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Please help me solve this

Posted by jpan 
Please help me solve this
February 04, 2014 05:23PM
Here are some print that my machine did these days. I do not think it's z-wobble caused by the threaded rods (although I thought so and nearly bought aluminum couplers) after finding out that it's only twisted in the direction of y-axis. And the distances between the "waves" don't match the pitch of my threaded rod.

pic token along x-axis.(only it's not on the print bed)



token along the same direction as the one right above



token along the same direction as the ones above



same object but picture token along y-axis, but nicely printed(for me...) from this view.


Since when you see the print panel along x-axis, you actually see y-axis' movement. Therefore I think there's a problem on my y-axis movement. I have no idea on what to do in this kind of situation. I need help!spinning smiley sticking its tongue out
Any suggestion will be appreciated.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2014 07:56PM by jpan.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 04, 2014 08:55PM
You might be printing too fast for those small parts and not giving the lower layers enough time to harden before laying down the next layer. Slow down the print or use the cool option to blow a fan for cooling or slow it down when the time it takes to print each layer is less than 20 or 30 s. You can also print 2 at a time, but that just wastes plastic.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 04, 2014 09:17PM
I don't think that's a problem...I have a 80mm fan heading towards the bed, always on because connected to the PSU. The object themselves did not move as I observed..confused smiley Strange aha?
Re: Please help me solve this
February 04, 2014 09:20PM
Try to slow it down anyway or print 2 at a time. Even if you have a fan blowing, it might not be enough to cool the parts down since the part is right below the nozzle all of the time.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 04, 2014 09:30PM
What is the object suppose to be?

What are your steps/mm for X and Y?
Re: Please help me solve this
February 04, 2014 09:51PM
I think "steps/mm" are both 80

In the last two pictures, the walls of the object should be straight.
In the first two picture, they are actually parts of a dog so you could imagine...

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2014 09:54PM by jpan.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 05, 2014 01:39AM
what layer height are you printing at?
Re: Please help me solve this
February 05, 2014 08:46AM
0.3034mm
Because I'm using 5/16 threaded rod.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 05, 2014 09:23AM
what type of bed support do you have. does it have 3 or 4 bushings on it?



and do you have an image of your entire machine.

several mechanical issue may be at play here. bushings should be tight with little slack.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2014 08:09PM by jamesdanielv.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 05, 2014 09:26AM
Looks like missing steps to me.

Your motor drivers are perhaps not giving enough current. Or too much (overheating).


Most of my technical comments should be correct, but is THIS one ?
Anyway, as a rule of thumb, always double check what people write.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 08, 2014 06:23PM
It definitely looks like wobble not banding
Re: Please help me solve this
February 08, 2014 09:09PM
The bearings are fine. Now my electronics are fried, but still I took some pictures.
I also installed something like this (before my Arduino and Aamps being fried =_=III) and didn't have too much good effect. I even sanded it to make it little effective to the linear rod.

Here's how my machine looks like:



I use 3mm filament. I now suspect the problem might be because misalignment of y-axis belt. When last time I tightened the belt, it wasn't fixed in the center between to space between the two pieces of plastic(as I observed). Although this assumption doesn't make too much sense even to myself.
This is what I mean.

(the belt is fixed there, not that free as shown )
Re: Please help me solve this
February 08, 2014 09:41PM
i would square off z,x,y axis to be sure. also remove all slop from the top bed. I would put springs there instead of spacers. springs allow for the bed to move when it re-sizes from heat and then if compressed enough, reduce motion of the table top, the part that is the heated bed, covered with glass.

also that idler puller on the left is not sized correctly. steps on the left side of bed will have less tension on the belt. make the belt on x axis as level as possible.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2014 09:47PM by jamesdanielv.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 09, 2014 08:34AM
Thanks for advices! I never use the heat bed because my PSU is not powerful enough. That sheet of glass is actually broken in an accident, so I taped it from both side. Is it fine if I just remove it and print on masking tape on heat bed? If so I would remove that sheet of glass.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 09, 2014 09:23AM
yes it is ok to print on the bed below as long as it is somewhat level and the nozzle does not crash into it.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 27, 2014 08:45PM
I know it's been a long time. I got all electronics replaced, costing me about one hundred bucks. The problem just remains. I adjusted the little screw on the stepper driver and it does make some little differences. But still I cannot get a perfect straight wall whatever numbers of times I tried for.

I also found an interesting phenomenon. The pulley on y-axis motor shaft does not spin around it's center. I guess it's because the tensioned belt is only pulling one end of the pulley.
Is that a possible reason? If so how can I do that?

Any suggestion will be greatly appreciated! spinning smiley sticking its tongue out
A2
Re: Please help me solve this
February 27, 2014 09:11PM
Quote
jpan
I also found an interesting phenomenon. The pulley on y-axis motor shaft does not spin around it's center. I guess it's because the tensioned belt is only pulling one end of the pulley.
Is that a possible reason? If so how can I do that?

You need to replace the out of round pulley, less your design is missing a part.
The pulley ideally should have zero circular run out.

Measure the shaft, and the pulley bore diameters, there should be almost no difference.
A small press fit of .0005" (0.013 mm) would be preferable, if you have the means to assemble it.

If you do end up purchasing a replacement pulley, verify that the bore in the pulley is machined to match your shaft diameter,
and not for a range of shaft diameters.

I also noticed that on the back side of the machine, that the Y axis belt is shifted to one side of the pulley.
Possibly a clue that your machine is not square.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 27, 2014 09:44PM
Thanks for reply!

I do have some spare pulleys. I tried them on and once. They work pretty much as well as each other. (Maybe the shape of the pulleys also plays? Doesn't make sense to myself though.)

I am wondering if that little screw adjusting current on stepper drivers (A4988 in my case ) will make any difference if they're turned by only 5 degrees of so. I mean, how accurate are those screws? Cuz now I am adjusting them within a range of 30 degrees in which the motors works better. Don't know if I should narrow this range more.
A2
Re: Please help me solve this
February 27, 2014 10:55PM
Do the teeth of the belt mesh with the pulley, is the pulley bore too big, or is the pulley out of round?
[www.youtube.com]
[www.youtube.com]

You should also verify that the pulley shafts are parallel to each other, and perpendicular to the Y axis, use a square.
[www.starrett.com]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2014 07:14AM by A2.
Re: Please help me solve this
February 28, 2014 07:10AM
Quote
jpan
I am wondering if that little screw adjusting current on stepper drivers (A4988 in my case ) will make any difference if they're turned by only 5 degrees of so. I mean, how accurate are those screws? Cuz now I am adjusting them within a range of 30 degrees in which the motors works better. Don't know if I should narrow this range more.

Do you have a multimeter? I'm guessing the answer is no, or you would know how touchy those trim pots are. Even worse, the manufacturer that made mine didn't set them to any default, so there was no starting point for a reference for counting turns without a meter.....
Re: Please help me solve this
February 28, 2014 08:06AM
Well, so I guess the adjusting of current may not be a reason
The first one is my case I think. I'll just try some other pulleys...
The other pulleys that I have are no good, too.
Re: Please help me solve this
March 16, 2014 09:03PM
Check me newest print out, plzspinning smiley sticking its tongue out




I now find that my wobble/banding is no in any pattern most of the time. My guess of the root of the problem is the tension of the 3mm filament. When the position of the hot end changes(sort of due to my printer's construction), the tension (both amount and direction) of the filament also changes. Therefore my next step, hopefully the last step, is to switch my filament and hot end to 1.75mm.

Any ideas?
Re: Please help me solve this
March 16, 2014 09:47PM
Quote
jpan
Well, so I guess the adjusting of current may not be a reason
The first one is my case I think. I'll just try some other pulleys...
The other pulleys that I have are no good, too.
be very careful I would use a plastic screwdriver if you're adjusting this if you short it out you will be buying more electronics. Obviously you need to start with a good square machine everybody here has been trying to help you with this but you need a good machine to start with. Obviously if you pulleys are not running true they are wrong they could even be the wrong pulley for the belt in any case they need to be corrected. Mechanically your machine has to be right first to tune it up

Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/16/2014 09:55PM by cnc dick.
Re: Please help me solve this
March 21, 2014 10:20AM
Thanks for your advice., but I don't even think that matters too much. I am sure that the pulley is the in the right size(GT2). I'll see what would happen after I switch to 1.75 filament. the new extruder and filament are already ordered and shipped so to wait is the only thing that I could do now.
Re: Please help me solve this
March 31, 2014 08:33PM
Switched to 1.75, problem solved (95%, let's say it's solved)

Thank you to everybody who helped. Will post some pictures of newest prints later.
This is really a helpful community. Thank you!thumbs up

Only thing bad about this experience is the bucks for the fried electronics...... Will learn from it.
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