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All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2

Posted by Europa 
All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 22, 2015 03:39PM
I have been considering buying one of the all metal hot ends for sale on eBay and elsewhere for my Ormerod 2.

does anyone know of how to fit one of these to the existing hot end printed part on the X bearing? I assume there is a printable part design available somewhere on thingiverse for the modified set up.


Many thanks,

Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 22, 2015 05:45PM
I did one, but I only tested it with the X-Carriage version 528.4.
[www.thingiverse.com]

Directly mount it onto the X-Carriage. No further adapter parts are needed.


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 23, 2015 07:34AM
Many thanks,

I will give it a try.


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 23, 2015 01:19PM
There are slightly differences between the cheap nozzles. For example I have two versions. The older one is equipped with a bigger nozzle block, but the design covers both of them. Your feedback would be very welcome if there is anything to improve. Unfortunately I have not been able to create the holder for the second fan. At the moment I am testing a new design for Z-homing.


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 23, 2015 01:25PM
Hi Treito,
Ok I will let you know how I get on, it won't be for a couple of weeks as I am away all of next week.


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 23, 2015 04:24PM
Hello Brian,

no problem. Soon I will publish an alternative version with Z-axis homing via microswitch. It is not a perfect design but it works and that is what counts at least. At the moment I have no clue how to improve the design further (I just edited it), but auto-bed-leveling works nearly perfect with this method.

Best regards,

Sven


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 24, 2015 07:13PM
I got a knockoff E3D V6 hotend and was planning to use this one from user "Cola" on Thingiverse: [www.thingiverse.com]
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 24, 2015 07:38PM
I doubt that this will fit as the original E3D has other dimensions.


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 02:14PM
I am trying to decide which E3D V6 all metal hot end to buy, there are a vast number advertised on eBay and elsewhere.

Will I need to change my Ormerod 2 profile or will the same settings for the original hot end work with a new E3D V6 ?


Many thanks,


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 02:29PM
I also meant to ask if the fan shroud shown with the complete kits will fit inside the thingiverse printed parts that are made for the Ormerod 2.


Thanks,


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 02:43PM
Hello Forum,
please excuse my bad English. (Google Translator...)
I recently modified my Ormerod on a self-made extruder and a E3D Lite6 Hotend and am so far very pleased with the result.

@Europe: You have to adapt after the reconstruction of both the config.g file and your slicer configuration.
But that's not a big problem.

greetings

Kistenschieber
Attachments:
open | download - IMG_20151125_202254.jpg (249.4 KB)
open | download - IMG_20151125_202325.jpg (212.9 KB)
open | download - IMG_20151125_202333.jpg (202.8 KB)
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 02:54PM
Hi Kistenschieber,

Did your E3D Light 6 come with the fan shroud and if so how did you fit it to the Ormerod X carriage mount?


Thanks,


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 03:02PM
Hello Brian,

on thingiverse you can find some mounting options for both the original E3d and also for the Chinese replica. Normally you mount them directly to the X-Carriage. I did not like the provided designs for the replicas as you lost too mouch building height with them. That is why I designed my own one.
For the original E3D there are two designs. One for version 528.4 of the Ormerod 2 and one for version 528.5.


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 03:11PM
Hello Europa,

I suppose "fan shroud" is the same as "fan duct"?

The "fan duct" was supplied with the Hotend.

The Hotend is down to a tiny change assembled by the instructions from E3D.

I designed the bracket on the x-carriage specially for the E3D groove mount.

Potentially, you can see the better in this picture.

greetings

Kistenschieber

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/2015 03:11PM by Kistenschieber.
Attachments:
open | download - E3D_Adapter.png (23 KB)
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 03:14PM
Hi Treito,

Thank you for your prompt response, I suppose what I am asking is do the designs on thingiverse replace the fan shroud that many of the E3Ds come with? it is a close fitting shroud, usually in transparent blue that fits tight to the heatsink. The reason I ask is that if the shroud is not used I might as well buy one of the cheaper kits that does not have the fan and shroud.


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 04:21PM
Hi Kistenschieber, do you have the STL file for the design you included?

Thanks,


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 04:28PM
Hi Brian,

that depends on the design. Mostly designs do not use it. One small tip: Shroud is not common at foreign countrys. I only got what you are talking about as you mention the color blue!
BTW I am very happy with my 5€ nozzle. It gives slightly better results than the original nozzle that was supplied with the Ormerod 1.


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 25, 2015 05:35PM
Thanks Treito,

I will go with just one of the basic nozzles.


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 26, 2015 05:22AM
Hi Europa,

I would be glad if the file would be useful for you.

I upload the file today evening.

greetings

Kistenschieber
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 26, 2015 07:07AM
Quote
Kistenschieber
Hello Forum,
please excuse my bad English. (Google Translator...)
I recently modified my Ormerod on a self-made extruder and a E3D Lite6 Hotend and am so far very pleased with the result.

@Europe: You have to adapt after the reconstruction of both the config.g file and your slicer configuration.
But that's not a big problem.

greetings

Kistenschieber

I like your extruder & spool holder modification. It should eliminate problems associated with the changing Bowden tube force as the X position changes. I think I will make something similar for my Ormerod.

Thanks
Dave
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 26, 2015 09:12AM
Hi Dave,

that was precisely the intention of the design...

and it works...drinking smiley

greetings

Kistenschieber
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 26, 2015 02:08PM
Hi Europa,

as promised, here are the .stl files.

sorry i just noticed that the files are too large to upload to the forum...

--> [www.thingiverse.com]

The spacer I have not needed, but these can be useful if the distance between the holder and x-rip is too small.

Importantly, the clamping works in only one orientation!

greetings

Kistenschieber
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
November 26, 2015 02:12PM
Hi Kistenschieber,

Many thanks for the files, I will give it a go.


Regards,


Brian
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 03, 2015 01:56PM
Quote
Kistenschieber
Hi Dave,

that was precisely the intention of the design...

and it works...drinking smiley

greetings

Kistenschieber

Hi Kistenschieber, I am in the process of trying your E3D mount, things look great so far, but haven't seen it in action yet, I should know more soon.

I wanted to also do something similar to your extruder and spool mod and really like your approach. Any chance you can share some of your designs (here or on thingiverse)? It'd help a lot to use something as a starting point.

Thanks much!
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 05, 2015 07:59AM
Hallo 1pennyshort,

sorry for my late reply.
(So little time and so many projects...)

I did not expect that anyone would actually use these early draft, so all is not well documented.

Some of my designs can be found here:

[www.thingiverse.com] (spool mount)

[www.thingiverse.com] ( horizontal spool adaptor)

[www.thingiverse.com] (universal spool adaptor 16 to 60mm)

[www.thingiverse.com] (spool adaptor, customizable)

[www.thingiverse.com] (RSE-1 Bowden Extruder (cold-end)) ---> !not quite optimal, i have the version RSE-2 in action. (Does not yet exist on Thingiverse ...)!

Unfortunately, the descriptions are all in German, my English is terrible, but if you have a question, I give my best.

I would be happy if the designs are useful for you.

Greetings

Kistenschieber
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 05, 2015 10:20AM
Quote
Kistenschieber
[www.thingiverse.com] (spool mount)

Hello,
you can add the part as "remix" for example. Does this thing not affect the stability of the Ormerod? Besides it needs to much metal parts and also the handling is to complicated. I prefer the quicker ones but besides that a good design.

What is the advantage of this direct driven extruder?

Best regards from Germany,

Sven


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 05, 2015 10:36AM
Quote
Kistenschieber

[www.thingiverse.com] (spool mount)

[www.thingiverse.com] ( horizontal spool adaptor)

[www.thingiverse.com] (universal spool adaptor 16 to 60mm)

[www.thingiverse.com] (spool adaptor, customizable)

[www.thingiverse.com] (RSE-1 Bowden Extruder (cold-end)) ---> !not quite optimal, i have the version RSE-2 in action. (Does not yet exist on Thingiverse ...)!

Unfortunately, the descriptions are all in German, my English is terrible, but if you have a question, I give my best.

I would be happy if the designs are useful for you.

Greetings

Kistenschieber

Awesome, thanks a lot! No trouble with the language, I'll ask in German on thingiverse if I have questions smiling smiley
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 05, 2015 10:43AM
Quote
Treito
Quote
Kistenschieber
[www.thingiverse.com] (spool mount)

Hello,
you can add the part as "remix" for example. Does this thing not affect the stability of the Ormerod? Besides it needs to much metal parts and also the handling is to complicated. I prefer the quicker ones but besides that a good design.

What is the advantage of this direct driven extruder?

Best regards from Germany,

Sven
I like the approach and want to do something similar for my printer as well. Mounting the spool on top saves space (I have a small desk). It will be interesting to see if it affects stability, as you said.
Moving the extruder off the X-axis carriage removes weight and allows for a longer, straighter bowden feeding tube, with less chance of twisting the printing head.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 05, 2015 10:56AM
Regarding the spool this is of course an advantage as the space on the table is not very big. But I am considering designing a base for this one:
[www.thingiverse.com]
And placing this on top. Laying down the spool has the big advantage that you will not have any problems regarding the spool size. The tripod helps with the different hole sizes so you need no adapter part or something similiar. Disadvantage: Especially on some new spools you have to wathc not to loose the windings. Another advantage: if the spool is layed down the way of feeding is nearly optimal for the standard Extruder.

Moving the Extruder from the x-axis is indeed an advantage, but if you extend the bowden you will have more trash at the end as a longer part of the filament could get transported. However that was not the point I meant. Using gears for the extrusion you have 420 steps per mm by default. A direct drive reduces these steps to something about 80? So you get an accuracy loss regarding the amount of filament. If there are good arguments that this is not a big deal I will indeed consider this design for my coming own printer design as I will use a 400 steps per full turn stepper motor for the extruder.


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: All Metal Hot End for Ormerod 2
December 05, 2015 11:36AM
Hi Sven,

ich erlaube mir mal in deutsch zu antworten, in englisch bekomme ich das folgende nicht hin.

Was die horizontale Lagerung der Spule angeht:

[www.thingiverse.com]

Funktioniert bei mir ganz gut, das ungewollte Abwickeln der Spulen konnte ich allerdings so auch nicht vermeiden.
(Passiert aber nicht oft und verursacht keine großen Probleme)

Was den Extruder angeht, mein Hauptanliegen war es

a) Die X-Achse zu entlasten. Das Ding ist einfach nicht stabil genug...

b) Das Spiel des Filaments im Bowden zu veringern. Mit dem original Extruder war das ein Horror, die Befestigung des Bowdens am Extruder Ausgang war grausig.
Der Neue Extruder benötigt zwar mehr Bowden, unter dem Strich ist das Spiel im Gesamtsystem aber deutlich geringer.

c) Die Biegekräfte am Bowden im Originalsystem lassen das Hotend gerade in Position x max leicht "nicken". Das kommt der Präzision nicht unbedingt entgegen...
Durch den sehr viel größeren Biegeradius bei meinem System wird dieser Effekt eliminiert.

Was die Steps per mm angeht bin ich bei 165, aber das hängt natürlich auch vom hobbed pulley ab (Effektivumfang).
Die Genauigkeit ist, Siehe b) weiter oben, insgesamt gestiegen.

Den Extruder selbst hätte man natürlich auch mit Untersetzung über ein Getriebe konstruieren können, hab ich aus zwei Gründen nicht gemacht:

1. KIS Keep It Simple

2. Ich habe noch nie ein Zahnrad konstruiert.... schäm...

Gruß

Steffen

@all: sorry for writing this in german....
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