wheels as anything other than a downgrade . . . and not having the linear rails bolted to the frame (9 places each) will likely reduce the overall rigidity of the frame.

- Tim

I have not read your post and I may very well end up with a set of the corners, is there a link that I missed?

And the bottom corners are split frame rigidity is all depending on a few tiny bolts,by what I can see.
Well, making a few extra holes is not that hard I suppose and plates to cover the bottom rails would also help and look good too.

Cheers!

Thanks for the two good and helpful advises. I will try to get both items you two mentioned.

QUESTION
How many of these M3x8mm botls are actually needed for the construction?

[forums.reprap.org]

- Tim

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SlowFoot

Quote
tadawson
Ironically, you can see the gap due to the corners being extruded wrong in thier photos . . . for those of you whonhave read my thread on that topic . . .

The good news is that they finally got rid of the crap extruder block thatbate bearings!

And myself, having gotten my rails smooth with nothing more than ample lube and use, I'm not sure I see the wheels as anything other than a downgrade . . . and not having the linear rails bolted to the frame (9 places each) will likely reduce the overall rigidity of the frame.

- Tim

I have not read your post and I may very well end up with a set of the corners, is there a link that I missed?

And the bottom corners are split frame rigidity is all depending on a few tiny bolts,by what I can see.
Well, making a few extra holes is not that hard I suppose and plates to cover the bottom rails would also help and look good too.

Cheers!

You need to be certain that the T nuts rotate into position - if the alignment is off, they won't, and then all you get is the screw dug into the back of the channel, and looseness. And when they do rotate correctly, there is zero need to go gorilla fist on the torque - they hold solidly when just firmly snug, and I built my entire printer (as well as rebuilt it once) with not so much as a nick on any of the hardware, and nothing moves.

If the printed corners are splitting, again, lay off with the gorilla fist . . . this is 3mm hardware, not semi lug nuts . . .

What I ended up doing was holding the nut closest to the corner horizonal with a hex key or screwdriver shaft while fitting the extrusion, and then looking doen the extrusion at the other one, and helping it rotate with a small screwdriver if it was not doing so by itself.

- Tim

Quote
Sven.L
Hey, and it's me again! With the next problem:

Instruction:
Base and Top Corners
Slide the 300mm aluminum extrusion on to the T-Nuts, tighten the screws from the other side, the T-Nuts will swivel and lock in place.

Alrite, done. I tightened the bolts as much as possible, and as far as I was able to ensure when sliding the aluminum extrusion into the right place, the T-nuts are all at the right position, too. But still, some of the aluminum extrusions are able to move in and out. What's wrong? And how to solve? Are there spare bolts I can use or are the bolts counted and included to the exact number as needed?

Even worse: on attempting to fix them firm, a fine metal dust appears, and the result is that these bolts cannot be fastened anymore nor opened, as the hexagonal hole for the hex key is now too widened. The metal of these bolts appears as way too soft. Not a good quality. I have now even the problem to get those widened bolts out, in order to exchange them with other bolts. Any idea?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2015 03:39PM by tadawson.

Hi.

The T-nuts are all fitting, I made sure that. mentioned it before. :-)

I just think, because the nuts are made of cheap and too soft metal, it is not possible to really fasten them good enough. I will try to replace them with nuts of a better quality.

But my question now is, how many M3-8mm bolts are required for the construction of the Kossel 2020?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2015 04:09PM by Sven.L.

Quote
Sven.L
Hi.

The T-nuts are all fitting, I made sure that. mentioned it before. :-)

I just think, because the nuts are made of cheap and too soft metal, it is not possible to really fasten them good enough. I will try to replace them with nuts of a better quality.

But my question now is, how many M3-8mm bolts are required for the construction of the Kossel 2020?

The nuts are made of steel, the rails aluminum. The rails would give before the nuts. If they won't seat then the screws are too long. 10mm is really the max length you can use. Pull out your ruler and look at the screws length.

Does anyone have a direct link to the Folgertech Google drive site? i cant seem to find it off the site, i see that "Rev B" is out now on the Kossel Kit

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Rattfink
Does anyone have a direct link to the Folgertech Google drive site? i cant seem to find it off the site, i see that "Rev B" is out now on the Kossel Kit

Look in the post up above with the triangle picture

I ran into a problem with T-Nuts not being able to lock down because the corner STL had a pad under the screw that prevented the drop in T-Nut from tightening down all the way.



Not sure if this a problem on Folger but I ran into it on another Kossel kit with T-Nuts.

Roger

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thevisad
Look in the post up above with the triangle picture

DERP! sorry.. i should rtfm more.

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Rattfink

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thevisad
Look in the post up above with the triangle picture

DERP! sorry.. i should rtfm more.

Lol not an issue was in the car and i thought I had just linked it.

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llamatrails

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fattmann
It seems that the PC will only recognize the Arduino if I plug it in without the power supply running. Once the PC recognizes it, then I can plug in the power supply- is this normal?

If I have the power supply connected AT ALL Pronterface will not recognize it.

I have found your symptoms to be somewhat normal if your power supply is wired in backwards. Quadruple check that the polarity is correct. Then, check again.

Rick

I DID have the polarity swapped- however it does the same issue. Everytime I get any error, or close Pronterface, I have to restart to get it to recognize it again... on my Desktop. I switched back to my laptop and don't seem to have the exact same issue. However I still have to plug the printer into my laptop before plugging in the power supply or it will not recognize it.

Also if the power supply is plugged in and it ISN'T plugged into the PC, I will get a repeating double blinking green light on the RAMPS. When the LEDs flash the power supply's fan will slow down, almost as if the current draw is too high and the whole thing is labored... Seems very odd for the small LEDs to stress the PSU out that much.

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tadawson
Any chance you are on the wrong thermistor port? There are three on tne RAMPS, and you are only using two . . . And is your MOTHERBOARD definition set to type 33? The RAMPS really does not have much on it to fail - it is mainly a pin fanout for the Arduino . . . and heater power control.

- Tim

The pins the build manual called out were all wrong. I plugged the bed into the hotend, and the hotend into the third port it said to leave empty and I am getting readings on the correct device. I can get the hotend to heat up, but not the bed. Motherboard is defined as 33.

I get a final line of

echo: SD int fail

once it connects to Pronterface.

Sometimes a

[ERROR] Can't write to printer (disconnected?)(serialException): Write timeout

Once I get that error it's done dealing, I lose control of the hotend, and have to unplug it.

Also I still haven't been able to get any of the motors to fire. G28 does nothing, just sit there and say SENDING:G28 and never do anything, even if I send it before the error.

What should I be worried about at this point?