Ormerod reviews
Posted by droftarts
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 05, 2014 06:46PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 43 |
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 06, 2014 10:56AM |
Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 327 |
Having worked in tech support I know how hard it can be, everyone wants to be a priority, and you bare the brunt of their frustrations. I personally, am very pleased with the support provided by RepRap. I just received a replacement Duet today, so big thanks Ian. There aren't many companies that will send out a replacement part, without receiving the original one back first.
It's also nice to see a representative active here in the forums, and quite often outside of office hours.
Keep up the good work.
Les
Pointy's Things
Pointy's Blog
It's also nice to see a representative active here in the forums, and quite often outside of office hours.
Keep up the good work.
Les
Pointy's Things
Pointy's Blog
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 06, 2014 11:32AM |
Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 145 |
A major part of Ormerod's success is down to Ian's presence here on the various forums - ably backed by the rest of the Tech Support team at RepRapPro.
Equally important has been the input to this forum - over 10 thousand postings in about six months.
Phenomenal develoment input from many (dc42 and iamburny in particular).
I had not quite realised how much of a 'kit' I was getting, and was close to 'throwing in the towel' at one stage when my 70 year old eyesight and dexterity was not qute up to the job.
Ian and dc42 got me through that period, and I now have a machine which will reliably turn out PLA to a good standard. I hope soon to get reliable results in ABS.
Greg
Ormerod #17
Equally important has been the input to this forum - over 10 thousand postings in about six months.
Phenomenal develoment input from many (dc42 and iamburny in particular).
I had not quite realised how much of a 'kit' I was getting, and was close to 'throwing in the towel' at one stage when my 70 year old eyesight and dexterity was not qute up to the job.
Ian and dc42 got me through that period, and I now have a machine which will reliably turn out PLA to a good standard. I hope soon to get reliable results in ABS.
Greg
Ormerod #17
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 07, 2014 08:55AM |
Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 32 |
My expectation of RS in Australia was that at the least they would supply me with a micro SD card that worked, however it seems this commonly known fault of cards supplied with early printers has only been ignored and denied by RS ONLINE Australia when dealing with me.
So droftarts, whilst the ormerod is something I enjoy, and something you should take much pride in, RS is now a company I have nothing but resentment towards (luckily faulty SD cards aren't generators of large amounts of resentment).
I feel no advantage to posting a review which states the above as it would only be removed.
In other news, I am looking forward to playing with the new firmware when I get back home in ten days, and having just read the discussion on bed temps I will suggest this could be of value on your instructions pages as a side note to save some time for newer users.
No pressure, but do you have a timeline for working in dc42's firmware changes?
Thanks
So droftarts, whilst the ormerod is something I enjoy, and something you should take much pride in, RS is now a company I have nothing but resentment towards (luckily faulty SD cards aren't generators of large amounts of resentment).
I feel no advantage to posting a review which states the above as it would only be removed.
In other news, I am looking forward to playing with the new firmware when I get back home in ten days, and having just read the discussion on bed temps I will suggest this could be of value on your instructions pages as a side note to save some time for newer users.
No pressure, but do you have a timeline for working in dc42's firmware changes?
Thanks
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 08, 2014 03:11PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 12 |
Assembled my printer about 2 weeks ago. Assembly to working took 2 days or about 20 hours in total. First prints were terrible but that is to be expected and only got better print after print.
Unfortunately I do have some issues with the printer that I think should have been picked up before shipping since these are common problems:
1) X-axis: in general a bad design. Problems from most crippling
a) The x-axis fan shield was lower than the print head out of the box in my case. None of the fixes suggested are really easy without another printer or tools. The easy fix with minimal cost is to increase the bearing adjustment slot length or change the adjustment method. (I used a piece op paper to change the head angle)
b) Sagging of the hot-end. Several suggested fixes on the forum.
c) if the filament feeder tilts on the x-axis, the x-axis bearing at the back can not go past it. This is because the stepper motor weighs it to the one side and the bracket should have been designed to balance it better.
2) Y belt tension: I cannot see that this was ever going to work in the long run.
3) The auto bed leveling. It would have been fine as an experiment but, once again this is never going to work reliably. (Unfortunately it confuses the beginner because that is what some of them, including me, tries first. It might be a good idea to change the instructions to first test it without auto bed leveling.)
The software needs some attention but that I think is acceptable since it is easy to upgrade.
I cannot say anything good about the way RS advertises the printer, e.g. they stretch the truth by saying that it can print ABS and claiming 2 hours assembly.
Currently I am stuck. The printer prints for some random time and then the filament gets stuck in the hot end. I did not see anybody complaining about it so I will assume this is the exception. I will ask the question somewhere else and the forum to see if somebody can help me to solve it.
I think that this is the future, the printer includes some other very good designs and a much better processor, so lets hope they sort it our before the printer gets a bad name.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2014 01:55AM by OttoES.
Unfortunately I do have some issues with the printer that I think should have been picked up before shipping since these are common problems:
1) X-axis: in general a bad design. Problems from most crippling
a) The x-axis fan shield was lower than the print head out of the box in my case. None of the fixes suggested are really easy without another printer or tools. The easy fix with minimal cost is to increase the bearing adjustment slot length or change the adjustment method. (I used a piece op paper to change the head angle)
b) Sagging of the hot-end. Several suggested fixes on the forum.
c) if the filament feeder tilts on the x-axis, the x-axis bearing at the back can not go past it. This is because the stepper motor weighs it to the one side and the bracket should have been designed to balance it better.
2) Y belt tension: I cannot see that this was ever going to work in the long run.
3) The auto bed leveling. It would have been fine as an experiment but, once again this is never going to work reliably. (Unfortunately it confuses the beginner because that is what some of them, including me, tries first. It might be a good idea to change the instructions to first test it without auto bed leveling.)
The software needs some attention but that I think is acceptable since it is easy to upgrade.
I cannot say anything good about the way RS advertises the printer, e.g. they stretch the truth by saying that it can print ABS and claiming 2 hours assembly.
Currently I am stuck. The printer prints for some random time and then the filament gets stuck in the hot end. I did not see anybody complaining about it so I will assume this is the exception. I will ask the question somewhere else and the forum to see if somebody can help me to solve it.
I think that this is the future, the printer includes some other very good designs and a much better processor, so lets hope they sort it our before the printer gets a bad name.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2014 01:55AM by OttoES.
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 08, 2014 04:52PM |
Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 14,672 |
Hi Otto,
I'm glad you are persevering! I'm getting excellent PLA prints from my Ormerod now, but it has taken time.
Based on my own experience, here are a few comments on some of the issues you mention:
a) Fan duct lower than nozzle. This happened to me to but I realised it was mostly due to hot end sag. The bottom of the fan duct also had an unhelpful cusp at the bottom, which was not part of the design but caused by the bottom layer spreading too much when it had been printed. It was a simple matter to sand it off.
b) Sagging of the hot end. The bearing at the back is adjustable, the screw that holds it in place is mounted in a slot. However the adjustment was not enough. I had to replace the supplied 9mm bearing by a 10mm one and lengthen the slot and replace the nozzle mount in order to eliminate head sag. Ian says that they changed the x-carriage to provide more adjustment by way of a longer slot some time ago, but RRP has still not published the new design on github (Ian, are you listening?).
c) The slots in the x-carriage for the extruder have a lip in one side, so that if you insert them the right way then the weight of the stepper motor locks the extruder in place. The imbalance you refer to is deliberate and an important part of this. However, the extruder cannot be swung into the slot nearest the z-axis because the z-idler is in the way. Clearly a design fault IMO. That's why most of us put the extruder in the middle slot.
I agree that lack of adjustment of the y-belt tension in the original design is a problem. The RRP troubleshooting page gives a solution to prevent the y-belt slipping in the plywood slot, but this doesn't address the issue of getting the correct tension.
Regarding the IR sensor, I couldn't even get it to home the Z and Y axes reliably, until I realised that the 50W halogen bulb in the ceiling above the Ormerod was causing massive interference with it. I've since found that auto bed compensation is usable with a modulated IR sensor, or an ultrasonic sensor at constant temperature. Nevertheless, I think is it best to have a bed that is almost level to starts with, by using bed levelling adjustment screws and/or a better bed support than the MDF supplied. Then use auto bed compensation (if it is working reliably) just to make a fine correction.
As for filament getting stuck in the hot end: there have been a few reports of that in this forum. Possible causes include:
* PTFE or other non-melting debris blocking the nozzle. There are a number of techniques to clear this mentioned in this forum.
* Filament melting too high up the nozzle because it isn't being cooled effectively by the fan and heatsink. The upper aluminium block should not get hot, I think somewhere between 40C and 50C has been mentioned.
* Filament isn't actually stuck, but the hobbed insert in the extruder drive isn't gripping it well. When the filament appears to be stuck, can you see the extruder drive skipping?
* Loss of power to the heater. When the filament gets stuck, does the hot end temperature read correctly?
Hopefully you will resolve this soon and get the printer working reliably, as many of us have done.
Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod
Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
I'm glad you are persevering! I'm getting excellent PLA prints from my Ormerod now, but it has taken time.
Based on my own experience, here are a few comments on some of the issues you mention:
a) Fan duct lower than nozzle. This happened to me to but I realised it was mostly due to hot end sag. The bottom of the fan duct also had an unhelpful cusp at the bottom, which was not part of the design but caused by the bottom layer spreading too much when it had been printed. It was a simple matter to sand it off.
b) Sagging of the hot end. The bearing at the back is adjustable, the screw that holds it in place is mounted in a slot. However the adjustment was not enough. I had to replace the supplied 9mm bearing by a 10mm one and lengthen the slot and replace the nozzle mount in order to eliminate head sag. Ian says that they changed the x-carriage to provide more adjustment by way of a longer slot some time ago, but RRP has still not published the new design on github (Ian, are you listening?).
c) The slots in the x-carriage for the extruder have a lip in one side, so that if you insert them the right way then the weight of the stepper motor locks the extruder in place. The imbalance you refer to is deliberate and an important part of this. However, the extruder cannot be swung into the slot nearest the z-axis because the z-idler is in the way. Clearly a design fault IMO. That's why most of us put the extruder in the middle slot.
I agree that lack of adjustment of the y-belt tension in the original design is a problem. The RRP troubleshooting page gives a solution to prevent the y-belt slipping in the plywood slot, but this doesn't address the issue of getting the correct tension.
Regarding the IR sensor, I couldn't even get it to home the Z and Y axes reliably, until I realised that the 50W halogen bulb in the ceiling above the Ormerod was causing massive interference with it. I've since found that auto bed compensation is usable with a modulated IR sensor, or an ultrasonic sensor at constant temperature. Nevertheless, I think is it best to have a bed that is almost level to starts with, by using bed levelling adjustment screws and/or a better bed support than the MDF supplied. Then use auto bed compensation (if it is working reliably) just to make a fine correction.
As for filament getting stuck in the hot end: there have been a few reports of that in this forum. Possible causes include:
* PTFE or other non-melting debris blocking the nozzle. There are a number of techniques to clear this mentioned in this forum.
* Filament melting too high up the nozzle because it isn't being cooled effectively by the fan and heatsink. The upper aluminium block should not get hot, I think somewhere between 40C and 50C has been mentioned.
* Filament isn't actually stuck, but the hobbed insert in the extruder drive isn't gripping it well. When the filament appears to be stuck, can you see the extruder drive skipping?
* Loss of power to the heater. When the filament gets stuck, does the hot end temperature read correctly?
Hopefully you will resolve this soon and get the printer working reliably, as many of us have done.
Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod
Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
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Re: Ormerod reviews May 08, 2014 05:27PM |
Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 12 |
Thanks for the reply dc
Yes you are correct, the x-axis bearing is adjustable and I should have been clearer that I have adjusted it to its limit already.
My filament feeder is on the middle slot but it stills hangs to the side. I can see how it is supposed to hook but probably, due to tolerances, it does not hook and simply hangs limply to the side. It might be only a problem on mine. I will try to stick a piece of tape in there. In the long term I do not know if they will stand the wear? I am also planning on printing one a soon as I get the printer going again - the beauty of open source.
I have described by problem with the filament in a separate post. I can see on the internet that it is a problem that is common on all printers and that there can be several reasons why, I just can not figure it out but will hang on, even if I have to build one.
Yes you are correct, the x-axis bearing is adjustable and I should have been clearer that I have adjusted it to its limit already.
My filament feeder is on the middle slot but it stills hangs to the side. I can see how it is supposed to hook but probably, due to tolerances, it does not hook and simply hangs limply to the side. It might be only a problem on mine. I will try to stick a piece of tape in there. In the long term I do not know if they will stand the wear? I am also planning on printing one a soon as I get the printer going again - the beauty of open source.
I have described by problem with the filament in a separate post. I can see on the internet that it is a problem that is common on all printers and that there can be several reasons why, I just can not figure it out but will hang on, even if I have to build one.
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