Ebay SINTRON Kossel Mini full kit

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CrisCG
I'm starting to have trouble with prints lifting up... when i started to print, first few days, nothing was lifting. Strange!

Do you mean warping? Maybe you need to recalibrate?

yes, warping near the edges. i did try to recalibrate, but there was nothing to calibrate, everything was good. I Put 3 sheet's of paper near the base. Looks like it's helping, now there's just a slight hint of warping.

Also, i tried to print ABS. I failed to make a good print. Bad first layer adhesion, hotend @ 245 degrees and the bed at 110 and still using hairspray. Is it that harder to print ABS, compared to PLA?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2016 01:43PM by CrisCG.

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CrisCG
yes, warping near the edges. i did try to recalibrate, but there was nothing to calibrate, everything was good. I Put 3 sheet's of paper near the base. Looks like it's helping, now there's just a slight hint of warping.

Also, i tried to print ABS. I failed to make a good print. Bad first layer adhesion, hotend @ 245 degrees and the bed at 110 and still using hairspray. Is it that harder to print ABS, compared to PLA?

Yes, it is, the warping is worse. Your PLA warping is also the case of bad first layer adhesion. Whether it's due to underextrusion, bad surface or calibration issue I don't know, but probably one of those causes.

Why do all my prints lean to the left ?
I am having calibration issues (I think),everything I print tends to lean to the left. My upright tower axis are all very very slightly off from being totally straight up.
A full strip down and rebuild might be called for. Has anyone got any tips on how to get the uprights perfectly straight and how best to get the 60 degree corners without digital angle finders ?

I'm not having much luck with my printer, I can't get the bed level everywhere, my uprights are not straight, I blocked my hothead twice in 2 days and now my filament keeps snapping.
What's the easiest way of getting the filament out of the hot head and back up the ptfe tube, it snapped just at the edge of the extruder motor, but the tip is not blocked (I hope).

Hope someone can help with these.

Thanks
Ant

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hacker

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DRTak
So my Sintron Kossel cracked. I was auto leveling the bed and for some reason it decided to ram itself into the glass bed. I hit stop. But I heard something snap. I looked and couldnt find the issue. I tried to auto level and noticed the z side was messed up. I looked at the upper corner frame and the Z corner cracked. For now I have tightened the screw as much as possible but its still loose. I can print but not that well. I have ordered aluminum corners. Soon to be delivered. So another list in my Sintron upgrades. One of the only things left are the E3D hotend replacement and upgrading to a metal effector.

Upgrades now:
Changed from Ramps 1.4 to duet 0.6
Changed from Sintron Rods to Traxxas carbon rods
Changed from Sintron carriages to ABS molded carriages and wheels
Changed Sintron Gt2 belts to aftermarket Gt2 belts
Plastic Sintron Printed Frame corners to aluminum machined corners.
Analog Z probe to Dc42 IR probe
LCD 2004 by Sintron to PanelDUE by dc42 touch screen

Upgrades to Go:
Metal effector
New hotend?
Metal effector bottom plate

Obviously, it would be cheaper to order parts and build it from scratch, but I know I wouldn't do that ;-) Though I still have original corners and carriages… Actually, I have a lot — movement motors, belts and pulleys, endstops, heatbed, bolts and nuts.

If my corner cracked I'd probably glue it and print one (or more likely — three) in PETG

Well knowing what I know now, I could build one from scratch and it would likely be cheaper.

So my metal corners finally came in. I slowly put them together. Checked for the corners to be 60 deg from each other. I didnt do this the first time I made it. Then made sure the vertical parts are 90 deg. Printed the new endstop holders in PETG. Attached that. Then decided to make another change. Move all electronics below the bed and have a dedicated fan blowing over the chips.

So I analyzed the Sintron printed parts after removing them. The Z and Y upper corners were cracked were the screws were. The z bottom corner was cracked where the screws were. All bottom corner parts were warped where the NEMA motors connect to it. I assume the motors got too hot and melted the plastic. It then allowed for the motor tilt upward with the plastic giving the pulley a very slight tilt.

I also made sure that I used the pronterface axis orientation when putting the motors down. I made sure that they are x, Z, y going clockwise. Close to starting to print. Will shoot pics of my "NEW" Sintron machine soon.

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DRTak

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hacker

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DRTak
So my Sintron Kossel cracked. I was auto leveling the bed and for some reason it decided to ram itself into the glass bed. I hit stop. But I heard something snap. I looked and couldnt find the issue. I tried to auto level and noticed the z side was messed up. I looked at the upper corner frame and the Z corner cracked. For now I have tightened the screw as much as possible but its still loose. I can print but not that well. I have ordered aluminum corners. Soon to be delivered. So another list in my Sintron upgrades. One of the only things left are the E3D hotend replacement and upgrading to a metal effector.

Upgrades now:
Changed from Ramps 1.4 to duet 0.6
Changed from Sintron Rods to Traxxas carbon rods
Changed from Sintron carriages to ABS molded carriages and wheels
Changed Sintron Gt2 belts to aftermarket Gt2 belts
Plastic Sintron Printed Frame corners to aluminum machined corners.
Analog Z probe to Dc42 IR probe
LCD 2004 by Sintron to PanelDUE by dc42 touch screen

Upgrades to Go:
Metal effector
New hotend?
Metal effector bottom plate

Obviously, it would be cheaper to order parts and build it from scratch, but I know I wouldn't do that ;-) Though I still have original corners and carriages… Actually, I have a lot — movement motors, belts and pulleys, endstops, heatbed, bolts and nuts.

If my corner cracked I'd probably glue it and print one (or more likely — three) in PETG

Well knowing what I know now, I could build one from scratch and it would likely be cheaper.

So my metal corners finally came in. I slowly put them together. Checked for the corners to be 60 deg from each other. I didnt do this the first time I made it. Then made sure the vertical parts are 90 deg. Printed the new endstop holders in PETG. Attached that. Then decided to make another change. Move all electronics below the bed and have a dedicated fan blowing over the chips.

So I analyzed the Sintron printed parts after removing them. The Z and Y upper corners were cracked were the screws were. The z bottom corner was cracked where the screws were. All bottom corner parts were warped where the NEMA motors connect to it. I assume the motors got too hot and melted the plastic. It then allowed for the motor tilt upward with the plastic giving the pulley a very slight tilt.

I also made sure that I used the pronterface axis orientation when putting the motors down. I made sure that they are x, Z, y going clockwise. Close to starting to print. Will shoot pics of my "NEW" Sintron machine soon.

Indeed you can build one for cheaper now, what Sintron does well for its money is teaching us things ;-)

Interesting things have happened to your corners. I wonder if the same happened to mine and for whatever reason I can't see it (I've just tried to check without disassembling and they seem to be intact.

And yes, I'm not sure how you move your electronics under the bed, but, just in case, this is what I've done — [www.thingiverse.com] (in case duet 0.6 has the same dimensions like 0.8.5 may be useful for you).

when i removed the sheets of paper that were around the printbed, the warping is really bad.

Also there's a lot of stringing. I guess i have a lot more fine tuning to make. I know temperature has a lot to do with the stringing. My PLA supplier told me it's printed best at 210, so i tried to go down to 190, but it's still bad, as it can be seen in the picture.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2016 03:36PM by CrisCG.

Quote
CrisCG
when i removed the sheets of paper that were around the printbed, the warping is really bad.

Also there's a lot of stringing. I guess i have a lot more fine tuning to make. I know temperature has a lot to do with the stringing. My PLA supplier told me it's printed best at 210, so i tried to go down to 190, but it's still bad, as it can be seen in the picture.

To deal with stringing you probably need to tune retraction length/speed and travel speed. Warping looks like ABS… But whatever the material is, you probably want to do something about bed adhering and temperature. How hot is your bed, pardon for privacy intrusion?

Printing a rim instead of a skirt around the part also helps against warping.

I had to retighten my corners and steppers after one month of use, because I had PETG corners and almost all screws got loose. Plastic is creeping under pressure.
Use washers where possible.

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Electric ant
I blocked my hothead twice in 2 days ...

If you are printing with PLA, it's recommended to use heatbreak throat with PTFE tube inside (I'm printing using such throat). Bare metal throat tends to stick to PLA (someone suggested to add a drop of oil to filament in this case and I read that it really helps, but I did not try this method actually).

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CrisCG
when i removed the sheets of paper that were around the printbed, the warping is really bad.

Also there's a lot of stringing. I guess i have a lot more fine tuning to make. I know temperature has a lot to do with the stringing. My PLA supplier told me it's printed best at 210, so i tried to go down to 190, but it's still bad, as it can be seen in the picture.

I see bad bed adhesion. I'm using blue tape with PLA and it's rarely happens to me.

So... thick stringing is due to low retraction. For 1meter Bowden tube I used 8mm retraction length at 50mm/s speed and still had slight strings. Now for 40cm tube I use 3.5mm retraction.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/08/2016 05:22AM by GrAndAG.

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hacker

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DRTak

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hacker

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DRTak
So my Sintron Kossel cracked. I was auto leveling the bed and for some reason it decided to ram itself into the glass bed. I hit stop. But I heard something snap. I looked and couldnt find the issue. I tried to auto level and noticed the z side was messed up. I looked at the upper corner frame and the Z corner cracked. For now I have tightened the screw as much as possible but its still loose. I can print but not that well. I have ordered aluminum corners. Soon to be delivered. So another list in my Sintron upgrades. One of the only things left are the E3D hotend replacement and upgrading to a metal effector.

Upgrades now:
Changed from Ramps 1.4 to duet 0.6
Changed from Sintron Rods to Traxxas carbon rods
Changed from Sintron carriages to ABS molded carriages and wheels
Changed Sintron Gt2 belts to aftermarket Gt2 belts
Plastic Sintron Printed Frame corners to aluminum machined corners.
Analog Z probe to Dc42 IR probe
LCD 2004 by Sintron to PanelDUE by dc42 touch screen

Upgrades to Go:
Metal effector
New hotend?
Metal effector bottom plate

Obviously, it would be cheaper to order parts and build it from scratch, but I know I wouldn't do that ;-) Though I still have original corners and carriages… Actually, I have a lot — movement motors, belts and pulleys, endstops, heatbed, bolts and nuts.

If my corner cracked I'd probably glue it and print one (or more likely — three) in PETG

Well knowing what I know now, I could build one from scratch and it would likely be cheaper.

So my metal corners finally came in. I slowly put them together. Checked for the corners to be 60 deg from each other. I didnt do this the first time I made it. Then made sure the vertical parts are 90 deg. Printed the new endstop holders in PETG. Attached that. Then decided to make another change. Move all electronics below the bed and have a dedicated fan blowing over the chips.

So I analyzed the Sintron printed parts after removing them. The Z and Y upper corners were cracked were the screws were. The z bottom corner was cracked where the screws were. All bottom corner parts were warped where the NEMA motors connect to it. I assume the motors got too hot and melted the plastic. It then allowed for the motor tilt upward with the plastic giving the pulley a very slight tilt.

I also made sure that I used the pronterface axis orientation when putting the motors down. I made sure that they are x, Z, y going clockwise. Close to starting to print. Will shoot pics of my "NEW" Sintron machine soon.

Indeed you can build one for cheaper now, what Sintron does well for its money is teaching us things ;-)

Interesting things have happened to your corners. I wonder if the same happened to mine and for whatever reason I can't see it (I've just tried to check without disassembling and they seem to be intact.

And yes, I'm not sure how you move your electronics under the bed, but, just in case, this is what I've done — [www.thingiverse.com] (in case duet 0.6 has the same dimensions like 0.8.5 may be useful for you).

The new metal corner bottoms are larger than the printed Sintron ones by one 2020 frame height. So I was able to tuck the duet 0.6 between the frame corners with the ethernet plug and USb plug facing out of the opening made by the extra height. I saw your post about that duet frame and feet and really wanted to print it out. But I would need to buy a thread maker to make the threads in the 2020 frame to mount the printed feet. That is what is stopping me.

Quote
o_lampe
Printing a rim instead of a skirt around the part also helps against warping.

I had to retighten my corners and steppers after one month of use, because I had PETG corners and almost all screws got loose. Plastic is creeping under pressure.
Use washers where possible.

I like how PETG looks printed. I was going to print my corner with PETG but decided against it because of its flexability. Im glad I didnt do it then.

Also, I dont think you answered why you sold off your delta?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/08/2016 04:07PM by DRTak.

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DRTak
The new metal corner bottoms are larger than the printed Sintron ones by one 2020 frame height. So I was able to tuck the duet 0.6 between the frame corners with the ethernet plug and USb plug facing out of the opening made by the extra height. I saw your post about that duet frame and feet and really wanted to print it out. But I would need to buy a thread maker to make the threads in the 2020 frame to mount the printed feet. That is what is stopping me.

Oops, I forgot I already shared it ;-) Well, yes, if your corners are higher maybe you don't want this design. As for making threads, I don't think it's strictly necessary, you can even print vertical plastic rods instead of screws, gravity does its job. At least at my latitude and altitude ;-)

The problem was bad bed adhesion. Problem solved using glue stick with a bit of hair spray on top. It's hard to remove the parts, even after it cools down. The bed can be cleaned easely with vinegar.

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DrTak
Also, I dont think you answered why you sold off your delta?

While I built my delta, I could have sold three of them to interested friends who didn't have the time/skills to build one themselves.

PETG is a pretty tough material, the corners were solid and the loosening screws were a one_time thing.
I'd have built another delta, but got distracted by the ideas for a laser-cutter.

I can print ABS now too, first layer sticks great. But after about 30-40 min of printing, the bed being set to 100, i get an error, it says the bed got disconected, so i am unable to finish the print. I unplug it from power and USB, plug it in without changing anything else, and now it works again. Maybe there's a weak connection somewhere? Maybe the soldering under the bed? I did use a bit more solder than was needed. It was very difficult to solder, because the heatbed was absorbing the heat.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2016 05:38AM by CrisCG.

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CrisCG
I can print ABS now too, first layer sticks great. But after about 30-40 min of printing, the bed being set to 100, i get an error, it says the bed got disconected, so i am unable to finish the print. I unplug it from power and USB, plug it in without changing anything else, and now it works again. Maybe there's a weak connection somewhere? Maybe the soldering under the bed? I did use a bit more solder than was needed. It was very difficult to solder, because the heatbed was absorbing the heat.

I'd blame overheating polyfuse. I couldn't get bed to heat up to 60 degrees with the one provided by sintron, I bought supposedly the same polyfuse and had no problems up to the moment I changed from RAMPS. Another option was to fan polyfuse all the time. Not sure how it applies to your problem and running 40 mins at 100 degrees. At any rate, I'd start with checking how hot it is. Ah and another option is limiting bed duty cycle. I think it's been discussed in this thread already.

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hacker

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CrisCG
I can print ABS now too, first layer sticks great. But after about 30-40 min of printing, the bed being set to 100, i get an error, it says the bed got disconected, so i am unable to finish the print. I unplug it from power and USB, plug it in without changing anything else, and now it works again. Maybe there's a weak connection somewhere? Maybe the soldering under the bed? I did use a bit more solder than was needed. It was very difficult to solder, because the heatbed was absorbing the heat.

I'd blame overheating polyfuse. I couldn't get bed to heat up to 60 degrees with the one provided by sintron, I bought supposedly the same polyfuse and had no problems up to the moment I changed from RAMPS. Another option was to fan polyfuse all the time. Not sure how it applies to your problem and running 40 mins at 100 degrees. At any rate, I'd start with checking how hot it is. Ah and another option is limiting bed duty cycle. I think it's been discussed in this thread already.

the sintron polyfuse is very weak. It will smoke and catch on fire. You need to replace it with an inline automotive fuse. But you also need a dedicated fan on the MOSFETS of Ramps so that doesnt overheat.

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DRTak

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hacker

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CrisCG
I can print ABS now too, first layer sticks great. But after about 30-40 min of printing, the bed being set to 100, i get an error, it says the bed got disconected, so i am unable to finish the print. I unplug it from power and USB, plug it in without changing anything else, and now it works again. Maybe there's a weak connection somewhere? Maybe the soldering under the bed? I did use a bit more solder than was needed. It was very difficult to solder, because the heatbed was absorbing the heat.

I'd blame overheating polyfuse. I couldn't get bed to heat up to 60 degrees with the one provided by sintron, I bought supposedly the same polyfuse and had no problems up to the moment I changed from RAMPS. Another option was to fan polyfuse all the time. Not sure how it applies to your problem and running 40 mins at 100 degrees. At any rate, I'd start with checking how hot it is. Ah and another option is limiting bed duty cycle. I think it's been discussed in this thread already.

the sintron polyfuse is very weak. It will smoke and catch on fire. You need to replace it with an inline automotive fuse. But you also need a dedicated fan on the MOSFETS of Ramps so that doesnt overheat.

I believe you're right about the proper solution, but I just replaced it with non-sintron polyfuse and that was sufficient. I also didn't cool mosfets…But I'm not sure if I had long enough prints with ramps.

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hacker

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DRTak

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hacker

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CrisCG
I can print ABS now too, first layer sticks great. But after about 30-40 min of printing, the bed being set to 100, i get an error, it says the bed got disconected, so i am unable to finish the print. I unplug it from power and USB, plug it in without changing anything else, and now it works again. Maybe there's a weak connection somewhere? Maybe the soldering under the bed? I did use a bit more solder than was needed. It was very difficult to solder, because the heatbed was absorbing the heat.

I'd blame overheating polyfuse. I couldn't get bed to heat up to 60 degrees with the one provided by sintron, I bought supposedly the same polyfuse and had no problems up to the moment I changed from RAMPS. Another option was to fan polyfuse all the time. Not sure how it applies to your problem and running 40 mins at 100 degrees. At any rate, I'd start with checking how hot it is. Ah and another option is limiting bed duty cycle. I think it's been discussed in this thread already.

the sintron polyfuse is very weak. It will smoke and catch on fire. You need to replace it with an inline automotive fuse. But you also need a dedicated fan on the MOSFETS of Ramps so that doesnt overheat.

well if you do not put a fan on the mosfets you should at least attach a heatsink to them. I used an old Pentium Heatsink that I split into 1/4 size. attached it to the central Mosfet with one screw and nut. That was enough. But to make sure I put a fan over the Mosfet and made sure it had air flow over the remaining Sintron polyfuse.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2016 02:26PM by DRTak.

Thank you for the suggestions. I will google some more on changing those parts, for wich i have 0 experience at this moment. For now i just solved it by having 100 degrees on the first layer, and the 90 for the rest of the print and it worked with no warping on a preety big part.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2016 01:17PM by CrisCG.

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CrisCG
Thank you for the suggestions. I will google some more on changing those parts, for wich i have 0 experience at this moment. For now i just solved it by having 100 degrees on the first layer, and the 90 for the rest of the print and it worked with no warping on a preety big part.

I had the same issue. Warm up to a certain point and then stop. Turned out that the Sintron Power supplies solder joints got loose from overheating. So I had to resolder them back on. And yes, I now have a fan over the powersupply to keep it all cool.

Thank you. I'm going to print a case for the ramps and put a big fan on it and also a fan for the power supply.

I'm starting to have another issue... this is getting stranger and stranger... i tried to print today and couldn't get the first layer to stick. Cleaned the heatbed and recalibrated, applied a bit of gluestick and hairspray, the surface was very sticky even to my hand, but still no stickiness for the first layer.

So the surface and calibration where good. I tried to play with the flow rate and going up to 120% made the first layer stick perfectly. When the first layer was finished, the extruder motor began skipping steps so i went back to 100% and was still skipping. I gradually went down untill it wasn't skipping anymore, that was 87%. I looked at the print qulity and it's great.

I rechecked if the extruder is properly calibrated, extruded and measured 10cm of filament and it was spot on. I did calibrate it when i was building the printer, but the value sintron provided was good.

I looked in the Slic3r config, the First Layer Extrusion Width is set to the default of 200%.

I don't think it might have something to do with the retraction settings, i have mine set to:
- 6mm length,
- 0mm Z lift,
- 40mm/s speed,
- 0mm Extra length on restart,
- 2mm Minimum travel after retraction.

Maybe it's not extruding the proper amount when printing ??

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2016 04:17AM by CrisCG.

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CrisCG
Thank you. I'm going to print a case for the ramps and put a big fan on it and also a fan for the power supply.

I'm starting to have another issue... this is getting stranger and stranger... i tried to print today and couldn't get the first layer to stick. Cleaned the heatbed and recalibrated, applied a bit of gluestick and hairspray, the surface was very sticky even to my hand, but still no stickiness for the first layer.

So the surface and calibration where good. I tried to play with the flow rate and going up to 120% made the first layer stick perfectly. When the first layer was finished, the extruder motor began skipping steps so i went back to 100% and was still skipping. I gradually went down untill it wasn't skipping anymore, that was 87%. I looked at the print qulity and it's great.

I rechecked if the extruder is properly calibrated, extruded and measured 10cm of filament and it was spot on. I did calibrate it when i was building the printer, but the value sintron provided was good.

I looked in the Slic3r config, the First Layer Extrusion Width is set to the default of 200%.

I don't think it might have something to do with the retraction settings, i have mine set to:
- 6mm length,
- 0mm Z lift,
- 40mm/s speed,
- 0mm Extra length on restart,
- 2mm Minimum travel after retraction.

Maybe it's not extruding the proper amount when printing ??

I don't have enough experience to be certain, but I'd check if the extruder is partially clogged. If it skips at the rate it was able to extrude, then it's likely that there's an obstacle somewhere. Also if it's partially clogged that would explain underextrusion while laying the first layer and therefore adherence problems.

What you're saying makes sense. I thought of something like that myself, So, i just took apart the hotend. Heated up the nozzle with a torch and cleaned it good. The upper part of the hotend looked good. The filament is comming out nice, no curling. Anything else i could do to clean the hotend?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2016 04:54AM by CrisCG.

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CrisCG
I just took apart the hotend. Heated up the nozzle with a torch and cleaned it good. The upper part of the hotend looked good. The filament is comming out nice, no curling. Anything else i could do to clean the hotend?

Not sure… When in doubt I also poke 0.4 drill into the nozzle, but I don't know if this is the right and/or necessary thing to do ;-)

@CrisCG
What about filament diameter? Is it 1.75mm spot on or more?
Did you tighten the idler gear of the extruder ( if possible...)?
Also doubt the nozzle diameter, some 0.4mm nozzles I got were in fact 0.35mm which coincidently is 87%...Hmmmm

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2016 05:27AM by o_lampe.

Yes, i also have some 0.4 drills and i poke it from time to time. I will replace the nozzle with a new one and see what happens.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2016 05:30AM by CrisCG.

Hi guys,
I am just about to strip my printer down and rebuild it with all the right angles this time.
I have got a digital angel finder and a good spirit level, can anyone give me some tips on the best way to achieve 3 x 60 degree corners and how to get the towers perfectly upright.
This time I want to build it right, with the angles all being correct because now all my prints lean to the left slightly, and the top edge of my print bed (in front of the Z tower) is 1.2mm lower than the rest if it.

I have a dremel in case I need to hack away at anything.

What would be the best way to put it all back together when I start the rebuild ?

Thanks guys

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CrisCG

I looked in the Slic3r config, the First Layer Extrusion Width is set to the default of 200%.

Note that 200% is not 200% of your nozzle size (which would make sense), it's 200% of the layer height.

So if you're printing at 0.1mm layer height, you're extruding 0.2mm -- half the width of the nozzle.

Best to set the first layer extrusion width to 0.6mm explicitly, then you don't get strange surprises any more.