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I've been a bit lucky I think!

Posted by cheeseandham 
I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 11, 2016 11:45AM
So back in March, after the demise of RepRapPro, I was looking for parts from across the Internet to make for a dual extruder for my my Ormerod 2 528.4. I made a spreadsheet detailing where the parts could be sourced, and the price came out at £70 - without delivery from multiple places.

Then, I came across an eBay listing for a "RepRap Ormerod 2 3D Printer; Used. Ready built but needs some re-wiring.". The description said it had a dual extruder, and a spare extruder and everything else bar Duet.
Whilst not a fan of eBay, I thought it might be worth a go, and considered that if I got it for a reasonable price, I could always sell 2 of the extruders with someone here on this forum. smiling smiley
There was one other problem though, it was "pickup only" and across the country (UK). However it was reasonably close to where my business partner lived, so after him agreeing to pick up if I won, I went and bid and won it for £110.

After pickup , he didn't want to post it due to the size, so it's been sitting in his garage since then.... and I just got it yesterday when he came to visit!

OK, so after inspection, what did I get? well...

The bad...
The good.
Complete album . So now I have to make a decision....

Do use this for parts as intended, or do I buy a Duet and build a second Ormerod 2, enabling me to tinker with one, whilst keeping the other "stable", and then swap the printer roles when I'm comfortable, enabling me to upgrade and tinker with my Ormerod 2, without downtime? grinning smiley (The trouble with the latter is that I have a 2nd Prusa i3 for this purpose, but I can't apply any upgrades from one to another, which is a shame, and will mean that I end up with 3 printers when I only "need" one smiling smiley )
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 11, 2016 02:14PM
You could also take the opportunity to get a Duet WiFi instead of a Duet, and make your new printer super-quiet!

I guess your choice comes down to how your Ormerod compares with your Prusa. If the Ormerod does better prints, then you could consider selling the Prusa. OTOH if the Prusa can do prints that the Ormerod can't, keep the Prusa and plan to keep just one of the Ormerods.


Delta printer calibration calculator, mini IR Z probe, and colour touch screen control panel: [escher3d.com]

Large delta printer, and other 3D printer blog postings: [miscsolutions.wordpress.com]

Disclosure: I have a financial interest in sales of the Panel Due, Mini IR height sensor, and Duet WiFi/Duet Ethernet.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 11, 2016 03:58PM
Yes, I'd get a Duet Wifi smiling smiley I didn't realise it would be quieter. Isn't most of the noise generated by the steppers?

The Prusa i3 is a Sunhokey 2015. It's taken work to get it calibrated to the point where I'm getting half decent prints out of it, and there is more to go.

After a couple of commissioning issues, my Ormerod 2 has been a good, stable workhorse in the time I've had it. To the point that I've joked that "it's boring" in that it delivered consistent, good quality prints.
Only recently has it developed a slight issue (corners on one side are a bit ragged at times) , and that could do with some TLC & diagnosing, but it's minor enough I can ignore it on the most part.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 11, 2016 04:51PM
Quote
cheeseandham
Yes, I'd get a Duet Wifi smiling smiley I didn't realise it would be quieter. Isn't most of the noise generated by the steppers?

Yes it is. The 256x microstepping of the drivers on the Duet WiFi is what makes the steppers much quieter. After that, you will be looking for a quieter fan.


Delta printer calibration calculator, mini IR Z probe, and colour touch screen control panel: [escher3d.com]

Large delta printer, and other 3D printer blog postings: [miscsolutions.wordpress.com]

Disclosure: I have a financial interest in sales of the Panel Due, Mini IR height sensor, and Duet WiFi/Duet Ethernet.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 12, 2017 09:46AM
Machine almost rebuilt. It's taken me a year I see! Time does fly!

I have a shiny Duet Wifi delivered today smiling smiley


and a nicely built dual extruder (just got the Y-Axis Aluminium Print Bed Support 2 days ago too, I don't think I need it, but I figured I'd be nice to myself for Christmas! Not sure if I'll fit it on this just yet...)


In the end it had everything I needed bar some minor screws & bearings. But basically it was :-

  • £110 for the dual extruder Ormerod 2 and an aluminium X-axis arm (but with no Duet)
  • £150 for the Duet.
  • £18 in other minor parts.

So £278 for a fully working dual extruder Ormerod 2 with a new Duet Wifi, then add another £45 for the "probably unnecessary, but I want it" Y-Axis Aluminium Print Bed Support smiling smiley

Not bad IMHO. I'll update after full commissioning and testing.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/13/2017 09:51AM by cheeseandham.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 12, 2017 05:05PM
Sadly the rest of us can't see your images - have you hosted them in a private area?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/12/2017 05:05PM by dc42.


Delta printer calibration calculator, mini IR Z probe, and colour touch screen control panel: [escher3d.com]

Large delta printer, and other 3D printer blog postings: [miscsolutions.wordpress.com]

Disclosure: I have a financial interest in sales of the Panel Due, Mini IR height sensor, and Duet WiFi/Duet Ethernet.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 09:53AM
Thanks dc42. Yes, that was a private area "whoops". Fixed now.

Printed a Duet enclosure last night, just need to wire up and commission, but I'm betting X-mas is going to try and get in the way (along with businesses, wife and kids!)
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 10:58AM
Quote
cheeseandham
  • £110 for the dual extruder Ormerod 2 and an aluminium X-axis arm (but with no Duet)
  • £150 for the Duet.
  • £18 in other minor parts.

So £278 for a fully working dual extruder Ormerod 2 with a new Duet Wifi, then add another £45 for the "probably unnecessary, but I want it" Y-Axis Aluminium Print Bed Support smiling smiley

Not bad IMHO. I'll update after full commissioning and testing.

Not bad at all..

I just looked up how much did I pay for mine 3 and a half years ago ..

688€ (604£) without upgrades .. smiling smiley
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 11:09AM
Very nice!



Is the upper nut in your anti-backlash setup mechanically secured to the z-nut trap?

Erik
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 12:05PM
Quote
cheeseandham
Thanks dc42. Yes, that was a private area "whoops". Fixed now.

Printed a Duet enclosure last night, just need to wire up and commission, but I'm betting X-mas is going to try and get in the way (along with businesses, wife and kids!)

Looks good! Even I don't have a Duet WiFi in my Ormerod yet, it's using a Duet 0.8.5.

[shameless plug] Now you just need a PanelDue to finish it off! [/shameless plug]




Delta printer calibration calculator, mini IR Z probe, and colour touch screen control panel: [escher3d.com]

Large delta printer, and other 3D printer blog postings: [miscsolutions.wordpress.com]

Disclosure: I have a financial interest in sales of the Panel Due, Mini IR height sensor, and Duet WiFi/Duet Ethernet.

Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 02:57PM
Good catch David!, yes I could see there was something missing but not quite figga it out what it was ;-)




Erik
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 05:36PM
I like the pen holder on the side!


Delta printer calibration calculator, mini IR Z probe, and colour touch screen control panel: [escher3d.com]

Large delta printer, and other 3D printer blog postings: [miscsolutions.wordpress.com]

Disclosure: I have a financial interest in sales of the Panel Due, Mini IR height sensor, and Duet WiFi/Duet Ethernet.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 06:49PM
Quote
ormerod168
Is the upper nut in your anti-backlash setup mechanically secured to the z-nut trap?

Eric, all I know is that it is the Backlash Z Nut by sooyewguan - [www.thingiverse.com] and the the nuts are fitted in the part as shown, I'm not sure what you mean by "mechanically secured" in this context though, other than "it's fitted in there and can't move", but that is no doubt due to my ignorance. smiling smiley

My original Ormerod 2 (528.4 / Duet 0.6.5) has been working pretty darn well out of the box as provided by Reprappro, and so I've not really modified it with the philosophy of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", and just fixed any minor issues as I've gone along. I can see there can be improvements though and there are some 3D printed parts starting to split, so this is a good time to get a second running, so I can dismantle the old workhorse. (replacements have already been printed though, just in case)

So I've gradually been building this second as a "better" Ormerod 2 with improved parts where it seems appropriate, without going too far (I gave away my cheap chinese Prusa to someone that would appreciate it as I don't have the room for 3 printers smiling smiley and they are retrofitting that gradually too)

I know there is a list of improvements at [reprap.org] , however the list appears quite old and some things have been incorporated into 528.5 . Then there are the improvements that fix things I've not had problems with, or are such big changes that I don't want to attempt just yet (e.g. the Cthulhu cooling duct) or items that I simply just don't understand the part or benefit of yet.

Therefore I've based this on the Ormerod 2 528.5 and gone with the following printed part improvements:-
  • Backlash Z Nut by sooyewguan - [www.thingiverse.com]
  • Ormerod 2 Y-idler with Rod twist fix and belt tensioning by darathy, - [www.thingiverse.com]
  • Ormerod X-idler bracket with belt tensioner by jstck - [www.thingiverse.com]
  • RepRap Pro Ormerod iamburnys Extruder Gears - Parametric - Double Helix - Herringbone by iamburny - [www.thingiverse.com]
  • RepRap Pro Ormerod iamburnys Z Gears - Parametric - Double Helix - Herringbone by iamburny - [www.thingiverse.com]
  • Chris Hamm's y-Front clamp - [github.com] (I'm curious about the other items there too)

CNC machined part improvements
X-axis Arm Kit (came with it) as sold by [ddmetalproducts.co.uk]
Y-axis aluminium Print bed support kit - [www.3dprintandstuff.co.uk]

Electronics improvements
Duet Wifi - [www.duet3d.com] (yes dc42, I was already tempted by the PanelDue to go with it!)
Decent 500W PSU - [www.rosch-computer.de]

Possible other improvements
DC 42 fan deflector - [github.com]
I've seen [www.thingiverse.com] and have wondered if it is worth getting the side plates CNC machined also.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 13, 2017 07:05PM
ormerod168 / dc42 ,

Thank you for posting your pics, those machines are gorgeous.

It's going to be a while before mine is going to be anywhere a tidy as those smiling smiley
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 16, 2017 04:39PM
Quote
cheeseandham
Quote
ormerod168
Is the upper nut in your anti-backlash setup mechanically secured to the z-nut trap?


Possible other improvements

I've seen [www.thingiverse.com] and have wondered if it is worth getting the side plates CNC machined also.

If you do, make them a little longer as I had to cut the aluminium bed support to clear the front frame when I upgraded later.

If you want to max out the improvements, have you thought about a direct drive Z-Axis? I was never happy with the original threaded rod so moved to direct drive lead screw. I found it well worth the small outlay.
[www.thingiverse.com]

I also drilled the Y frame and bolted it to the upright and replaced the flimsy printed foot underneath with a triangular aluminium bracket to reduce any Z-Axis wobble due to frame movement.
However... I upgraded to an E3Dv6 hot end and it sat a little further out from the X-Axis frame so I had to move the Z upright about 10mm nearer the motor end and had to drill the frame again. (Must learn to plan ahead!)
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 19, 2017 04:35PM
Quote
trevmas
If you want to max out the improvements, have you thought about a direct drive Z-Axis? I was never happy with the original threaded rod so moved to direct drive lead screw. I found it well worth the small outlay.

I've certainly thought about it, but I haven't really suffered from Z-axis wobble, so these thoughts went in the "ain't broke, don't fix it" pile smiling smiley


Quote
trevmas
I also drilled the Y frame and bolted it to the upright and replaced the flimsy printed foot underneath with a triangular aluminium bracket to reduce any Z-Axis wobble due to frame movement.

This is interesting, as I notice now that my original RepRapPro supplied printed lower mount is certainly showing wear (to the point I've been considering this chunky monkey!).
Did you post here about it trevmas? It'd be interesting to see some pics..
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 21, 2017 07:34AM
The Duet forum is not accepting any more registrations, but I'm having exactly this issue on the X-axis
[www.duet3d.com]

Changed the loom and changed the NEMA17 motor (tested against my working Ormerod X-axis and the Y-axis on this one), and it's not those causing the problem, so it looks like the DuetWifi is driving the issue.
It's also weirdly intermittent, as occasionally it drives correctly.
Running Firmaware 1.19.2

config.g is

; Configuration file for Duet WiFi (firmware version 1.17 to 1.19)
; executed by the firmware on start-up
;
; generated by RepRapFirmware Configuration Tool on Wed Dec 20 2017 22:03:57 GMT+0000 (GMT Standard Time)

; General preferences
M111 S0                            ; Debugging off
G21                                ; Work in millimetres
G90                                ; Send absolute coordinates...
M83                                ; ...but relative extruder moves
M555 P2                            ; Set firmware compatibility to look like Marlin
M208 X0 Y0 Z0 S1                   ; Set axis minima
M208 X240 Y240 Z200 S0             ; Set axis maxima

; Endstops
M574 X0 Z0 S0                      ; Set active low endstops
M574 Y1 S1                         ; Set active high endstops
M558 P1 X1 Y0 Z1 H5 F120 T6000     ; Set Z probe type to unmodulated, the axes for which it is used and the dive height + speeds
G31 P600 X0 Y0 Z2.8                ; Set Z probe trigger value, offset and trigger height
M557 X15:215 Y15:195 S20           ; Define mesh grid

; Drives
M569 P0 S0                         ; Drive 0 goes backwards
M569 P1 S1                         ; Drive 1 goes forwards
M569 P2 S1                         ; Drive 2 goes forwards
M569 P3 S1                         ; Drive 3 goes forwards
M569 P4 S1                         ; Drive 4 goes forwards
M350 X16 Y16 Z16 E16:16 I0         ; Configure microstepping without interpolation
M92 X87.489 Y87.489 Z4000 E420:420 ; Set steps per mm
M566 X300 Y900 Z12 E120:120        ; Set maximum instantaneous speed changes (mm/min)
M203 X6000 Y6000 Z180 E1200:1200   ; Set maximum speeds (mm/min)
M201 X500 Y20 Z250 E250:250        ; Set accelerations (mm/s^2)
M906 X800 Y1000 Z800 E800:800 I30  ; Set motor currents (mA) and motor idle factor in per cent
M84 S30                            ; Set idle timeout

; Heaters
M305 P0 T10000 B3988 C0 R4700      ; Set thermistor + ADC parameters for heater 0
M143 H0 S120                       ; Set temperature limit for heater 0 to 120C
M305 P1 T100000 B4138 C0 R4700     ; Set thermistor + ADC parameters for heater 1
M143 H1 S260                       ; Set temperature limit for heater 1 to 260C
M305 P2 T100000 B4138 C0 R4700     ; Set thermistor + ADC parameters for heater 2
M143 H2 S260                       ; Set temperature limit for heater 2 to 260C

; Tools
M563 P0 D0 H1                      ; Define tool 0
G10 P0 X0 Y0 Z0                    ; Set tool 0 axis offsets
G10 P0 R0 S0                       ; Set initial tool 0 active and standby temperatures to 0C
M563 P1 D1 H2                      ; Define tool 1
G10 P1 X10 Y0 Z0                   ; Set tool 1 axis offsets
G10 P1 R0 S0                       ; Set initial tool 1 active and standby temperatures to 0C

; Network
M550 PMy RepRapPro Ormerod 2       ; Set machine name
M552 S1                            ; Enable network
;*** Access point is configured manually via M587 by the user
M586 P0 S1                         ; Enable HTTP
M586 P1 S1                         ; Enable FTP
M586 P2 S0                         ; Disable Telnet

; Fans
M106 P0 S0 I0 F500 H-1             ; Set fan 0 value, PWM signal inversion and frequency. Thermostatic control is turned off
M106 P1 S1 I0 F500 H1:2 T45        ; Set fan 1 value, PWM signal inversion and frequency. Thermostatic control is turned on
M106 P2 S1 I0 F500 H1:2 T45        ; Set fan 2 value, PWM signal inversion and frequency. Thermostatic control is turned on

; Custom settings are not configured

Setting M203 X to 2000 (M203 X2000 Y6000 Z180 E1200:1200 ) makes it a little better, but it's still crunching as it moves...
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 21, 2017 02:30PM
Updated the Duet to Firmware Version: 1.20RC4 (2017-12-20) with no change to the behaviour.
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
December 27, 2017 10:30AM
[/quote]

This is interesting, as I notice now that my original RepRapPro supplied printed lower mount is certainly showing wear (to the point I've been considering this chunky monkey!).
Did you post here about it trevmas? It'd be interesting to see some pics..[/quote]

Not posted here as there are several people who have done the same.


One other thing is that I was having a lot of bed movement when it was heated. I noticed that the heated bed was flexing and the front adjustment point was moving creating a small gap between the bed and heat spreader. I added a piece of aluminium angle secured at the the screws on the front corners and the centre adjustment point. It seems much more stable. Of course I wrapped it in a few layers of Kapton to avoid the possibility of shorts.



Have fun!
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
January 15, 2018 08:03AM
  • So the DuetWifi was faulty. Replaced (Thanks Duet3D!) and it immediately fixed the problem.
  • Installed the aluminium bed.
  • Wiring has been made good and is in braided sheaths.
  • I've just ordered a differential modulated IR height sensor from Duet3D.
  • Received some Printbite over the weekend, tested on the original Ormerod 2 and initial results look promising.
I was going to buy a PanelDue with screen, but Duet3D (nor elsewhere that I can see) have no stock of larger screens, and I really didn't want a 4.3" 480×272 screen. I'll wait for the 7" screens to become available again.

Not happy with the bed level at the moment, the front left corner seems to be way down. Not sure where it's coming from just yet, if it's the MDF insulator causing it or Y-axis twist. So that's going to keep be busy.
Typically, even with the MDF bed on the original, I've not really had any problems with level or any sort of Y-axis skew before, so this is new territory for me.
Fortunately I'd read about Y-axis twist and decided as a preventative measure to proactively install this Y-idler bracket in case it was required. I'd rather fix the "true cause" if possible, but I may have to have a play with this soon.

Is it me or is the 3 point mounting design of the Ormerod 2 not ideal for keeping a level bed?

Anyway, it's coming together, slowly but surely smiling smiley
Re: I've been a bit lucky I think!
January 15, 2018 10:10AM
Quote
cheeseandham
...I really didn't want a 4.3" 480×272 screen. I'll wait for the 7" screens to become available again.

4.3" is fine, anything bigger is overkill IMHO

Quote

Not happy with the bed level at the moment, the front left corner seems to be way down. Not sure where it's coming from just yet, if it's the MDF insulator causing it or Y-axis twist. So that's going to keep be busy.
Typically, even with the MDF bed on the original, I've not really had any problems with level or any sort of Y-axis skew before, so this is new territory for me.
Fortunately I'd read about Y-axis twist and decided as a preventative measure to proactively install this Y-idler bracket in case it was required. I'd rather fix the "true cause" if possible, but I may have to have a play with this soon.

Easy to fix the Y-axis twist, keep the nozzle vertically over the inner smooth rod and zero the nozzle on a paper, run the bed back and forth and adjust the two inner adjusting screws until the nozzle grips the paper equally

Then move the nozzle out to a position vertically over the outer smooth rod and adjust the screw on the Y-idler bracket to fix the twist

Quote

Is it me or is the 3 point mounting design of the Ormerod 2 not ideal for keeping a level bed?

Yes I'm afraid so :-) - anything more than 3 points is a pain to adjust and will fight the levelness of the bed
What I use as bed at the moment is 5mm aluminium plate with Kapton tape, seems to be perfect for PLA and ABS

Erik
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