New E3D refuses to extrude

E3D 3mm/0.4mm 24V - NTC B2-100-3950-1
With injection-molded fan assy
Mendel-90 with Greg's Wade extruder
RUMBA controller with Marlin firmware

PLA temp: 190 deg C
ABS temp: 230 deg C

In both cases (PLA and ABS), the hot end will not extrude, or starts briefly and then stops.
Even with manually pushing filament into the feeder, it won't go at the temperature I read.
Things I have tried:

1) Bumping up the hot end temperature to see if any change - not really.
2) The guitar string cleaning trick - no clog (can see light through nozzle)
3) Disassembly, soak nozzle in acetone and burn residue out with torch - no clog (can see light through nozzle)
4) Wiping plastic with canola oil.
5) Tried Marlin thermistor settings 1, 5, 71

Clue 1: This hot end has never extruded successfully.
Clue 2: When the plastic does extrude briefly, it is curling (not straight).
Clue 3: If I pull the plastic out of the hot end (while hot), clip the end and reinsert, it will extrude a little more.
Clue 4: The plastic (both PLA and ABS) are older reels (bought last year). They have not been stored with dessicant.
Clue 5: I am sure it is not the extruder hobbed bolt, because I am manually feeding the plastic in and having problems.

I don't have another hot end to try to tease apart this problem and either isolate it to the E3D or something else.
This is quite frustrating - could it just be the plastic? If it is old enough, could it have absorbed enough moisture to be a problem?

Any ideas on what is going on?
Rob

Been that you purchased on eBay, I have some doubts about been an original e3d product . does it have a PTFE tubing inside the heatsink and goes all the way to the SS barrel? Is the inside of the barrel polished or you can see some drill markings?

Even with clones (I have a clone v5) ABS goes quite well without any issues. So the fact that yours is having problems with it, leads me to believe your problem is with the extruder not the hotend.

If you have an empty spool, you could dry up the ABS filament in the oven, 30 minutes or little more at 215 Fahrenheit will do the trick but the spool will deform.

Once dryed if you still have problems, you will have to review the extruder and extruder settings.

If it's a knockoff e3d, check to see if the heat break barrel is steel or stainless. Steel will allow heat to travel up the barrel much easier and lead to jamming, but it's cheaper and easier to produce so may get replaced with the knockoff. Can you link to the auction or seller of the hot end you bought? Are they an official reseller or located in China? The price you paid should also be close to what a retail e3d hotend is. If it's drastically different, then it's probably a substandard knockoff and the source of your problem.

Try taking the hotend off the machine and take the nozzle off. Heat it and clean out any filament inside. Let it cool. Can you push filament through now?

Are you sure your filament is getting all the way in? Push it in, hold your finger on the spot and pull it out to get an idea of how far in it is going and therefore where the blockage is.

My Chinese E3D was flat at the top of the heat break. Unscrew the heat break from the heat sink. Look at the top of the heat break... if it's not already done, countersink it a little... I just used an ordinary drill bit. (Probably this means mine's not Stainless Steel).

When reassembling, screw the nozzle all the way into the heater first, then tighten the heat break against it.

Snip the end of your filament at 45 degrees so it goes past any lips in the heat break rather than jamming.

Here is the E3D I purchased - they are located in China:
[www.ebay.com]

Not sure how I can tell what the heat break material is.
Rob

Hi all -
Some answers to your questions -
1) Definitely not the extruder, because I am manually pushing (or attempting to push) the filament through with no luck.
2) The filament is making it all the way through, because it extrudes a *little*, then nothing.
3) The heat break theory aligns with the symptoms - the heat sink fins are very hot, which might indicate the heat break is not doing its job correctly.

Rob

Dumb question #1 - do you have the colling fan running all the time? Not under the control of the RUMBA board?

The reason for asking is that my genuine E3D hot-end also seized up when the fan failed; these hot ends have to be cooled all the time that the printer is on, not just when the control board says so.

(If this is a dumb question, and you do have your fan permanently wired and screwed on the right way round, then just ignore me!)

Definitely NOT a dumb question with the E3D hot end!!
I don't have it permanently wired to 12v (yet), but through Repetier manual control I have turned it on for the testing and verified that it is running the whole time. I thought that might be the issue too, but no go.
Rob

That auction is definitely for a knockoff. No where does it actually say it's an E3D hotend. Just a "V6".

A stainless steel heat break will have or very very weak magnetic attraction. A steel will have definite magnetic attraction.

You said the heat sink fins are very hot. That's with the fan running? I'd have to double check my E3D but with the fan running on it I can't remember it getting much past slightly warm. Do you have a gap between your heater block and the heat sink or is the heat sink touching the heater block?

My V6 heatsink is also barely warm when running normally (e.g. 240C at the hot end for ABS).

I would wire the fan to permanent 12v, even if that's from somewhere off the board. Also, make sure that the fan is blowing air into the heatsink, not trying to suck it out. Usually this means that the fan's label is facing the heatsink. It shouldn't make a difference... but it does!

As you push the filament through do you see any fluctuation in the temperature readings? Did you run the PID tuning? Heatsink should definitely not be hot as David stated above.

Does the bowden tube run all the way through the heat break and down to the nozzle or just to the top of the heat break (which should also be countersunk)? I had clones that were like this and they were junk. The 3mm OD PTFE tube was too thin for the heat it was subject to, it was not cut flush at the ends and causing filament to seep into the gap between the nozzle and the PTFE tube.

Remove the nozzle only and check for signs of seeping. If you have the type I described above then unfortunately you'll either have to modify it and install the proper heat break or just buy the proper style heatsink and heat break. You can't just swap the heat break with the official type because the bore and thread depth is different on that clone heatsink. You can still use the same heater block, cartridge and thermistor though as they're all the same.

Had a similar problem.

My problem was the following. You need to make sure that the nozzle is tight against the heat break. Don't just hand tighten it. You can assemble the complete hot end of the extruder. Then heat the nozzle and block and tight the nozzle with a ten spanner. Be careful to not strip the thread but be sure it is tight. If it is not it will only extrude a bit and then block.

Regard

Riaan

Don't trust assembled hot ends. You should re-assemble them following the official instructions.

Clues:

Like Riann said, but you need to heat the hot end up to properly assemble it because metal expands and will loosen. So heat it up, tighten the brass nozzle all the way in (official instructions say back it off 1 turn, but meh...)

make sure the heat sink and the heat block are not touching

and finally, make sure the PTFE tube (bowden or whatever) is seated in the top end of the stainless pipe.

The threaded ends of the brass and stainless should connect inside the heat block with no gap!

Quote
thetazzbot
Don't trust assembled hot ends. You should re-assemble them following the official instructions.

Clues:

Like Riann said, but you need to heat the hot end up to properly assemble it because metal expands and will loosen. So heat it up, tighten the brass nozzle all the way in (official instructions say back it off 1 turn, but meh...)

make sure the heat sink and the heat block are not touching

and finally, make sure the PTFE tube (bowden or whatever) is seated in the top end of the stainless pipe.

The threaded ends of the brass and stainless should connect inside the heat block with no gap!

I see you have problems with the E3D hotend in other posts. That step you call "but meh" is actually critical to proper sealing and operation.

I'm not surprised you're having problems if you don't follow the instructions. Not E3D's fault, that.