Thinking of buying a P3Steel kit from Orballo

Hi people.

Anyone got the assambly instruction to the p3stell kit? I wrote them some days ago via e-mail and chat, but didn't get a reply yet.

I found some on the www. But they are not exactly for the orballo version...

Thanks,
David

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2016 07:50AM by Lirux.

Just finished assembling my P3 steel frame from Orballo.

I LOVE IT - major upgrade from my i3 aluminum frame.

I will post pictures when the printer is online and ready to go.

hello i made an order in orballo 2 weeks ago

they send me a fake tracking code (not mine) is somebody had this issue?

I had the issue that the tracking number they sent wasn't for the courier that had been mentioned, but for another one (I thought it was Fedex but it was DHL if I remember). Eventually I googled the tracking number and google recognised which courier it was for.

Paull

Quote
Lirux
Hi people.

Anyone got the assambly instruction to the p3stell kit? I wrote them some days ago via e-mail and chat, but didn't get a reply yet.

I found some on the www. But they are not exactly for the orballo version...

Thanks,
David

I ended up using a collection of different assembly instructions with my P3Steel. Links to the ones I used here

http://paulhurley.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=85:p3steel-instructions&catid=29&Itemid=124

Paul.

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www.paulhurley.co.uk

Sorry, website issues, new link for instructions...

[paulhurley.co.uk]

Paul.

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[www.paulhurley.co.uk]

Apologies for resurrecting this thread... scary reading all these negative comments, I ordered from them some days ago, before stumbling on this thread... a black painted P3steel frame with XL upgrade to 300x200mm. Is the black painting really all that bad quality? If so I may change to for the inox version, I don't want bare galvanized steel as we have high humidity where I live and things tend to rust (and fast). I exchanged some messages with orballo through eBay, mixed results. Some were answered in less than 30 minutes, some have gone unanswered.

I looked at hta3d.com as well (found them on eBay) and they are quite communicative and am considering ordering a dual hotend from them and mount the P3steel with dual Bowden extruders. The frame I didn't want to buy from them for the reason mentioned above, same for kitprinter3d.com.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

Hi, glad to hear that you're joining the P3Steel club.

Just noticed that the thread was revived so sorry if I'm a little late. Regarding the black paint. I've had mine for about 10 months now and besides some (VERY) mild corrosion on the main gantry frame (I think), it's overall okay. I can't give you much info about the other coating that you've mentioned (inox) unfortunately.

With regards to the hotend, the only recommendation I can give you is to get a legit E3D v6, there is nothing better on the market right now (in my opinion at least). I don't know if this is your first printer or not, but assuming it is, I would highly recommend you get comfortable with a single extruder machine, every time you add on anything, you just end up increasing the complexity and potentially the amount of headaches that you will experience. Also if you go with that route, you'll always be able to design an x-axis carriage to add on a second hotend to your machine.

Hope that this helps, post if you've got any other questions.

Thanks, that's helpful. Sorry for the confusion, inox is actually what we call stainless steel here. I'm still waiting for any kind of answer from orballoprinting and frankly I'm not too comfortable with their delay in replying, doesn't seem promising. Also, their website states 24h shipping is free over 150 EUR and I was charged 6,50 EUR for 48/72hr shipping. Another thing I really didn't appreciate is that they offer you the option to pay with Paypal but then afterwards charge you 6,80 EUR extra charges, not announced up front.

Frankly, If I had another option for stainless steel version I would be knocking on that door now I think. I'll continue to try to get hold of someone there.

edit: I've received a friendly reply which is nice, indicating the package was already at the post office but that they would see what they could do to halt the shipment. If correct that's fast shipping in my book. But let's see how it works out in the end.

Indeed, I was looking at a single E3D v6 genuine article from e3d-online.com, I considered the hta3d one but the knockoffs from orballoprinting or hta3d are not that much cheaper really - and then there's the support issue. I would go for a Bowden setup this time, I've a direct drive extruder now and would like to compare.

I'm still doubting between ordering the parts and printing them myself, especially after having seen the quality of the orballoprinting prints in this thread *eek*. I have only printed in PLA though and not in ABS so I'm a bit hesitant.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2016 05:32PM by siddharta.

Yeah, Orballo are not particularly great with their shit. I mentioned somewhere earlier in the thread that they shipped my order 4 weeks after payment, and yeah while thye advertise 1-2 day shipping, mine was the economy 1 week variant. But they will ship, just keep pestering them. It's quite shitty that you have to do something like that when you pay them that much, but yeah, there's no other place that I know of that will ship a P3Steel frame at an affordable shipping cost.

Regarding the printed parts, I would actually tell you that for SURE you should make your own. The orballo parts that I got were absolute trash, and there is about a high chance something will get screwed up (I got 2 drive gears and was missing my x-carriage). Also, you should consider printing them out of PETG. I'm rebuilding my machines printed parts and I went with PETG. It's much easier to print with over ABS and they seem to be flexing a little less as far as I can tell so far.

Also if you're interested, as I mentioned previously, I've made a redesign of my printed parts and I could share them with you (got some renders of them here). They use 8mm leadscrews though. Otherwise Toolsons parts on thingiverse are pretty dope afaik. Also since you're interested in making a bowden machine, I've made an x-carrige that you might want to check out, and I'm currently testing an extruder design. If you want, I can also send you some of the most up to date files for it.

Just an FYI, even if seller DOES respond quickly, it doesn't mean everything else will go well.
As with my case, kitprinter3d.com did reply quickly at first, up until the point they started owing me money. Then they suddenly stopped being responsive.

Thanks! I don't mind a bit of a wait (I'm used to ordering stuff from China that can take aaaages to arrive) as long as the end product is good enough quality. I wanted a black finish for rust protection but if the finishing quality is low I prefer the stainless option, though it's more expensive. The XL extension is not available in stainless though. Customer service is also important, really that's what makes for a returning customer, rather than just rock bottom prices.

I'd have to read up on PETG and see where I can source quality filament but that does sound interesting. After seeing those prints I'm pretty certain I won't do worse.

I'm still looking into the e3d hotends (oh that Cyclops looks enticing... but I'm scared of ending up in endless tinker hell ) and various Bowden type extruders - bulldog, airtripper, the jonaskuehling version of Wade's, so many to choose from... I would prefer to source good parts straight away for this printer. Which is maybe what I should have done in the first place rather than starting off with a cheap Chinese kit, though on the other hand, I did learn and am learning lots by having to look literally everything up to get it to print.

Thanks also for sharing your designs, your carriage looks great! And oh how does that Diiicooler work in practice? I'll be using 8 mm trapezoidal rods and leadscrews anyway. After having built a CNC with normal threaded rod first and then with trapezoidal rods and leadscrews I'm not looking at any other option. I had seen Toolson's parts and that's a very nice P3steel he built himself, I'd already bookmarked some parts for printing!

edit: also, what's the magnetic encoder module for in the last picture? Definitely want to mount an inductive sensor as well.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2016 05:55PM by siddharta.

Quote
biocomp
Just an FYI, even if seller DOES respond quickly, it doesn't mean everything else will go well.
As with my case, kitprinter3d.com did reply quickly at first, up until the point they started owing me money. Then they suddenly stopped being responsive.

Oh yes. Pre- and post sales are two different beasts for many a company, unfortunately. That's why I think forums such as these are so important for customer and company alike.

The Diii cooler is probably the best part cooling mod that you can get. My only pet peeve with it is that you basically have no vision of the nozzle when you're printing your first layer, but that doesn't really matter that much if you've got your machine fine tuned well. Since you're gonna be using leadscrews anyways, I will tweak my design (to exclude the encoder hardware mounting options, etc.) and send you a link to the STLs, if you want use it, if not don't . The encoders are a testing project from a user (/u/Chris-Aus3D) on reddit who is currently developing them and was looking for testers for feedback and mounting options a few weeks back. Basically going to be mounting them onto the X and Y axes to make a closed loop system for increased accuracy (this was partly my reasoning to redesign my whole machines printed parts and also to practice Fusion 360).

Also, regarding the PETG, if you're in Europe, consider 3DPrima.com. I've got their clear PETG and I can vouch for it. It prints like a dream (I do around 235 on the hotend and 60-65 on the bed). And since you're considering an inductive sensor, you definitely want to invest into a milled and cast aluminium plate. I've learned the hard way that the aluminium MK3 Print beds aren't ideal.

If you're looking for extruder upgrades, take a look at this one: [www.thingiverse.com]. I have no experience yet, but I ordered a couple of kits.

Hi and welcome! Thought I'd share some of my thoughts and updates along this journey

My goals have been to improve print quality, rather than speeding up the prints.

I've replaced all of the printed parts on my printer. Many of them are toolsons parts, or derivatives of them. I've designed some of them myself. An updated list of my parts are here:
[www.thingiverse.com]

There's an important reason to choose ABS for your printed parts - heat deflection. I learned this the hard way. My printer literally had a meltdown while printing ABS, inside an enclosure. All of the original PLA printed parts were destroyed, carriage, extruder, etc. I thought about using PETG but after looking at it's temperature characteristics I decided that ABS was safer.

I changed to leadscrews, mostly for the increased speed in Z, quality seems to be about the same, though they are more straight, which could make a small difference.

I don't have a bed leveling probe, even though I bought one, it seems to be unnecessary for me (bed is leveled once, then it stays leveled..). A probe adds slightly more complexity and weight to the carriage.

It took me a long time to decide which extruder to upgrade to. I finally decided to use the E3D titan. They sell a prusa i3 upgrade kit with the extruder and genuine V6 hotend bundled.
- The extruder is geared, so the force and accuracy is improved, and stepper motor can be quite small
- The gears and filament driver bolt are machined specifically for the purpose and work quite well compared to printed parts or custom hobbed bolts
- The big gear is accessible for manual feeding
- There is a spring loaded mechanism for the filament driver, so you can change filament easily
- The whole assembly is quite light-weight. With such a rigid frame as in the P3Steel, high speed should be achievable.

Regarding bowden setups, bowden extruders have some trouble with retraction. That means worse quality. Flexible filament can't be done afaik.

This is quite the interesting discussion. I wrote to E3D asking what they would recommend in terms of extruders for their Cyclops hotend. I'll probably end up experimenting with several setups. I think I enjoy building and upgrading the printers more than actually designing and printing things, how weird is that.

As for the Diiicooler and your designs modifications, yes I would appreciate that very much. The closed loop approach is interesting, I've used similar control techniques in some robotics projects many a year ago when still a student. Have you set it up already?

Also thanks for the prima3D recommendation, I need to order some new filament anyway and will buy some ABS, PETG and PLA. Do you know of a place that sells empty spools?

For the heat bed, I thought of a silicone heater + borosilicate glass but that won't work for inductive probing. I've a MK3 heat bed but indeed it may not be as flat as it would appear to be. Not sure where I would get my hands on milled aluminium here...

biocomp, thanks for pitching in, the Toranado looks impressive to say the least! Can you let us know how it works out for you? Ahhh too many options, too little time.

And (somewhat more on topic) let's see if Orballo comes through. Replied yesterday, I'll keep posting my experiences whether good or bad.

Hi ade2, thanks for sharing your experiences. I've been looking at Iako's and Toolson's modifications and parts for my P3steel as well. Print speed is of secondary importance for me as well, I prefer a good quality print.

The Titan extruder I find very interesting as well, it seems very well engineered and I can certainly appreciate the easy of maintenance and use. I'm not sure if two can be mounted on a carriage for dual direct drive extrusion, it would make for a very heavy carriage probably. Actually I don't think I'll be using dual extrusion all that often but while I'm building it I might as well go for maximum versatility and be done with it.

I haven't been considering dual extrusion. If I did, it would probably be only to print with a dissolvable support material.

I've seen dual titan extruder setups on thingiverse. It's probably not unreasonable at all, considering the modest weight of the extruder and smaller stepper.

With regards to the encoders, still finishing off printing my parts and sourcing some of the components. Hopefully my spool of PETG will not run out before I'm done. Will definitely update as I progress. I'm also probably going to be fixing up some of the models to take the threaded brass insets, although I think it might be better to let the user decide if they wanna use them or not and just drill out the holes if needed.

Not sure where you're located, but I've got my aluminium plates from aluminium warehouse in the UK and then had a friend forward them to me to Cyprus since they only deliver within the UK (although they will be able to hand it over to a courier if you set that up). Be sure to get plates, and preferably the EcoCast stuff since you're looking for the flattest surface that you can get and that basically is it since they mill it. You also avoid any internal material stresses since the plate is cast. Whatever you do, don't get aluminium sheets, since the rolling process will generate a lot of stress in the material and will result in warping when put through heating cycles. If you're set on using glass though, I've managed to put a couple of strips of aluminium tape onto the edges of the glass and probe against those, but the repeatability wasn't as great as I get with the aluminium plate.

No idea where you could get empty spools though...You could ask on /r/3Dprinting, as I've seen some folks with large amounts of empty spools there. I'm gonna be in a lecture tonight, so I should be able to get you a link to some of the updated files for the x-carriage at least, probably on Github, since I'm a bit lazy to republish them on thingiverse at the moment. You will need 6mm diameter x 3mm depth magnets for it though.

Quote
ade2
I haven't been considering dual extrusion. If I did, it would probably be only to print with a dissolvable support material.

I've seen dual titan extruder setups on thingiverse. It's probably not unreasonable at all, considering the modest weight of the extruder and smaller stepper.

Maybe not. I've been doing some reading and found one source using 13 Ncm NEMA17 steppers were sufficient, which are quite lightweight. Worth looking into.

Quote
Iako
With regards to the encoders, still finishing off printing my parts and sourcing some of the components. Hopefully my spool of PETG will not run out before I'm done. Will definitely update as I progress. I'm also probably going to be fixing up some of the models to take the threaded brass insets, although I think it might be better to let the user decide if they wanna use them or not and just drill out the holes if needed.

Not sure where you're located, but I've got my aluminium plates from aluminium warehouse in the UK and then had a friend forward them to me to Cyprus since they only deliver within the UK (although they will be able to hand it over to a courier if you set that up). Be sure to get plates, and preferably the EcoCast stuff since you're looking for the flattest surface that you can get and that basically is it since they mill it. You also avoid any internal material stresses since the plate is cast. Whatever you do, don't get aluminium sheets, since the rolling process will generate a lot of stress in the material and will result in warping when put through heating cycles. If you're set on using glass though, I've managed to put a couple of strips of aluminium tape onto the edges of the glass and probe against those, but the repeatability wasn't as great as I get with the aluminium plate.

No idea where you could get empty spools though...You could ask on /r/3Dprinting, as I've seen some folks with large amounts of empty spools there. I'm gonna be in a lecture tonight, so I should be able to get you a link to some of the updated files for the x-carriage at least, probably on Github, since I'm a bit lazy to republish them on thingiverse at the moment. You will need 6mm diameter x 3mm depth magnets for it though.

Thanks, it's a very interesting modification and I look forward to learning more. Regarding the milled plates, yes forwarding may be harder to set up, I'm not UK based but in Spain. How did you mount the heat bed to the aluminium plate? I'm not set on using glass at all, in fact I prefer aluminium. As for the spools, there has to be a source somewhere. May pop off a mail to 3Dprima when ordering the filament. Sourcing the magnets should be doable.

I was on the phone with Orballo and was told the order was already sent. Waiting for the tracking number now. They also said they did not have any issues with printed parts for several months now. I bought the 300x200mm XL extension for the frame but they didn't include the longer rods needed, I had inquired about that earlier but did not get a reply. All in all they appeared helpful enough so I'm hoping that all works out well.

According to the shipment tracking the frame, XL extension to 300x200mm and other parts sent by Orballo should be arriving today, so I'm pretty excited. If all goes well that would mean my order was processed and shipped in one working day (ordered on Fri, shipped on Mon) and arriving in 6 working days, which is not too bad. The longer smooth rods for the XL extension were included in the shipment. They've also let me know they will refund the VAT I was not supposed to have paid in the first place so that's a plus. So far the niggles I've taken up with them have been addressed more or less well.

As for part choices, I'm looking a lot at Toolson's Mk2 build, which uses standard M5 threaded rods rather than leadscrews and sintered bronze bearings instead of LM8UU or Igus DryLin plastic bushings (which is an interesting design choice and in the same price range as Igus bushings). I've ordered some sintered bronze bearings on eBay and will try those out on the Z axis. Nevertheless I've some leadscrews on order. For the hotend and extruder I've ordered from e3d-online.com two Titans, mostly for the same reasons ade2 listed, and a Chimera + Cyclops hotend set, rather than getting a knockoff from Orballo/hta3d/similar or eBay/AliExpress. I'm leaning towards mounting one extruder as Bowden and one direct for the moment. An interesting and highly customizable design for a hotend/extruder mount can be found at Hot End Mount Generator.

As I'm having difficulties sourcing a milled alu build plate I've ordered a 300x200mm MK2a heatbed, a borosilicate glass plate and a PEI sheet (off eBay). I also ordered a RAMPS 1.4 SB from staticboards' Tindie page as the larger pcb heated bed would likely set fire to the not-so-amazing heatbed MOSFET on the Chinese RAMPS boards (the board was processed, shipped and delivered in less than a week!). For stepper drivers I have ordered some TMC2100s that Toolson recommends, to compare with the A9488 and DRV8825 I have already.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/04/2016 07:19AM by siddharta.

So, is Orballo a reliable seller or not?

I have tax refund coming and I'm looking at a steel frame.
Orballo is cheap with unprotected steel frame. (From the images it looks like 2.0)

I can paint it myself or leave it sexy rust...

My shipment of frame, rods and assorted nuts and bolts ordered from Orballo didn't arrive as yet, still stuck at "being delivered" but it should be there soon. My first impressions were not that favorable based on the communication (or lack thereof) but they did ship quickly and lately have been replying to mails within 48h at the most. I'll let you know when I've received the shipment.

As I understand it, the frame is the 2.0 with some modifications from the later revisions included.

Hi!

I made a order some month ago. The experience was very good. I bought my second frame to my new printer from orballo printing again. In this case i bought a 300x200 frame because I need more print area for big pieces. The delivered time to Germany was 3 days, Impressive! The frame has holes to fix the bowden extruder like the 2.5 version.

Fyi, I believe there's some astroturfing going on in this thread.

But anyway, Orballo won't try to rip you off or anything, they'll get you what you ordered, but it may or may not be a smooth experience. For whatever reason, they seem to be struggling with fulfilling orders correctly and in a timely fashion. If you're not in a hurry, they're probably fine to order from. It took me months to get all parts I ordered but I did receive them (and I got some extra stuff on the side as compensation after asking for it).

Not sure what astroturfing is, need to Google that . My order arrived yesterday Oct 4th, ordered on Sep 24th so the turnaround time was not bad. Opened the box today and all looks well, except that I'm not certain if all printed parts are there - sent them a mail regarding that. The steel frame is solid and the black finishing is much better than any paint job I could do myself, quite happy there. Decent printed parts as well, better than the photos posted earlier in this thread of last year. The packaging was decent.

As ade2 says, they're not likely to rip you off and anyhow you can pay with PayPal so there's some protection there. The VAT I shouldn't have paid was refunded correctly. They will charge an additional fee for PayPal payments though.

Also as you probably know there's more than one seller here in Spain of the P3steel frame. I ordered some parts from hta3d.com and they shipped the day after my order was placed. There's also kitprinter3d.com but they are more expensive than either of the others and I haven't ordered from them, so can't speak as to their service. They did reply quickly when I mailed them to ask whether they carried certain parts I was looking for.

edit: Googled astroturfing and yes, that had crossed my mind as well . Low post counts being somewhat of a giveaway.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2016 01:16AM by siddharta.

Got my P3steel from Orballo today, just a week after ordering. so far I have assembled it as far as I can, without any problems. Frame seems very sturdy. Now I just have to fire my Mendel up again and print all the vitamens and other goodies. I am thinking about having an easily-changeable X-cariage, so that I can swap easily between hot-ends and different tool-ends, like a laser-engraver or a Dremel.

Hi, speaking of the the easily swap-able x-carriage, that's exactly what I've made! You can find it here. I've updated the design a little since (mostly to not use the diii cooler, and use a slightly modified Prusa mk2 cooler), but I'm still using the one I've got up on thingiverse. I've also managed to model a rotary tool holder (for the proxxon micromot 50ef) and I've so far used it to CNC wood, copper clad for PCB and a zippo, and I've made a pen holder to make my machine into a plotter. If you model in fusion 360, drop me your email in a PM And I can add you to a project folder with the design in it.

Hi !

I bought a frame and printed parts from orballo and ... omg ! they missed 3 parts on the frame and of course after 5 weeks and 2 resend (maybe or not ...) i don't have any parts that promise

Printed parts are unusable and all the parts aren't in the package ... that's my experience but i'm still waiting for my parts !

++