ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 14, 2017 10:18PM
In this link is a photo of the past 5 prints I've done from every angle along with the relevant cura settings and the material I've used.

I could be wrong about the printing setting selecting if that is so please let me know.

I'm printing on a second hand folger tech reprap 2020 prusa i3 with a E3dv6 hot end.

I'm looking to resolve the following issues.
  1. Zits and blobs on the X & Y
  2. holes in the top
  3. rippling on the walls

For the first issue I was trying to use retraction to fix this. I had been increase the retraction distance and reducing the amount pushed back out.

For the second issue I had been making the top of the model thick

I haven't started to tackle the third issue because I feel I should resolve the other two issues first.

I've been trying to read every resource on 3d printing trouble shooting I can find. If you have other suggestion other than here and reddit I'm open to suggestions.

I'm now trying a bench to help me continue to tune the settings for ABS.

I'll add the settings for each Benchy one I have 5 of them.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 15, 2017 05:02AM
The Z surface looks a bit like you're printing too hot and/or too fast to let the object cool down before the next layer. Although 222 deg seems to be way too cold for ABS, I print mine at 247.

The side walls look like your printer is swinging or resonating when printing the outer walls. Do the vertical ripples change, when you print at half speed? What's your driver? Geared or direct? Bowden or extruder motor mounted on hotend?
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 15, 2017 10:14PM
Agreed. I print my ABS at 240c and slow it down to 40mm sec and i get really good prints.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 17, 2017 09:08PM
Quote
Inhumierer
The Z surface looks a bit like you're printing too hot and/or too fast to let the object cool down before the next layer. Although 222 deg seems to be way too cold for ABS, I print mine at 247.

The side walls look like your printer is swinging or resonating when printing the outer walls. Do the vertical ripples change, when you print at half speed? What's your driver? Geared or direct? Bowden or extruder motor mounted on hotend?

I haven't dropped the speed down to 40 yet. I'll try that tonight but I would like to work back up to 60. My stepper motor drivers are A4988 Stepper Drivers. It is a geared and the extruder motor is mounted on the hot end.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 18, 2017 02:10AM
Can you upload the gcode files ?

Chri


[chrisu02.wordpress.com] Quadmax Intel Delid Tools
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 18, 2017 02:58AM
Quote
The3rdIcon
I haven't dropped the speed down to 40 yet. I'll try that tonight but I would like to work back up to 60.
Is the cube 10 or 20 mm? You're printing one cube at a time? Lower to 20mm/s, or print 4 or 9 cubes at once.
Quote
The3rdIcon
My stepper motor drivers are A4988 Stepper Drivers. It is a geared and the extruder motor is mounted on the hot end.
The side perimeter artefacts may be caused by a directly driven extruder, as far as I read, but that's not the case.
The vertical ripples at the last photo, do they move if you move the cube a bit, maybe 5 mm?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2017 02:58AM by Inhumierer.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 09:33AM
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Inhumierer
The Z surface looks a bit like you're printing too hot and/or too fast to let the object cool down before the next layer. Although 222 deg seems to be way too cold for ABS, I print mine at 247.

The side walls look like your printer is swinging or resonating when printing the outer walls. Do the vertical ripples change, when you print at half speed? What's your driver? Geared or direct? Bowden or extruder motor mounted on hotend?

I haven't dropped the speed down to 40 yet. I'll try that tonight but I would like to work back up to 60. My stepper motor drivers are A4988 Stepper Drivers. It is a geared and the extruder motor is mounted on the hot end.

I didn't get a chance to take photos of the 3 benchys I've printed since I last posted but dropping the speed didn't improve anything. I'm going to try the same speed but increase the temp back up to 230 unless it isn't recommended to change too many settings. Still trying to figure out the best approach to trouble shooting 3d printers. Since I don;t have enough experience it seem like every time I have an issue I need to go to the interwebs.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 09:37AM
Quote
Inhumierer
Quote
The3rdIcon
I haven't dropped the speed down to 40 yet. I'll try that tonight but I would like to work back up to 60.
Is the cube 10 or 20 mm? You're printing one cube at a time? Lower to 20mm/s, or print 4 or 9 cubes at once.
Quote
The3rdIcon
My stepper motor drivers are A4988 Stepper Drivers. It is a geared and the extruder motor is mounted on the hot end.
The side perimeter artefacts may be caused by a directly driven extruder, as far as I read, but that's not the case.
The vertical ripples at the last photo, do they move if you move the cube a bit, maybe 5 mm?


I've been printing the 20mm cubes 1 at a time. I'm not 100% sure since I don't always print the cube in the same place. I guess that's another variable I'll have to start to control. I'll print a few tonight at one set of X&Y and then move it 5 mm like you suggest. I'll try and get all the photos up by the end of the week. if I'm lucky work has been kicking my but.


Do you have any suggestion for what could be the issue with the top layer or do you think that will get resolved with the speed setting?
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 10:43AM
Try printin 2 cubes at the same time, this will allow extra time for the layers to cool
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 01:02PM
Quote
obewan
Try printin 2 cubes at the same time, this will allow extra time for the layers to cool

I understand this logic but wouldn't the benchy test be a work around?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/20/2017 03:51PM by The3rdIcon.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 01:03PM
Quote
Chri
Can you upload the gcode files ?

Chri

Sorry I didn't notice this before. I'll post it when I get home tonight. So you have a specific version in mind or just the newest one.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 04:31PM
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Chri
Can you upload the gcode files ?

Chri

Sorry I didn't notice this before. I'll post it when I get home tonight. So you have a specific version in mind or just the newest one.

the one which you think is the best so far and from which you want to go further.

also X/Y/Z Acceleration and Jerk of the FW would be good to know.

Chri


[chrisu02.wordpress.com] Quadmax Intel Delid Tools
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 07:58PM
Quote
Chri
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Chri
Can you upload the gcode files ?

Chri

Sorry I didn't notice this before. I'll post it when I get home tonight. So you have a specific version in mind or just the newest one.

the one which you think is the best so far and from which you want to go further.

also X/Y/Z Acceleration and Jerk of the FW would be good to know.

Chri


I'm already tracking 21 different variables. I don;t think I want to keep tracking more and more because I'll loose site of what is important. I'm not even sure if I'm tracking the right things now. I'll add it to my list for the time being. Can you tell me what this helps to improve on my print thou?
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 20, 2017 08:46PM
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
obewan
Try printin 2 cubes at the same time, this will allow extra time for the layers to cool

I understand this logic but wouldn't the benchy test be a work around?

So printing 20 mm cube resulted in the best top layer I've had. The walls still appear to have minor under extrusion and waves similar to before.

Does this mean that I might still want to drop the over all temp down and increase the flow by 5%? or is there a better increment to increase the flow by?

Picture will come tomorrow when I have more free time in the evening to take the pictures and label the models according to the spreadsheet.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 21, 2017 02:14AM
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Chri
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Chri
Can you upload the gcode files ?

Chri

Sorry I didn't notice this before. I'll post it when I get home tonight. So you have a specific version in mind or just the newest one.

the one which you think is the best so far and from which you want to go further.

also X/Y/Z Acceleration and Jerk of the FW would be good to know.

Chri


I'm already tracking 21 different variables. I don;t think I want to keep tracking more and more because I'll loose site of what is important. I'm not even sure if I'm tracking the right things now. I'll add it to my list for the time being. Can you tell me what this helps to improve on my print thou?

Ok, then i`ll try it without the informations.

First of all, Acceleration, Yerk and Printing speed are one of the most important basic values to achieve good print quality.
Especial on a relative weak printer like this Folger tech it`s probably not good to have this values very high.

as other people also recommended, your printing speed is probably way to high, the per layer printing time without Filament cooling and ABS should be at least 15 seconds to be on the save side.
on even smaller objects it may have up to 20 seconds.
So check how much time one layer will take (not the first ones) and slower the speed until it takes at least 15 seconds.

the waves at the side have all three values involved, printing with to high speed when Acc and more important yerk is set too high.
the easiert way is to print not so fast, the second way is to lower acc and yerk so you can print faster again.

8 Top layer are way too much at 0.2 layer height, with this so will store too much heat energy at the top and also loose the "self regulation" function when flow is probably set too high.
3 to max. 4 layer should be enough.

Your Hotend temperature is also probably at the lower side whats recommended.
For example i`m only printing very tiny abs parts with 225°C because to not get too much heat energy into the part, this lowering also makes the part more weak as the material does not bond so good anymore.

normally you should start with about 235°C to 240°C to also get good bonding, later when printing faster you can go even higher (up to 250°C is normally save and depending on the vendor).

When i check your settings you probably have most of them still set to the default UM settings, they won`t fit your printer as they are too different.
Best way for you is to at least reduce all speed setting to the half value, if you want to print faster you can speed up the printer while printing with the M220 command.
You can export the printsetting with Cura 2.6.2, upload it here so we can check also this.

Chri


[chrisu02.wordpress.com] Quadmax Intel Delid Tools
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 25, 2017 11:15PM
Sorry it took me so long by my additional Benchys and the double cube are now up

Double cube I felt came out really well. The Benchy's not so much. The suffice still has a bunch of pits. It the tops are all look chewed on. While I was able to improve the stringiness the overhangs were all still horrible.

I'm going to try another print with the temp as high as the double cubes since that has been one of the better prints so far.

I've attached my cura profile. Sorry if some of this doesn't make sense. I had a very early morning and I'm about to pass out.

We'll see if we can turn this into a decent print yet.
Attachments:
open | download - Folger 2020 i3.curaprofile (909 bytes)
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 26, 2017 04:28AM
Your calibration cube top surface looks way better now. The benchy chimneys show lots of signs of too hot layers, they didn't have enought time to cool down. They're literally melting while printing.
I don't know which Cura version you're using. Mine doesn't have coasting integrated, so it must be a different one.

cool_min_layer_time is too small for ABS, try 30 or 45.
Usually for a bowden extruder you need a retraction of 3 to 8mm, but with a HE mounted geared driver like yours you may reduce this to 1mm, may reduce stringing.
Your cubes still have strange, regular vertical ripples at the sides. Do they change when reducing the speed, or do they wander when slightly changing object placement?
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 26, 2017 01:18PM
Quote
Inhumierer
Your calibration cube top surface looks way better now. The benchy chimneys show lots of signs of too hot layers, they didn't have enought time to cool down. They're literally melting while printing.
I don't know which Cura version you're using. Mine doesn't have coasting integrated, so it must be a different one.

cool_min_layer_time is too small for ABS, try 30 or 45.
Usually for a bowden extruder you need a retraction of 3 to 8mm, but with a HE mounted geared driver like yours you may reduce this to 1mm, may reduce stringing.
Your cubes still have strange, regular vertical ripples at the sides. Do they change when reducing the speed, or do they wander when slightly changing object placement?

I'm using cura 2.6.2 mostly because of the infill options. I've considered switching to slic3r. The one thing I don't like about Cura is when I've tried to increase the min layer time if I make it too large it will not let me slice. I'll look into reducing the retraction.

I'm going to try to reprint the 2x cubes at a lower speed to see if that helps.

As far as placement on the build plate to test if the ripples wonder. Is there a distance you can recommend of how far away from the original location I should put them? Are we talk 1 mm, 5, 10 or larger?
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 26, 2017 01:21PM
Quote
Chri
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Chri
Quote
The3rdIcon
Quote
Chri
Can you upload the gcode files ?

Chri

Sorry I didn't notice this before. I'll post it when I get home tonight. So you have a specific version in mind or just the newest one.

the one which you think is the best so far and from which you want to go further.

also X/Y/Z Acceleration and Jerk of the FW would be good to know.

Chri


I'm already tracking 21 different variables. I don;t think I want to keep tracking more and more because I'll loose site of what is important. I'm not even sure if I'm tracking the right things now. I'll add it to my list for the time being. Can you tell me what this helps to improve on my print thou?

Ok, then i`ll try it without the informations.

First of all, Acceleration, Yerk and Printing speed are one of the most important basic values to achieve good print quality.
Especial on a relative weak printer like this Folger tech it`s probably not good to have this values very high.

as other people also recommended, your printing speed is probably way to high, the per layer printing time without Filament cooling and ABS should be at least 15 seconds to be on the save side.
on even smaller objects it may have up to 20 seconds.
So check how much time one layer will take (not the first ones) and slower the speed until it takes at least 15 seconds.

the waves at the side have all three values involved, printing with to high speed when Acc and more important yerk is set too high.
the easiert way is to print not so fast, the second way is to lower acc and yerk so you can print faster again.

8 Top layer are way too much at 0.2 layer height, with this so will store too much heat energy at the top and also loose the "self regulation" function when flow is probably set too high.
3 to max. 4 layer should be enough.

Your Hotend temperature is also probably at the lower side whats recommended.
For example i`m only printing very tiny abs parts with 225°C because to not get too much heat energy into the part, this lowering also makes the part more weak as the material does not bond so good anymore.

normally you should start with about 235°C to 240°C to also get good bonding, later when printing faster you can go even higher (up to 250°C is normally save and depending on the vendor).

When i check your settings you probably have most of them still set to the default UM settings, they won`t fit your printer as they are too different.
Best way for you is to at least reduce all speed setting to the half value, if you want to print faster you can speed up the printer while printing with the M220 command.
You can export the printsetting with Cura 2.6.2, upload it here so we can check also this.

Chri

Are there any slicers out there that provide good information when they visualize the g code information? or do you need a separate program to get better information to allow you to modify the g code itself?
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
July 27, 2017 02:49AM
Quote
The3rdIcon
I'm using cura 2.6.2 mostly because of the infill options. I've considered switching to slic3r. The one thing I don't like about Cura is when I've tried to increase the min layer time if I make it too large it will not let me slice.
[...]
As far as placement on the build plate to test if the ripples wonder. Is there a distance you can recommend of how far away from the original location I should put them? Are we talk 1 mm, 5, 10 or larger?
Oops, I'm using Cura 15.01 - from Jan 2015 winking smiley I never looked for newer versions, I admit. I'll give the newest version a shot when back from holidays.
For the offset from your pictures I'd say something about 5mm would be a good try.
Re: ABS Setting/Calbration Issues with Cura
August 03, 2017 03:38PM
Quote
Inhumierer
Quote
The3rdIcon
I'm using cura 2.6.2 mostly because of the infill options. I've considered switching to slic3r. The one thing I don't like about Cura is when I've tried to increase the min layer time if I make it too large it will not let me slice.
[...]
As far as placement on the build plate to test if the ripples wonder. Is there a distance you can recommend of how far away from the original location I should put them? Are we talk 1 mm, 5, 10 or larger?
Oops, I'm using Cura 15.01 - from Jan 2015 winking smiley I never looked for newer versions, I admit. I'll give the newest version a shot when back from holidays.
For the offset from your pictures I'd say something about 5mm would be a good try.

I'm not sure if I'd be able to do the above now. My fiance ran our dryer and pumped all the moist air my printers way. Setting that worked before aren't working since my print has large holes in it from the moisture. I'm going to try and make it in the oven for an hour or two but I'm not sure if this will work. I have another roll but I'm not sure if the same setting will work.

Do you have any suggestion for drying the old roll and preventing the new roll from meeting the same fate?
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