ABS.. what needs adjusting?
Posted by jdebuhr
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ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 06, 2020 10:54PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
First try at ABS printing...
Setup:
- Hatchbox ABS with temp rating of 210-240
- bed leveled
- e3d extruder
I printed with the bed at 110c and the filament at 235c
Attached in black is the ABS and also attached is a blue part done in PLA.
Where do I need to look or adjust for ABS? What am I doing wrong?
Setup:
- Hatchbox ABS with temp rating of 210-240
- bed leveled
- e3d extruder
I printed with the bed at 110c and the filament at 235c
Attached in black is the ABS and also attached is a blue part done in PLA.
Where do I need to look or adjust for ABS? What am I doing wrong?
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 07, 2020 07:51AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 5,780 |
Try turning the bed temp down a bit. otherwise, it's hard to say what should be done based on that picture.
Is your printer enclosed? Is it warm inside the enclosure (50C)?
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Is your printer enclosed? Is it warm inside the enclosure (50C)?
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 07, 2020 08:03AM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 07, 2020 08:43AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 204 |
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 07, 2020 08:50AM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 07, 2020 11:14AM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 5,780 |
Pillowing is often caused by a combo of high bed temperature and sparse infill. 20% infill should be enough.
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 07, 2020 11:30AM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
is pillowing more of an indent? this is more like a blister (puffed out)
Edit.. Upon looking at the filament I found some info that the recommended Bed Temp is 55-85 (Ref: [www.3dcentralva.com])
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/07/2020 01:59PM by jdebuhr.
Edit.. Upon looking at the filament I found some info that the recommended Bed Temp is 55-85 (Ref: [www.3dcentralva.com])
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/07/2020 01:59PM by jdebuhr.
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 08, 2020 05:18PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
Printed a Benchy
Hatchbox ABS
Filament Temp 220
Be d Temp 95 first layer then 85
Used the Nozzle fan @ 20% after layer 1, 30% for bridges.
Going to try again with no fans. I see the blisters/pillowing is gone
bottom looks bad as does the bridging. The Bottom I believe has text 3DBenchy or something.
pictures attached
Thoughts?
I tried a couple lower temps but this looked the best so far
Hatchbox ABS
Filament Temp 220
Be d Temp 95 first layer then 85
Used the Nozzle fan @ 20% after layer 1, 30% for bridges.
Going to try again with no fans. I see the blisters/pillowing is gone
bottom looks bad as does the bridging. The Bottom I believe has text 3DBenchy or something.
pictures attached
Thoughts?
I tried a couple lower temps but this looked the best so far
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 08, 2020 05:42PM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 5,780 |
It looks like the nozzle is too far from the bed on the bottom of the print.
Never use a print cooling fan with ABS. You don't want it to cool quickly- that will cause the print to delaminate.
That print looks awfully shiny for ABS...
I have a blog post on setting up a printer for ABS: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/08/2020 05:43PM by the_digital_dentist.
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Never use a print cooling fan with ABS. You don't want it to cool quickly- that will cause the print to delaminate.
That print looks awfully shiny for ABS...
I have a blog post on setting up a printer for ABS: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/08/2020 05:43PM by the_digital_dentist.
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 08, 2020 06:07PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 09, 2020 07:17AM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 413 |
Do whatever DD says.
1st layer is bad. Actually looks very strange with no complete infill. Check you haven't got a model that's positioned below the bed so the slicer misses a solid base. Not actually sure how you get this issue. Do you have different infill settings for different layers?
What layer height are you using?
Bad corners and overhangs can be caused by excessive layer height.
1st layer is bad. Actually looks very strange with no complete infill. Check you haven't got a model that's positioned below the bed so the slicer misses a solid base. Not actually sure how you get this issue. Do you have different infill settings for different layers?
What layer height are you using?
Bad corners and overhangs can be caused by excessive layer height.
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 09, 2020 10:54AM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 204 |
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 09, 2020 11:03AM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
I am using Prusa Slicer
.20mm layer thickness
20% infill
maybe this is my problem, a friend on mine likes prusa slicer. maybe i need to try a different one? as I have noticed that the same object will slice and printer different depending on the slicer used'
object is at 0.00
The other thing is the temperature for printing ABS and the temperature rating of the stuff i have is different..
if I print at 240-255 no fan I get the blistering however a couple reviews I see on the Hatchbox ABS is use the fan at a low setting and it prints fine.
Based on all the Info from DD, I know he knows what he is talking about. but I still keep having issues..
.20mm layer thickness
20% infill
maybe this is my problem, a friend on mine likes prusa slicer. maybe i need to try a different one? as I have noticed that the same object will slice and printer different depending on the slicer used'
object is at 0.00
The other thing is the temperature for printing ABS and the temperature rating of the stuff i have is different..
if I print at 240-255 no fan I get the blistering however a couple reviews I see on the Hatchbox ABS is use the fan at a low setting and it prints fine.
Based on all the Info from DD, I know he knows what he is talking about. but I still keep having issues..
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 09, 2020 02:43PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
So I reset the nozzle to the bed.. I used CURA to slice it.. noticed some issues of holes in spots and stopped it.. bottom was better..
tried the Prusa Slicer build.. got part way through and I saw bad results.. stopped it.
did it again with Cura, but something happened at the roof when I stepped away and it did not finish however it is the best one to date
I am questioning how true my ABS really is.. what are some good brands to try.
Going to tweak the Cura settings and try again
tried the Prusa Slicer build.. got part way through and I saw bad results.. stopped it.
did it again with Cura, but something happened at the roof when I stepped away and it did not finish however it is the best one to date
I am questioning how true my ABS really is.. what are some good brands to try.
Going to tweak the Cura settings and try again
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 09, 2020 03:08PM |
Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 5,780 |
Are you using a custom printer profile in PrusaSlicer or us a profile for one of the Prusa printers? Using a Prusa printer profile is likely to yield poor results on a non Prusa printer.
Have you turned on the advanced/expert mode in PrusaSlicer so you can see/set all the parameters?
Every slicer will give slightly different results in some things (seam positioning, scarring, path routing, etc.) and very different results in others (supports, etc.). It's useful to be able to switch between slicers when you need a different types of infill or support material.
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
Have you turned on the advanced/expert mode in PrusaSlicer so you can see/set all the parameters?
Every slicer will give slightly different results in some things (seam positioning, scarring, path routing, etc.) and very different results in others (supports, etc.). It's useful to be able to switch between slicers when you need a different types of infill or support material.
Ultra MegaMax Dominator 3D printer: [drmrehorst.blogspot.com]
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 09, 2020 04:00PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
I have it on advanced mode. Cura seems a bit better for me, last print looked good but poor adherence caused some issues.. I will keep playing with the settings and adjustments.
The printer I am trying this on is essentially a Prusa MK2 with Folgertech frame. I am using prusa firmware as this has a MK42 bed and want to take advantage of that calibration stuff.
The PLA print above came out good so now I want to print ABS. I still need to make an enclosure
The printer I am trying this on is essentially a Prusa MK2 with Folgertech frame. I am using prusa firmware as this has a MK42 bed and want to take advantage of that calibration stuff.
The PLA print above came out good so now I want to print ABS. I still need to make an enclosure
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 10, 2020 11:18AM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 413 |
Can you watch what happens when it prints the 1st layer and let us know.
There is no defined perimeter. Theres some diagonal fill around the edges but no complete solid layer. The next layer seems to be at 60 degrees to the 1st and almost vertical in the picture. It then looks like the next layer is at 60 degrees again. That doesn't make sense for infill.
One guess is that the nozzle is to close to the bed for the 1st layer and you are getting nothing except may be a few blobs. It then tries to print the 2nd layer. This is effectively in mid air so the filament is going all over the place.
Do you only have one solid layer set?
There is no defined perimeter. Theres some diagonal fill around the edges but no complete solid layer. The next layer seems to be at 60 degrees to the 1st and almost vertical in the picture. It then looks like the next layer is at 60 degrees again. That doesn't make sense for infill.
One guess is that the nozzle is to close to the bed for the 1st layer and you are getting nothing except may be a few blobs. It then tries to print the 2nd layer. This is effectively in mid air so the filament is going all over the place.
Do you only have one solid layer set?
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 10, 2020 01:06PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
I will check it out. Going to try printing something less complex today..
Here is a picture of Cura and Prusa slicer prints.. vastly different but I don’t see much difference in settings..
Cura is the top one
Here is a picture of Cura and Prusa slicer prints.. vastly different but I don’t see much difference in settings..
Cura is the top one
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 10, 2020 02:32PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
so the bubbles I posts before are due to the ABS not able to span across the gaps.. I have 20% infill, if I did more infill it would probably work better..
Couple parts I am targeting to print will probably be higher infill anyway. but I find it interesting to see that is where the bubble effect is..
As for bottom layers, the print I am doing now has 4 layers.. and the only changes I made were speed (slower) and running @ 255 / 110 first layer the bed was 100
Couple parts I am targeting to print will probably be higher infill anyway. but I find it interesting to see that is where the bubble effect is..
As for bottom layers, the print I am doing now has 4 layers.. and the only changes I made were speed (slower) and running @ 255 / 110 first layer the bed was 100
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 11, 2020 07:49AM |
Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 413 |
Makes more sense now as i can see you have characters in the bottom layer.
Left one is best. Shows more squish on 1st layer. However the perimeters don't look joined so i think you may be under extruding.
Check extruder calibration and extrusion width settings.
Set 1st layer extrusion multiplier to about 130% to get good squish and compensate for nozzle height variability.
Looks like you have different infill directions set for 1st layer and general. Don't know why you don't have solid infill above the letters. May be the general under extrusion issue. That's why when you look through the letters the filaments running vertically have spaces between them.
Left one is best. Shows more squish on 1st layer. However the perimeters don't look joined so i think you may be under extruding.
Check extruder calibration and extrusion width settings.
Set 1st layer extrusion multiplier to about 130% to get good squish and compensate for nozzle height variability.
Looks like you have different infill directions set for 1st layer and general. Don't know why you don't have solid infill above the letters. May be the general under extrusion issue. That's why when you look through the letters the filaments running vertically have spaces between them.
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 11, 2020 09:24AM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
Quote
MCcarman
Makes more sense now as i can see you have characters in the bottom layer.
Left one is best. Shows more squish on 1st layer. However the perimeters don't look joined so i think you may be under extruding.
Check extruder calibration and extrusion width settings.
Set 1st layer extrusion multiplier to about 130% to get good squish and compensate for nozzle height variability.
Looks like you have different infill directions set for 1st layer and general. Don't know why you don't have solid infill above the letters. May be the general under extrusion issue. That's why when you look through the letters the filaments running vertically have spaces between them.
Hmm, now why did the picture turn 90 degrees, Cura was the left one. I found the perimeter outline was different between them, the other difference is the Prusa Slicer hops the Z in some instances which I guess is an ok thing. the 2 prints were 255 /110
I printed 2 other parts yesterday sliced with PrusaSlicer. both turned out decent, however the one has the bubbles from the infill setting I have but the bottom looked ok. Looks like it is adjusting the settings in the slicer to get it right. I have another piece I need to print, might do it today, I was going to use PLA, but might just use ABS, it is a test print of a part I am working on, so why not test for both.
I will look for the extrusion multiplier setting..
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 11, 2020 07:14PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
My print today.. Hatchbox ABS temp 255/110 but 100 bed for first layer
The stuff that use support looks ok. Bottom looks good the one not so good area is a bed issue
The was printed @ .2mm 30% infill
The stuff that use support looks ok. Bottom looks good the one not so good area is a bed issue
The was printed @ .2mm 30% infill
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? May 14, 2020 11:33PM |
Registered: 4 years ago Posts: 77 |
Thanks for all the help..
255/100 then 110 seems to work fine.. I need to figure out an enclosure and a good spot for the printer..
Also I will be working on rebuilding one of my printers.. Might even look to get a better frame and ditch the acrylic
I do know I really like the PEI sheet on my one printer.. that is great for printing on
255/100 then 110 seems to work fine.. I need to figure out an enclosure and a good spot for the printer..
Also I will be working on rebuilding one of my printers.. Might even look to get a better frame and ditch the acrylic
I do know I really like the PEI sheet on my one printer.. that is great for printing on
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Re: ABS.. what needs adjusting? June 13, 2020 11:03PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 294 |
I don't have an enclosure and get prints better than those, so I think something else is going on, possibly over extrusion.
You might want to recalibrate your Steps/mm on the extruder and turn your extrusion multiplier down, maybe 0.96
I run my ABS about 240-235 and 110 on the bed
0.2 mm with 0.4mm nozzle
50% first layer speed.
There also looks like there is some ringing and possibly over extrusion on the ends of the first layer which might have something to do with accel and jerk settings.
You might want to recalibrate your Steps/mm on the extruder and turn your extrusion multiplier down, maybe 0.96
I run my ABS about 240-235 and 110 on the bed
0.2 mm with 0.4mm nozzle
50% first layer speed.
There also looks like there is some ringing and possibly over extrusion on the ends of the first layer which might have something to do with accel and jerk settings.
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