ABS juice not sticking to glass

Hello.

I tried to use ABS juice instead of hairspray on my glass heated printbed but it peels off the glass really easily.

When printing a part, the abs film in between the glass and the part comes loose. It looks like soft fibers, like when you put glue from a glue stick in between your fingers, and then pull your fingers apart, but not as soft

I can also easily scrape the film off the glass using my nails. If I can get a hold of the film, I can simply grab it and pull off the rest .. Is that normal?

It seems to me that OR my glass is somehow way too smooth (however the hairspray worked like a charm, as in needing a hammer to remove pieces)
OR, the juice is not what it needs to be. Perhaps my acetone is not really 100% acetone? I have tried two bottles from different brands, giving the same result.
The ABS which I used is milky white.

The weird blue stuff is a silicone heat conducting sheet underneath the glass, with some bubbles.

Kind regards

It sounds to me that the glass was not clean enough to begin with. Give it a good scrub with clean hot water, washing up liquid and a scouring pad. Rinse well, then dry with a paper towel - not with a tea towel or cloth, because the fabric conditioner will contaminate the surface. Then avoid finger marking the glass (wipe it with acetone if you do), and apply your ABS juice. I normally apply it just before or while heating the bed to printing temperature.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Something is wrong with your acetone perhaps? Nail lacquer (almost acetone) has oil in it . My acetone layer over glass is quite hard to scratch. Or the filament has some strange ingredients. Clean the glass with the pure acetone and make better juice. Acetone is a very good oil remover.

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I cleaned the glass with acetone while cold, to get off most of the hairspray.
After heating to 115 degrees C, I cleaned it again and used a new paper towel (with acetone) about 5 times because when rubbing the glass.

However I could still see some lines, from the hairspray I think.

Do you think it was still not clean enough? Should I have cleaned it with water instead, like you suggested?
Thank you for your reply!


@Plasteroid:
I have two bottles of acetone. Neither have ingredients written on the bottles.

The first one is called just "Acetone" and it has a wiping cloth picture on it I usually never use acetone, so I do not know exactly how it should smell.
It does not smell like anything else which I know, so I guess it is actually acetone.

The second buttle is called "Acetone, solvent for glues and varnishes"
It smells the same as the other bottle, but it also smells like white spirit. It also seems to evaporate slightly slowe.
This is the bottle which I used to clean the glass.

I tried both bottles for making the ABS juice, and both seemed the same.


I will clean the glass with the first bottle and try again.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2015 01:42PM by FalloutBe.

Glass is clean when you get a squeeking noise while cleaning.
A mix of methylated spirit and clear ammonia works great for the final clean if you use a newspaper sheet (black and white not from a glossy magazine).
But I used a 400 grid diamond sharpener plate to "sand" my glass, juice sticks much better but is still easy to remove with a blade.
Best of all the procedure sanded down some "bumps" on the glass as well.
If you want a really good stick, like for printing big parts, use a can of plastic primer and put a thin layer on the glass before applying the juice (or print directly onto the primer).

Try this method that I found on youtube.

Start with clean glass. Alcohol or windex.
Pour a little acetone on the glass.
Natural white abs is preferred, but grab a failed print and just rub it on the glass all around with the acetone. It will coat the glass with abs juice.

No need to keep a jar of juice. It doesn't keep anyway, and the acetone evaps.

Quote
thetazzbot
Try this method that I found on youtube.

Start with clean glass. Alcohol or windex.
Pour a little acetone on the glass.
Natural white abs is preferred, but grab a failed print and just rub it on the glass all around with the acetone. It will coat the glass with abs juice.

No need to keep a jar of juice. It doesn't keep anyway, and the acetone evaps.

I can agree with that.

Just posted about this a few days ago :

It is so simple a solution - using each color of filament that you have, you print a small puck, about 40mm diameter.
When you want to print, make sure the bed is clean, drop a few drops of acetone on the bed ( I have a syringe full of clean acetone stored in a glass jar ) and then rub the puck over the acetone. The concentration of ABS to acetone should be a lot higher than that in a slurry.

Just use the correct puck for the color filament that you are printing with, and there's no color change on the bottom.

I found it in this page :
[www.youmagine.com]

I am having the opposite problem !

My ABS is sticking too well, the last print pulled away a thin section from the surface and has remained stuck to the bottom of the printed part.
This has also happened once befor when I was using 3mm window glass, I changed to Borosilica glass thinking that it window glass was too brittle but the problem has not been solved.

My ABS juice is acetone and some ABS from an old computer case, the soft cream plate for blanking off unused disc drive slots. This material has a very high level of filler and when dissolved in acetone is very cloudy and sinks to the bottom when left to stand. Just be sure to give the bottle a good shake prior to painting on the glass bed.
I recently added more acetone to the mix to thin it down but this may have been a mistake.

The acetone I bought in France where it is cheap and very easy to buy from most supermarkets. ( 1 litre bottles )

Waiting on a new glass bed at the moment so I am also thinking of other bed materials like the blue tape others use.

Tried to attach this photo to my previous posting but fialed, smaller file now.

This is not something on the surface, but the surface has been pulled away.

Quote
allempty
Tried to attach this photo to my previous posting but fialed, smaller file now.

This is not something on the surface, but the surface has been pulled away.

Is the bed heated when you print ?

I use an aluminium bed, and the prints are very well stuck ( would need chisel or sharpened paint scraper and a very sharp knock to get print off bed ) at print temperature ( 85 degrees C ) but pull off with no resistance when bed cools to below about 50C.

Yes I print at a bed temp of 118 degrees C and don't have distortion problems when the bed was cooler. I also don't use fans to cool the part as it's being printed. The more consistant the temperature the better.

My parts come free ok once the bed has cooled, as you say below 50 degrees C. I have wondered if I had damaged the surface with scratches from a stanly blade I use to clean off the excess ABS juice.

Have prised them from the bed with a blade, just because I get impatient !

Quote
allempty
Yes I print at a bed temp of 118 degrees C and don't have distortion problems when the bed was cooler. I also don't use fans to cool the part as it's being printed. The more consistant the temperature the better.

My parts come free ok once the bed has cooled, as you say below 50 degrees C. I have wondered if I had damaged the surface with scratches from a stanly blade I use to clean off the excess ABS juice.

Have prised them from the bed with a blade, just because I get impatient !

OK. I print ABS with the aluminium bed at 85 degrees and never have lifting. Bed also reaches temperature a lot faster.

Try the 'puck method' instead of the paste - works for me 100% of the time, and cleaning off is easy with a little acetone on a cloth - much less 'residue' than brushing on the slurry / paste.

Puck method :
https://www.youmagine.com/designs/abs-slurry-puck-mallet

This may have solved my problem....
Just done the first print of a 20mm cube leaving the temperatures as my normal.
The cube came free of the plate very easily after the bed reached 53 degree C. So first result v'good

The one main difference is the thickness of the ABS layer left by the 'puck' ( in my case an old 20mm cube ) there is a much thicker layer that peels away from the bed plate.
My bed plate is 6mm alluminium with a fine 'emery paper' finish which will grip well to the slurry layer. The action of rubbing it in over when setting up the surface must help too.

The level calibration on my machine needs to be done again, the print I am running at the moment is quite large and the result of the first layer is not as good I expect. (thin and wide on one side and thicker and narrower at the other side). My experience from the first trials is the the glass plate is not as flat as you first my assume it to be, In the end I held mine in place with fixed clamps and packed various places to get the best I could, checking with a dial test indicator. I then let the auto calibration trim out the rest of the errors ! It took a long time but did a good job.

Many thanks for your help, this is the first time I've used the forum and found it usefull ......

Perhaps I don't need the new glass bed plate I ordered yesterday :-( ........ !!

Quote
allempty
This may have solved my problem....

I am assuming that you're referring to the acetone drops and rubbing the puck method. If so, am glad it helped.

I am finding the residue that lifts off with the print is almost non-existant when using the puck ( also using an aluminium bed ).

Now try the same prints but lower bed temperature to 85 C. I have never had a print lift with this, and print starts faster and cools quicker afterwards.