jpp
Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:14AM
We are a couple of friends, who have bought the Ormerod.
So far none of us have heard of anybody, who managed to get it working without major flaws.
Has any of you managed to get it running without having to accept any major flaws?
The reason for this question, is that we are discussing if we should throw in the towel, or it's worth the effort to keep on trying.
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:17AM
Hi jpp,

there have been many discussions here about returning, flaws etc.

My opinion: If you bought it as a "kit which can be assembled in 2 hours without hassle" (RS still advertises it exactly so) then throw in the towel.
If you like challenges, an affordable printer with a good quality and accepting that it's still in beta then keep trying winking smiley I think it's worth doing so.

Markus


XBee & electronics blog: [lookmanowire.blogspot.com]
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:36AM
I would add, yes there is development element for improvement and there is a great active improvement community. But in looking at the build of my system #007 so very early, what was essential and what is an enhancement?

Well the replacement DUET to cure switching regulator and fix USB socket, but that is possibly the only essential in my view.
Obviously that includes using the latest firmware and software and you will then have a good USB connected system.

Other mods are all improvements and very valuable ones, the one I am waiting for is the z-height sensor being worked on by DC42 and RRP, this will then provide a good working solution for USB and using PLA.

Markus, Ray and others have done great work in optimising things for below 0.1mm slicing, which is very exciting.
For larger prints the fan inlet print will also be essential and I'll be printing mine soon.

The improvements being discussed such as belt tension, z drive gears, glass clamps, PSU enhancements and more will all be great improvements, but you can print good prints with the current build. I now have a far greater knowledge of how 3D printing works and the design techniques that can be used to get some great prints.

I suggest you list your flaws and get pointers from the forum, but do read the topics posted as to whether they are essential now or nice to have later.

[edit] @Markus where did you see the 2 hour assembly? I though RS removed that soon after my purchase.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/15/2014 08:38AM by Treth.


Ormerod #007 (shaken but not stirred!)
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:39AM
All the flaws can be worked around, and RRP have already modified the design to solve some of them. It's certainly not the 2-hour kit that was originally advertised, but it's capable of good prints, and the design and firmware are improving all the time. I've listed workarounds for common issues in my unofficial troubleshooting guide at [forums.reprap.org].

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/15/2014 08:39AM by dc42.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:47AM
From Twitter, three hours ago:



RS Components ‏@RSElectronics 3h
#Ormerod is a quick to assemble #3D printer. Starting with the kit, we can get one working in 2 hours! [ow.ly]

Markus


XBee & electronics blog: [lookmanowire.blogspot.com]
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:49AM
JPP

Don't throw in the towel yet. If you have assembled the printer as per spec then you will need to do a few things (from my experience)

1) USB power. Get a little USB hub with external 5V power if your computer cannot handle it.
2) Flash the Duet with the latest firmware. You don't even want to start using the stuff it was shipped with.
3) Clean out the SDcard and USB enclosure openings, especially the SDcard because it might get stuck.
4) Solder the USB socket. The supports were left unsoldered.
5) Get the custom Pronterface installed (not the prebuilt one)
6) Level you Z axis as perfect as possible. You will need longer screws and you will need to tune each corner. Also make sure the Y belt is nice and secure with good tension.
7) Read up about the fan back wash. Make this one of your first prints and choose one of the designs to lessen the back wash. Probably first start with snowman.g and temporarily control the backwash with kapton tape and paper until you have a cover done.
8) My PSU gave me lots of problems. Maybe you might be lucky and it is good enough to power the system for PLA and ABS. If not go and buy a more powerful one.
9) My head mount sagged. Read up about it on the forum and print out a replacement. If you use it as designed it will drop. I printed my replacement parts last night and it is working great.
10) Ethernet. I have not tried again but mine never worked. But with Pronterface you probably don't need it now.
11) You might also battle with the IR sensor for Z axis zeroing. The sensor works great for the X axis and basic zeroing on Z BUT the sensitivity varies and I can never get the Z axis to calibrate the same height twice in a row. So get the Z almost these, manually set and zero it. I also sometimes tweak the Z axis threaded rod while it is starting with a print. On Sli3er set the program to generate e.g. 4 skirts. This will allow you enough time to tweak it perfectly. You want the extrusion to almost squish a bit, not too low to stop it or too high to not adhere to the bed.

So these above were some of my headaches. But believe me, once you sort out the these problems the printer works beautifully.

So keep on trying ;-)
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 08:52AM
@Markus thumbs up thanks.
I sent this to a friend at RS for comment.


Ormerod #007 (shaken but not stirred!)
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 09:01AM
Markus

I think if you know all the parts, have the screws laid out for each section, have the proper tools, have built one before then just maybe you can do it in 2 hours. I spent hours making sure I had the right screw or bearing, how to cut the timing belt, what is up or down etc... Just the double and tripple checking took most of the time. Most people know if you break something it might be weeks before you can get a replacement. But RS did make it sound that you basically need to erect the thing from 12h00 to 14h00 and be printing 14h01. Not really possible.
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 09:06AM
@victors

I don't even care smiling smiley It's marketing buzz.

Markus


XBee & electronics blog: [lookmanowire.blogspot.com]
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 09:51AM
Don't give up!

I have No. 144 and significantly less issues than many others, My total build time took approx 8hrs.

For me being able to print 3D stuff is a pleasurable side affect of this brilliant, challenging but ultimately enjoyable kit.

Matt


Limited Edition Red RS Ormerod 1 #144 of 200 - RRP 1.09fw
iamburnys Ormerod Upgrades Github
Follow me on ThingiVerse My Designs
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 15, 2014 10:40AM
jpp - the instructions are much better than many of us had when building - most of the guesswork has gone, and I reckon two people should be able to build the machine comfortably in 8 hours (without hating aech other by the end of itsmiling smiley). following the advice people have given above, then searching the forum if you have any issues should get you going very quickly.

RRP are very responsive through this forum (and I think they have breathing time to answer email promptly now too) if you hit snags during the build or commissioning

The result is worth the effort you put in for sure, so I suggest you go for it.

Ray

ps the colleague who helped me put mine together over a couple of days, and has seen the frustrations I've had getting higher resolution prints bought a PrintrBot for £300 and built it in four hours on Friday and had the cheek to give me his first print, printed at a 0.1mm layer height!
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 16, 2014 01:28AM
Jpp,

I'm a good example here , I wait for 1 month from messed up order from RS . And received it by yesterday finally.
I'm thinking of cancel order before this, because of the long wait and also flaws that had been reported on forums.
Treth explained to me about the challenge and fun to build , and I decided not to cancel the order.
I spent 6 hours to complete the mechanical parts, and I will continue to finished up the electronic parts by tonight.

Problems? Yes, I have problems here, missing USB cable, x carriage bearing leave a big gap caused 2mm free play, strange lm12uu bearing behavior etc, but RepRap Pro answered my mail fast and parts are under warranty , and a lot of nice guy willing to share their building experience in here.

Since you and friends purchased the Ormerod, should be easier to assemble than working alone.
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 16, 2014 05:26AM
Hello,
Obviously on a forum such as this one reads the problems associated with the product in order to try and solve them and improve the product; so it's easy to get the impression there are nothing but problems with the product.
From my personal experience, apart from closely following the instructions online (which are very well and clearly written), I only had the following, easily surmountable issues:

Problem 1: Missing printed part in kit - part quickly shipped out by RRP
Problem 2: Poor communication - bought new memory card
Problem 3: Bad comms with extruder motor - replacement DUET board quickly shipped out by RRP
Problem 4: Poor extrusion during printing - realized I'd assembled the extruder assembly incorrectly (my fault, quickly resolved)
Problem 5: X axis crashed during homing after z axis calibration - applied white sticker to x axis stopper to trigger newly configured sensor
Problem 6: X axis sagging - bought 10mm bearing.

I also had a couple of small mis-understandings of the build/firmware instructions, which I believe have since been improved.

Personally I have not had any issues with backwash (I've printed plastic horse shoe inserts, which are basically giant washers 120mm OD, 100mm ID, 5mm high without any lifting/warping)
I've not had any issues yet with power or bad calibrations or a few of the other things experienced by people on this forum.

I currently print from memory card and am personally confident to leave the machine running over night (although not advised), as the device has never crashed, overheated or turned out a bad quality print. So far I've not tried any prints finer than 0.24mm, but repeatability at that resolution is good.

Before printing I've taken to following these steps:

1. Ensure orientation of part is correct in netfabb
2. Slice the part in slic3r
3. Load the part onto memory card, insert in machine and plug into laptop
4. Open pronterface, connect and heat up bed
5. Clean bed with alcohol spray
6. Heat up tip and test extrusion (a couple of cm above bed) clear extruded plastic away with needle file. Reverse extrude by 5-10mm
7. Load and 'print' setbed file
8. Home all axis.
9. Load file from SD card and press print.
10. Hang around until the first layer has successfully printed.

After printing, let bed cool (done automatically if left). If the part is well stuck on, remove glass and hit part parallel to glass carefully with a hammer.

Obviously this procedure is a little tedious, but it doesn't take long when it's been done a few times and you have everything to hand. I think firmware improvements may soon improve uploading files through USB connection, which would be very welcome.
Stick with it!
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 16, 2014 05:32AM
Mine didn't have any serious issues. It took a lot longer to assemble then advertised and the SD card wouldn't work but after that I was printing. I am still printing below the quality I would like but I am trying and learning and things are improving. The only complaint I have at the moment is that it is ok for reprap or a community member to say here is the design for a new section - such as the improved IR sensor, or don't worry we will be selling the improvement shortly,but since I was under the impression that I was buying a working design from RS I don't have any further funding available to me to purchase the upgrades. I would appreciate RepRap or RS giving those very necessary upgrades to make the machine work to me at no cost.

That said the support on this forum is amazing and things are improving all the time. Reprap themselves are always involved in helping sort out the teething issues. The kits should also be improving as well. If you are very worried then why not hold back your order for a few months until the major bugs are sorted, but in the long run I think this printer will be worth it.


Ormerod 313
jpp
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 19, 2014 02:25PM
Thanks for all your replys.smiling smiley

Best regards
john
Re: Ormerod without major issues?
January 21, 2014 12:28PM
I have #282, I took 1.5 days (not 2hrs as advertised) to put together and another day to get printing. My first few prints were a bit crap mainly because I was too impatient to commission the printer properly and to learn to use the slicer properly too. My Ethernet would not work, then I broke my USB connector and because RepRap was shut over Xmas I spent a few days (in vain) trying to get Ethernet working as my only way of communicating with the printer.

Eventually RepRap replaced my board for free and with it the Ethernet started working, although I see no need for it as Pronterface is excellent.

At risk of not making friends (but I do not mean any disrespect obviously) I think some here are creating problems for themselves, with PLA at least:

- if you clean your bed with acetone PLA will stick to Kapton like sh*t to a blanket so no need to experiment with blue tape, cement, high bed temperatures etc.
- again, if you clean your bed (with acetone in my case) there is no warping so no need to embark in designing a backwash fan cover (have warped 2 parts in 3.5kg of PLA, attributed to poor filament quality);
- if you spend a few minutes tensioning your belt (with a friend helping) the y-axis won't slip (at least up to 50mm/s), so no need to embark in designing belt tensioners;
- automatic bed compensation? have spent a few minutes doing it the old fashion way with spirit levels and I get very large and tall parts to fit within very tight tolerances (in fact it is simply unbelievable);
- Ethernet? Pronterface works perfectly for me, I have to be by the printer before a print to clean the bed, so I use the USB port, then unplug and go away, has never let me down;
- parts that only print half way? has only happened twice when I did not let slicer finish;
- homing Z not accurate enough? I finish by hand with a piece of paper, 4-5 clicks on -0.1 and G92 Z0 - takes 10sec;
- noisy fan, poor PSU performance? don't know it works. If I looked at it with a scope I might be horrified, but it works so why should I?

Again, 3.5kg PLA, printing lasting between 50min and 38hrs, more typically 6-8hrs per print, used everyday since 07/01 when I got new board from Ian, on average 15hrs per day 7 days per week.
The finish and quality of the parts is simply amazing (and with 240micron layers). I have printed mechanical assemblies with long, fine, large diameter splines that fits incredibly tightly. There are resin and sintered metal printers where I work, costing several 10s and several 100s of k£ where I work. The operators can't believe what comes out of a £500 printer, at £20/kg;

The thing is, I have too much stuff to print to get side tracked creating problems for myself.
So don't waste too much worrying about problems you may not exist in the first place and just get printing.

Would I recommend it to a friend? Not if he is going to blame me later, but the day I cannot print fast enough I will not think twice about buying another one.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2014 12:28PM by arnaud31.
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