Is This An Authentic Arduino?

So Reprapdiscount has in fact changed their RAMPS from counterfeit Arduinos, to a made in China version (Taurino I believe?).

I was happy to see this and ordered one, and it was received as pictured.

I'm more than happy to buy clones, as long as the manufacturers and sellers are open and honest about it.

Thanks to reprapdiscount for not selling counterfeits anymore.

Can somebody compare a photo if arduino Nano physically difference between genuine or not ?
Is there any difference in function between the genuine or not ?

I'm waiting for this answer before I decide to buy please.

A well made counterfeit should function just fine, if made by the right people. Our primary objection to counterfits is that they claim to be something that they are not, when they could just as easily give them a similar name and call them a 'clone'.


As far as if what you are looking into is real or not? I can't tell you.

[arduino.cc]

they are illegal.

I'm a big proponent of all things of an 'Open Source' providence, so please take that into account in reading this...
I am STRONGLY against what the arduino team label as direct counterfiets.

However, it's MY (personal) opinion, that the entire 'Arduino Project', which was from the outset, born from open source roots, would do well to take into account some 'commercial realities'.
I fully accept that, geographically speaking, I might as well be living on Mars (NZ is like a billion miles away from EVERYWHERE, something I actually enjoy!). However, I counter that with the ridiculously price competitive CLONES (yes, clones, not counterfeits) devices I've seen in my very short exposure to the Arduino Culture.
I am VERY new to the whole reprap scene (and therefore, still deep in the 'learning curve').
Maybe I'm looking in all the wrong places, but here's how I saw things...

I could have gone out and purchased what I STRONGLY suspect is a genuine Arduino Mega at a price of around NZ$120.00. Or I could have gone out to purchase a 100% electrically, electronically, and every other term compatible clone for $NZ33.00
It doesn't take a rocket scientist touess which avenue I took? (Actually, I grabbed spares too)

While that doesn't _sound_ like my professed 'support' of all things open source, I'd respond by saying that I took offense at seeing a 300%+ price difference between two offerings of a basically identical product. I didn't go out and purchase 'counterfeit' Rolex watches, but completely legitimate clone products.

So what does that tell me? Somewhere along the supply chain, the Arduino team (inclusive of their chosen manufacturers) are not price competitive to the tune of 200%+. (Admittedly, we're talking comparatively low prices to begin with, so every dollar counts more in the %age game).

It's MY opinion that if the Arduino Team are unable to market a product that can squeeze in to a price bracket less than double that of the clones, then there's something fishy going on. Especially when it's something as 'popular' as the ubiquitous Arduino.

My (perhaps naive?) perspective is that I am showing some degree of 'concern' that the Arduino Team is exhibiting traits I would expect from a Bill Gates / Larry Ellison type personality and I see these to be in direct contrast to an OSHW project.

I'm probably going to evoke _some_ flames by posting this and perhaps I should apologise in advance. I guess that comes from the fact that I am more a supporter of the 'free as in beer' (gratis) aspect than the 'free of encumbrances' (libre) asoect of open source. I don't send an invoice to 'friends'. I may not be as stupidly wealthy as I _could_ be, but I do possess all that I want (which includes a clear conscience)

i think the name ARDUINO is copywritten but there pcb board for instance if i made a clone i could call it duinosemi for example and its arduino compatable and i have a fundunio and i don't see it as a counterfeit but as a clone

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Check my rubbish blog for my prusa i3

up and running
[3dimetech.blogspot.co.uk]

Hello TheRevva


I would suggest you read this article first to get some background : [blog.arduino.cc]

On the "why original Arduino cost more than counterfeit copies" there are a number of reasons:

* Hardware sales support the "free" parts of the project (SW, Docs, Website, Donations etc)
* We spend hundreds of thousands of dollars designing new products and the same exact day they go on sale we release EVERYTHING... so we give our R&D away for free just like that. Hardware doesn't design itself, software doesn't write itself, the docs don't grow on trees and so on.
* We manufacture in Europe and the US. it's philosophical choice if you don't agree buy a clone. Having said this 29.95 USD for a "developed" nation is not a lot of money but there are people for whom price is the only factor.. nothing you can do about it (it's interesting how they march and protest when their job goes to china..)
* Every year we donate money and parts to different projects and initiatives.. this year we started to make it more systematic [blog.arduino.cc]
* Between 35 and 50% of the price goes to the distributor... resellers have to make money too.. Usually chinese counterfeits are sold on ebay/amazon with almost no margin...
* We employ 30 people around the world at different level of engagement. We try to give them the best conditions we can so that they can have a fulfilling job doing open source work which is what they love. None of the partners in Arduino have a ferrari or a porsche. We invest all the money in people...

We have no connection whatsoever with (the old) Bill Gates and Larry Ellison.

I find some of your comments slightly insulting.. if you want to buy a counterfeit do it.

If you think things could be done better then compete with us , show us how it can be done better in a legal way through actions not by ranting on a forum.

m

Well dayum!!!
I actually didn't think I was 'ranting on a forum', but I'm happy to support that you are, just like myself, entitled to your opinion.
BTW, I haven't yet read the text of the links you've provided. You can rest assured that I WILL be doing so. I OWE you at least that much!

Furthermore, I guess I need to go back and re-read what I posted, for I NEVER intended it to be insulting. (If that's how it came across, I would like to profusely apologise RIGHT NOW!)

The units I purchased are not, as you appear to have portrayed, counterfeits, but they ARE clones (which I understood the Arduino team consider completely acceptable?)

My primary argument was based around the (local) price difference between the clones that I purchased, and the 100% genuine product. I also added that my geographical location _could_ have some bearing on this. If this difference had been less than a factor of about 2, I would have ignored the clones and purchased the originals simply on principle! With the difference being more than a factor of three, I was not prepared to do so. (Everyone will have their own 'limit', and mine is around 2).

It is almost a guarantee that I _will_ be purchasing additional devices of an Arduino nature in future, and I completely intend to make sure _some_ of these will be the genuine articles. It's my own way of 'enforcing' what I believe is an 'acceptable' price differential ('enforcing' is perhaps not the best choice of words, but I cannot think of a better one to use).

I'm not one of those that you claim 'march and protest when their jobs go to China'. IMNSHO, there are some very good products that come out of China along with some very bad ones. I try to stick with those in the former group. (I've seen HORRID Asian-produced PCBs that were ordered as 2oz copper measuring out well under 35um with ugly registration, under / over etching and a myriad of other faults, but I've also seen just the opposite. I think it's unfair to claim that everything made in China is junk, although I accept that the generalisation is an accurate one far too often!)
To illustrate this with an example, there are a few places here in NZ that will manufacture PCBs to order, and I've used most of them in the past. I also assume you're well aware that there are some Asian-based PCB manufacturers who are willing to produce PCBs at VERY competitive price points. As mentioned, I've found that some of them are plain CRAPPY, while others produce some very decent product at significantly cheaper prices. Sometimes I use offshore PCB fabs, and other times I stay local depending upon the project requirements. (If I'm required to 'build down to a price point', then the decision is often to go offshore).
I could elect to ALWAYS 'go offshore', or equally I could elect to ALWAYS 'stay local'. Both methodologies have some strong supporting arguments (which I am sure I don't need to explain here?)

In your response, you've stated that 35-50% of the price goes to the distributor. Assuming that's true (and I have no reason to doubt its authenticity), then it seems apparent to me that these very 'distributors' may well be a burden on the project. Since Chinese (and other) 'clone' manufacturers are able to market their clones (including both their distribution costs as well as their parts procurement costs) at lower price points, then something seems 'fishy'. Perhaps your chosen distributors could _include_ some of these 'cheap Chinese clone' manufacturers? Isn't that what being competitive is all about?
At present, the Chinese labour market is (comparatively speaking on a global scale) quite a bit cheaper than most other 'developed' societies. I see this as a temporary imbalance that will stablise itself over time. It's my belief that Chinese labour costs will, over time, reach parity with other countries as their population gradually reaches the same living standards enjoyed in those 'more developed' countries. There are also 'sharks', 'thieves' and other such vermin, but China is not unique. They exist in every culture.

If the Arduino team is spending (and I quote) "hundreds of thousands of dollars" on R&D, then I have to state that I am mildly concerned. Admittedly, I am only have ONE of the many Arduino-style designs in front of me at the moment, but I still find the quoted figure of 'hundreds of thousands' to be somewhat alarming. Perhaps that just me being a trifle naive? Since I'm trying hard to not be offensive in this post, I'll not belabour the point.

In your closing statement, you've challenged me to 'show how it can be done better while still remaining legal'. Isn't that EXACTLY what the legitimate clone manufacturers are doing right now? Maybe I've missed something?

Having said that, maybe I _should_ get off my fat a$$ and start marketing legitimate clones? (at least for my local NZ market). I certainly wouldn't be commanding those 35-50% margins that your current distributors charge, and I'd be VERY willing to 'donate' any profits back into the Arduino community in the interests of fostering the tenets of OSHW. It deserves nothing less in my (insignificant) opinion!

Lastly, I wish nothing but the best to ALL users of this forum. And also, I THANK you for having taken the time to respond.

i am 99% shure that all arduino boards and arduino derivates are made in china.

also originals.

it says on it made in italy. so on my chinese board says made in italy, but i am shure it will not see italy in lifetime...

today everything is about money, so dont fool ourselves.


i pesonally dont care where is made, most important is that board works...and its cheap.