Support Material - when is it needed

So I am getting around to making some improvements to my printer and am going to be reprinting the Duet housing, I am printing it much deeper and altering it a bit so that the fan housing I have made will fit. Does anyone know how the power and SD card slots were printed? Did they have support material? Surely if they did not the print would not be such good quality and the "top" of the hole would have considerable sag. I want to do a similar thing to the ethernet housing. I am about to try using the default support material setting in slic3r but since I have never used it before I am worried about what the final product will look like.

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Ormerod 313

I reprinted the Duet housing a few weeks ago using the standard Ormerod settings for slic3r and the holes printed perfectly with no sag. How are you making the housing deeper? I have loaded up the stl files but have not been able to change anything. What program are you using?

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appjaws - Core XYUV Duet Ethernet Duex5
firmware 3.1.1 Web Interface 3.1.1
Ormerod 1-converted to laser engraver, Duet wifi
OpenSCAD version 2020.07
slic3r-1.3.0, Simplify3D 4.1.2, Cura-4.4.1

I am using solidworks to make the case deeper. I also wanted to enclose the ethernet plug but am worried that doing that without a sopport will cause problems because it is a fairly wide gap to cover. If it works I can give you the stl of the modified case.

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Ormerod 313

While we are on the subject of the Duet enclosure, the hot end sensor kits I am shipping include a 2-pin header socket to connect the blue wire from the sensor and the new control wire from the Duet to the sensor board (except for kit 4). Using the standard Duet enclosure, you have the choice of not fitting the back cover, not using the plastic header and bending the expansion connector pins so that you can fit the back cover, or adding new header pins at the bottom of the board as I did. A sufficiently deep enclosure would avoid the problem.

I am using a fan inlet duct based on Andy's design but thinner (details at [github.com]), so that there is just room for the hot end to slide behind the Duet enclosure. I have to fit the Duet enclosure right up to the end of the extrusion to have enough room for this, which involves rotating the right hand T-nut and then sliding it up to the end of the extrusion.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/24/2014 10:34AM by dc42.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Hi tracyb,
On my print of the enclosure all openings bridged very well so I don't think you will have a problem.
If you could make the enclosure deep enough for the sensor connections as in DC42 post, I would like the stl, perhaps you could post it here. Some users have made quite large fan covers and one post suggested angling the enclosure so that the whole assembly leans away from the bed, so allowing room for the fan enclosures. This seemed such a good idea to me, I wonder if you could incorporate this as well. The only downside is that the spool can not be used, however, most of us use 1Kg reels anyway.

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appjaws - Core XYUV Duet Ethernet Duex5
firmware 3.1.1 Web Interface 3.1.1
Ormerod 1-converted to laser engraver, Duet wifi
OpenSCAD version 2020.07
slic3r-1.3.0, Simplify3D 4.1.2, Cura-4.4.1

Before I print how deep is deep enough - I went about 12mm deeper for myself because that was to allow for the ethernet header and to allow the wires some space so that they would not get crushed and would generally have more space. I will be putting the cover back on but without the filament spool as I don't think that would belong there.

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Ormerod 313

7mm deeper should be enough to provide room for the sensor connector.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

I agree with dc42, another 7mm will be just right.
I'm away at the moment but will print your new design as soon as I can get back to my Ormerod.
Thank you for your efforts.

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appjaws - Core XYUV Duet Ethernet Duex5
firmware 3.1.1 Web Interface 3.1.1
Ormerod 1-converted to laser engraver, Duet wifi
OpenSCAD version 2020.07
slic3r-1.3.0, Simplify3D 4.1.2, Cura-4.4.1

Well the support material settings did not work - the support material is basically un snappable and I will have to machine it out. Good learning curve though. The print quality wasn't great and during the print the x carriage stopped being a press fit with the roller bearing so now I have to print that part. I am thinking of printing a modified carriage so that I can still use my 9mm bearing. Then I will have to re-do my bed. All my previous prints have been great - but the size of this one highlighted that the bed is way off - slightly curved edges, not great surface finish etc etc. Hopefully a metal bed with self leveling springs will fix this issue

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Ormerod 313

Quote
tracyb
Well the support material settings did not work - the support material is basically un snappable and I will have to machine it out. Good learning curve though. The print quality wasn't great and during the print the x carriage stopped being a press fit with the roller bearing so now I have to print that part. I am thinking of printing a modified carriage so that I can still use my 9mm bearing. Then I will have to re-do my bed. All my previous prints have been great - but the size of this one highlighted that the bed is way off - slightly curved edges, not great surface finish etc etc. Hopefully a metal bed with self leveling springs will fix this issue

Cura does a far better job of adding snap-off support material than Slic3r, so you could try that (you will need the plugins - see the "Cura" thread).

If the base of your print is curved, I suspect the part warped and lifted during the print - use a hotter bed temperature and ensure there are no draughts near the printer, and fit a backwash deflector to the fan. A curved X axis on the print would indicate that your acrylic X arm is curved or twisted (sight along it). I cannot think of anything that would result in the Ormerod's Y or Z axis curving. Regular bumps along the Z axis is a sign that your Z gears or threaded rod is binding in places or are not concentric or the threaded rod is bent, whilst irregular bumps along the Z axis can be caused by the X arm moving from side to side during a print - often due to the filament pulling on the extruder every now and then as it unrolls from the reel. I've mounted my extruder on the innermost position (closest to the Z pillar) in order to reduce the effect of the filament pulling the X arm out of true.

Dave
(#106)

(I posted this in the other thread about support material)

As someone emailed me and asked what we do, here's what I suggest:

Support material is tricky, and there doesn't seem to be much definitive information about it. We try and avoid using it. When we do, we tend to reduce the extrusion width of support, to the point that it barely sticks to itself! Usually, this means setting it smaller than the width of the nozzle, ie with a 0.5mm nozzle, printing at 0.2mm layer height, make the extrusion width 0.3mm. This usually makes it much lighter, but can make it a bit too fragile. Change this in Slic3r in 'Print Settings > Advanced > Extrusion width > Support material'. Experimentation is the key!

Ian
RepRapPro tech support

Hi tracyb,
Did you manage to increase the depth of the Duet enclosure? If you have already printed yours with an additional 12mm could I have a copy of the stl file please.

Thank you for your help
Paul

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appjaws - Core XYUV Duet Ethernet Duex5
firmware 3.1.1 Web Interface 3.1.1
Ormerod 1-converted to laser engraver, Duet wifi
OpenSCAD version 2020.07
slic3r-1.3.0, Simplify3D 4.1.2, Cura-4.4.1