New Ramps1.4 Board wont work - High Pitched SQUEEL when trying to move Axis

Hi guys,

The Ramps 1.4 board I had broke so I bought a new RED one.

I'm having a problem adjusting the pots on this new one. Nothing seems to really work. Whenever I try to move an axis nothing happens except for aloud high pitched noise.

Any Idea?

I am using the old motor mounts from my broken GREEN Ramps board, which should be working fine. Could that be the problem?

I'm kind of stumped.

Thanks guys!!!

Its probably important to note that the motor mounts get EXTREMELY hot despite the pots point upwards.

Why is it overheating like that? (I have the plastic parts attached that help it cool).

The direction the pot is pointing doesn't mean much. You really need to measure Vref on each driver. See: [reprap.org]
Also, have you installed all the microstepping jumpers?

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Quote
NewPerfection
The direction the pot is pointing doesn't mean much. You really need to measure Vref on each driver. See: [reprap.org]
Also, have you installed all the microstepping jumpers?

what are the microstepping jumpers?

Quote
NewPerfection
The direction the pot is pointing doesn't mean much. You really need to measure Vref on each driver. See: [reprap.org]
Also, have you installed all the microstepping jumpers?

Im also having trouble following the instructions on that page. Do you know of anything a little easier to follow?

Try this one

http://www.nextdayreprap.co.uk/commissioning-reprap-prusa-mendel-build-manual/

You need to select 11.4 "Pololu stepper driver configuration" from the top tabs

the jumpers are critical. You need jumpers on the three pairs of pins below the drivers.
Without that, nothing works in my experience.
Radio shack sells them, though the sales people there never know what they are. Look by the chip sockets area.
You need 12 minimum, 3 for each of 4 drivers.

Quote
jmaeding
the jumpers are critical. You need jumpers on the three pairs of pins below the drivers.
Without that, nothing works in my experience.
Radio shack sells them, though the sales people there never know what they are. Look by the chip sockets area.
You need 12 minimum, 3 for each of 4 drivers.

The jumpers set the microstepping

The chart below is for the A4988 chip and can be seen here - [www.pololu.com]


MS1

MS2

MS3

Microstep Resolution



Low

Low

Low

Full step



High

Low

Low

Half step



Low

High

Low

Quarter step



High

High

Low

Eighth step



High

High

High

Sixteenth step


3 jumpers present = 16x, you can figure out the rest but this does not mean they are required. If they are left out, you will need to adjust steps to match. If you are using any driver other than an A4988, check the settings. 3 jumpers with a DRV8825 = 32x on Ramps.

The squealing is likely from too high of a speed and too high of an acceleration. On a printer with Z leadscrews, your Z speed should be around 3mm/s.

note that the jumpers are needed before you do anything.
Typical repetier/marlin...firmwares assume 16x microstepping in the configuration.h file, do not change that as you would not be asking if you were someone who should.

The default speeds and accellerations should be fine.

Please post that config.h file, and mention what firmware you are using and we can recommend anything obvious.
I did the same thing as you, no jumpers at first...same squeeling so I know the issue.

Quote
jmaeding
note that the jumpers are needed before you do anything.
Typical repetier/marlin...firmwares assume 16x microstepping in the configuration.h file, do not change that as you would not be asking if you were someone who should.

The default speeds and accellerations should be fine.

Please post that config.h file, and mention what firmware you are using and we can recommend anything obvious.
I did the same thing as you, no jumpers at first...same squeeling so I know the issue.

Marlin - "#define DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT {78.7402,78.7402,200.0*8/3,760*1.1} // default steps per unit for Ultimaker"

Where does that say anything about 16x? 16x is just the most common because it is the max supported by the driver most everyone uses (A4988), the DRV8825 supports 32x but it is thought that most Arduino AVR chips can not generate fast enough to support that stepping rate.

Firmwares assume nothing and jumpers are not always needed, YOU calculate the steps using the microstepping you want. It is actually better to set Z to full steps on most screw driven Z machines because you need not worry about Z motors losing power and defaulting to the next full step which could be in different locations between the motors causing a misalignment that can compound as layers go on.

Most cases the set speed or acceleration will be wrong...as other things that are wrong in the firmware. Like this for example "#define INVERT_X_DIR true // for Mendel set to false, for Orca set to true", most of the controllers do not have a keyed motor connection nor do most motors so that comment is complete rubbish and would only confuse people that are new to the firmware.

Just because the firmware comment says something does not mean you should trust it without research.

well, the current config.h files you get with marlin and repetier are set for 16x.
I totally agree on your comment to check things if you understand what the settings mean.

That DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT is not related to microstepping jumpers though, it just a speed setting.
You need the jumopers to make the microstepping happen in the first place.

Quote
jmaeding
well, the current config.h files you get with marlin and repetier are set for 16x.
I totally agree on your comment to check things if you understand what the settings mean.

That DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT is not related to microstepping jumpers though, it just a speed setting.
You need the jumopers to make the microstepping happen in the first place.

Please if you are going to comment, fact check yourself.

DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT changes depending on microstepping, it has nothing to do with speed at all.

200 step motor, FULL steps, GT2 belt, 20tooth pulley = 5 steps per millimeter

200 step motor, 16x steps, GT2 belt, 20tooth pulley = 80 steps per millimeter

200 step motor, 32x steps, GT2 belt, 20tooth pulley = 160 steps per millimeter

The jumpers in COMBINATION with the steps per unit are what makes a 1mm move in the host/g-code/controller equal to 1mm in real life. 200mm/s will be the same with FULL steps vs 16x microstepping.

The firmwares are set to default values for some printer that the person configuring it used, you should never trust that number so you can not say that they are set to 16x by default because even if firmware is supplied by whoever you bought the printer from saying it is complete and set up to run, you should be checking the steps per unit. If you go to Github and download the firmware, nothing in there is "default" to what you use. In fact, the line I commented from Marlin said it was for Ultimaker. It does not say which Ultimaker or any more information like teeth on pulley, belt size, motor steps, microstepping.

You are going to get into a lot of trouble assuming things and it's not helpful to tell people that they default to X without explaining why or how the things they are looking to change works.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2014 10:23AM by tjb1.

I guess that is part of the game, making sure the facts you understand reflect reality.
I definitely appreciate your corrections and advice, as you are further along the learning curve than I.

What I was saying was the DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT does not turn microstepping on or off.
Jumpers turn those modes on and off, and oddly, most ramps boards do not come with the jumpers.
Is that understanding incorrect?

From a beginners point of view, I just want to know how to get my machine going, then tweak things.
If you have a typical mega/ramps 1.4, you should add the jumpers and use the default config.h settings except motherboard set to 33.
Also critical is setting the driver trim pots to low.
Another issue is making sure your endstops do not connect ground to VCC if using as normally closed.
Those seem to be the easiest ways to break things if not performed.

Once working, you can tweak speed settings, end stops and so on to get things fully working.
That is easy. The hard part is what default parts and settings to use to just get the thing running and not fry or break anything.

If you have a non-typical ramps 1.4 system, you should read a bit on default firmware settings by the maker of that board.
Its usually just tweaking the motherboard setting though from what I have read.
I spent two weeks reading before powering up anything, so I get the idea of checking assumptions.
It actually boiled down the basics above though in the end.

I would love to hear a better way of handling the thought process for a beginner, we all benefit from your sharing.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2014 12:42PM by jmaeding.

Quote
jmaeding
I guess that is part of the game, making sure the facts you understand reflect reality.
I definitely appreciate your corrections and advice, as you are further along the learning curve than I.

What I was saying was the DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT does not turn microstepping on or off.
Jumpers turn those modes on and off, and oddly, most ramps boards do not come with the jumpers.
Is that understanding incorrect?

From a beginners point of view, I just want to know how to get my machine going, then tweak things.
If you have a typical mega/ramps 1.4, you should add the jumpers and use the default config.h settings except motherboard set to 33.
Also critical is setting the driver trim pots to low.
Another issue is making sure your endstops do not connect ground to VCC if using as normally closed.
Those seem to be the easiest ways to break things if not performed.

Once working, you can tweak speed settings, end stops and so on to get things fully working.
That is easy. The hard part is what default parts and settings to use to just get the thing running and not fry or break anything.

If you have a non-typical ramps 1.4 system, you should read a bit on default firmware settings by the maker of that board.
Its usually just tweaking the motherboard setting though from what I have read.
I spent two weeks reading before powering up anything, so I get the idea of checking assumptions.
It actually boiled down the basics above though in the end.

I would love to hear a better way of handling the thought process for a beginner, we all benefit from your sharing.

There is much more to firmware than just setting the board selection.

For instance, the temperature sensors section in Marlin

#define TEMP_SENSOR_0 -1
#define TEMP_SENSOR_1 -1

0 would be the hotend by default in Pins.h, 1 is the bed by default. These will be the defaults unless you go change them in Pins.h. The other issue here is both are -1, if you look at the listing you'll see that this is set for something almost no RepRap currently uses.

// -1 is thermocouple with AD595

Ultimaker uses thermocouples, personally I see no reason to use a thermocouple on the bed besides them being more robust than the glass beaded thermistors that have very tiny leads. Axial thermistors are usually quite a big heavier and less prone to failure from fatigue but are more difficult to use in with the bed. Thermocouples are mainly being used because they support much higher temperatures, the one I use from SparkFun has a 482C MAX on the glass braid insulation on the leads but the sensor itself is rated to 1372C which is magnitudes higher than the 300C limit of the popular thermistors we use currently. The problem with thermocouples is that they require more supporting electronics and in the case of most controllers, they require an external board that takes the signal generate and amplifies it to a useable scale (0-5v) using a MAX6675, AD595 or AD597 chip. Because Ultimaker uses their own board, they have their own Pins.h definition which directs the temperature pins to use the thermocouple inputs so this does not affect the Pins.h definition for other boards like Ramps. What it does do is screw up the calculation used to determine temperature and will likely trigger either a MIN or MAXTEMP error and prevent you from going any further with the printer until you have selected the correct temperature sensor.

The first things that should be done with the firmware is the board selection, temperature sensor, steps per unit, homing configuration, and take note of baudrate or change it. That will get you far enough to connect to the controller, move the axis and then tune the speed/accel if needed.

After that you can go through and tune the more specific settings like PID tuning, homing speeds, extra extruder setttings, etc.

very useful advice.
Forgot about baudrate.
The speeds and homing directions can be tweaked after running, as you have to take measurements and see directions to adjust them anyway.

That temp sensor issue is interesting. I used config.h from repetier firmware and did not have to change.

Even endstops can be tweaked after startup by running M119 command to see what they are doing.
The electronics were by far the hardest part of my Prusa I3 build, as even basic troubleshooting requires a medium level of familiarity.
That's why we are here...

Quote
eci22
Try this one

http://www.nextdayreprap.co.uk/commissioning-reprap-prusa-mendel-build-manual/

You need to select 11.4 "Pololu stepper driver configuration" from the top tabs

Thanks. This still didn't work

Here is a video of my problem.
[www.youtube.com]
Please help! Is it the electronics? Its worth noting tha twhen I use a multimeter on the extruder motor mount I get a -11 reading. The x-axis gives me an appropriate reading

Quote
jmaeding
the jumpers are critical. You need jumpers on the three pairs of pins below the drivers.
Without that, nothing works in my experience.
Radio shack sells them, though the sales people there never know what they are. Look by the chip sockets area.
You need 12 minimum, 3 for each of 4 drivers.

Woops I didn't refresh the page!!!

The Jumpers might be the trick. I have some, Ill let you guys know

You can always just run the RAMPS test code, without any firmware just to make sure you have good motors and steppers

[reprap.org]