Duet development news

I am using old Compaq server PSUs, they have a decent 32amps at 12V output, as well as 5A at 5V (I bought at £10 each including shipping). But you can also get 12V to 5V converters for a couple of quid from ebay, they will do 2A or more.

I appreciate it is always more convenient to have everything on board, but where do you draw the line? Someone will always want more - to run LED strings, RasPi, hub, keyboard, mouse, recharge their tablet/phone...

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Quote
bobc
I appreciate it is always more convenient to have everything on board, but where do you draw the line? Someone will always want more - to run LED strings, RasPi, hub, keyboard, mouse, recharge their tablet/phone...

The line is on the other side of all the stuff I want.

From other electronics I have worked with that supplies a 5V line, they normally only put on something big enough for their needs. Seems that is not the case with the Duet. There is some extra available. If it would have been just a matter of changing out a few components to supply more current, thought it would be a nice addition. Since the Duet has a nice web interface, I don't need to run OctoPrint. However, to get wireless, I need to run something like the TP-Link. Being able to just get power for it from the board would be nice and it sounds like I should be able to do that as long as I don't run the Panel.

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ElmoC
I should be able to do that as long as I don't run the Panel.

Hi ElmoC yes that should be fine

@BobC indeed!

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DuetWifi.: advanced 3d printing electronics

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PRZ
I get the point not having 12V on a 24V machine, but 5V IS available and widen the choice for the controlled fans.
At the very minimum, the controlled fan LED rail shall be disconnectable to be able to supply in 5V without tricky wiring.

That could probably be done, but would users be happy to have a choice between all the controlled fans driven from 5V and all driven from Vin? What about the always-on fans?

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Quote
ElmoC

Quote
bobc
I appreciate it is always more convenient to have everything on board, but where do you draw the line? Someone will always want more - to run LED strings, RasPi, hub, keyboard, mouse, recharge their tablet/phone...

The line is on the other side of all the stuff I want.

From other electronics I have worked with that supplies a 5V line, they normally only put on something big enough for their needs. Seems that is not the case with the Duet. There is some extra available. If it would have been just a matter of changing out a few components to supply more current, thought it would be a nice addition. Since the Duet has a nice web interface, I don't need to run OctoPrint. However, to get wireless, I need to run something like the TP-Link. Being able to just get power for it from the board would be nice and it sounds like I should be able to do that as long as I don't run the Panel.

Even with a PanelDue, if the TPLink only takes 150mA that should be no problem. The PanelDue takes about 330mA with the 4.3" screen, 630mA with the 7" screen, and somewhere in between with the 5" screen.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Quote
dc42

Quote
PRZ
I get the point not having 12V on a 24V machine, but 5V IS available and widen the choice for the controlled fans.
At the very minimum, the controlled fan LED rail shall be disconnectable to be able to supply in 5V without tricky wiring.

That could probably be done, but would users be happy to have a choice between all the controlled fans driven from 5V and all driven from Vin? What about the always-on fans?

Yes, I suggested a selection jumper earlier. It's not hard to find most fans in most form factors in 5v, 24v not so much. An always on fan thats at "system voltage" can just be wired in to the power supply, although convenient to have a connector on board, it's really not strictly needed.

Yes, all fans in 5V is easier than all in 24V.
My point was also to avoid installation of a diode to protect the 5V input from Vin going through the LED (that is what I have done).
I've thought to destroy the LED to cut the path, but that is a bit barbarian.
And I am not sure of the interest of controlled fan LEDS. Never had a look at them.

Quote
dc42
Even with a PanelDue, if the TPLink only takes 150mA that should be no problem. The PanelDue takes about 330mA with the 4.3" screen, 630mA with the 7" screen, and somewhere in between with the 5" screen.

Checking the RPi/Camera and I see it staying in the low 500ma range with spikes up to 660ma. So given the draw on the 7" screen, powering the RPi/Camera should be okay. Not sure if both the TP-Link and Pi would be safe to power together. But I think running the TP-Link separate is probably a better idea so it can stay powered on when the printer is off.

That should be workable!

cheers

Tony

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DuetWifi.: advanced 3d printing electronics

I guess that the design of DuetNG is fairly well advanced, and it might be a bit late for feature requests. It would be nice to make Duet a bit more "Arduino friendly", i.e. allow a seamless programming experience from the Arduino IDE. I have added files to CoreDuet so a Duet can be added to Arduino IDE via Boards Manager. To program a Duet, I need to do Erase+reset before download, then usually a Reset after download. Otherwise, a user can write sketches in the Arduino IDE and program the board like other Arduino compatible boards.

Adding a 16u2 and programming port as on the Due would add unnecessary cost to the DuetNG, so my suggestion is to add a 6 pin header which includes the Erase and Reset signals. Then an external adapter can provide Arduino compatible programming. The makers of the Taijuino use such a method for their version of Due : [www.elechouse.com]

Their programming board looks like this


I don't think their programming board is Open Source, but an OS version is easy to create.

The minimum would be to add Erase, Reset,TX/RX to a header somewhere on the board, I think all those signals are available externally on Duet 0.8.5 already except Erase.

---

What is Open Source?
What is Open Source Hardware?
Open Source in a nutshell: the Four Freedoms
CC BY-NC is not an Open Source license

Here is a progress update.

Testing of the first prototype board has gone very well. We could put it into production with the only design change being the addition of one capacitor. However, we always intended to make further improvements to the capability of the board. These have been finalised, and a second prototype is currently being manufactured.

Once I have received and tested this and confirmed that no changes to the design are required, we plan to do a small run of pre-production boards. Some will be used for in-house soak testing. A few will be given to our OEMs and a small number of beta testers. We are also considering making some available to early adopters at a special price, bearing in mind that they may not be exactly the same as the final.productin boards.

We are not yet revealing the final specifications of the board or the major new features. However, we have listened to your comments and as a result the new Duet will have the following:

* Three low current PWM outputs for fans or similar devices, instead of two

* Fan power jumper selectable between Vin and 5V

* And of course larger terminal blocks for the hot end heaters, which I announced already.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Just a minor thing, but will the mounting holes and size be the same as the existing Duet?

Sounds good dc42, sort of sad that I have a 0.8.5 coming to continue my build, the DuetNG will be an upgrade for that machine though.

With more people using external heater SSR's, it's a pity not to have a small 2 pin header for external SSR connection.

Quote
aussiephil
Sounds good dc42, sort of sad that I have a 0.8.5 coming to continue my build, the DuetNG will be an upgrade for that machine though.

With more people using external heater SSR's, it's a pity not to have a small 2 pin header for external SSR connection.

Maybe the board could be designed with holes for both the bigger connector and a Molex KK style one? That way if you want the smaller connector, you can unsolder the big one and add the smaller one. At least with the current screw connectors for the hot ends, I was able to remove those and replace them with Molex connectors. I would hope the new board also keeps the 0.1" spacing for those connectors.

Quote
ElmoC

Quote
aussiephil
Sounds good dc42, sort of sad that I have a 0.8.5 coming to continue my build, the DuetNG will be an upgrade for that machine though.

With more people using external heater SSR's, it's a pity not to have a small 2 pin header for external SSR connection.

Maybe the board could be designed with holes for both the bigger connector and a Molex KK style one? That way if you want the smaller connector, you can unsolder the big one and add the smaller one. At least with the current screw connectors for the hot ends, I was able to remove those and replace them with Molex connectors. I would hope the new board also keeps the 0.1" spacing for those connectors.

I'm sure the board is well and truly locked down at prototype two and having done lighting controller designs I know I would have the layout locked in by now, I guess I'm just being wistful for something that the greater majority won't need .

Quote
aussiephil
Sounds good dc42, sort of sad that I have a 0.8.5 coming to continue my build, the DuetNG will be an upgrade for that machine though.

With more people using external heater SSR's, it's a pity not to have a small 2 pin header for external SSR connection.

The Duet 0.6 has an EXT_FET connector that you could use for driving an SSR as an alternative to using the bed heater output terminals. I didn't notice until now that the Duet 0.8.5 doesn't have that connector.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

May be too late,
but I already suggested to provide a supplementary thermistor input to control ambiant temperature (in or atop the printer) for fire safety.

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Pierre

- Safety [reprap.org]
- Embedded help system for Duet and RepRap Firmware [forums.reprap.org]
- Enclosed delta printers Lily [rouzeau.net] and Lily Big [rouzeau.net]
- OpenScad delta printer simulator [github.com]
- 3D printing on my site [www.rouzeau.net]

Quote
PRZ
May be too late,
but I already suggested to provide a supplementary thermistor input to control ambiant temperature (in or atop the printer) for fire safety.

You could achieve that using a spare thermistor channel if you have one. If you don't, then you probably don't have an expansion board connected, in which case you can connect an extra thermistor to one of the expansion connector thermistor channels along with a 4.7K pullup resistor to 3.3V.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Using expansion connector is workable, but not practical, that need to have flying components and 1 pin connections, and if I follow same schematic, there is also a capacitor to add. A safety feature shall be straightforward.

Quote
dc42

Quote
PRZ
May be too late,
but I already suggested to provide a supplementary thermistor input to control ambiant temperature (in or atop the printer) for fire safety.

You could achieve that using a spare thermistor channel if you have one. If you don't, then you probably don't have an expansion board connected, in which case you can connect an extra thermistor to one of the expansion connector thermistor channels along with a 4.7K pullup resistor to 3.3V.

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Pierre

- Safety [reprap.org]
- Embedded help system for Duet and RepRap Firmware [forums.reprap.org]
- Enclosed delta printers Lily [rouzeau.net] and Lily Big [rouzeau.net]
- OpenScad delta printer simulator [github.com]
- 3D printing on my site [www.rouzeau.net]

Quote
PRZ
Using expansion connector is workable, but not practical, that need to have flying components and 1 pin connections, and if I follow same schematic, there is also a capacitor to add. A safety feature shall be straightforward.

The capacitor would not be needed because it will be integrated in the new Duet.

While it's nice to have safety features, I don't know of anyone else who has implemented a safety temperature sensor as you describe. Several people have configured a smoke alarm to shut off power to the printer if it goes off, which IMO is a better system, not least because it is completely independent from the main printer electronics, and therefore not affected by hardware failure or short circuits within the printer electronics and wiring.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Quote
PRZ
May be too late,
but I already suggested to provide a supplementary thermistor input to control ambiant temperature (in or atop the printer) for fire safety.

A safety system like this needs to be independent of the printer. If the printer catches fire, probably the first thing that will go is the controller.

Quote
dc42
Testing of the first prototype board has gone very well. We could put it into production with the only design change being the addition of one capacitor. However, we always intended to make further improvements to the capability of the board. These have been finalised, and a second prototype is currently being manufactured.

David, which drivers you decided to use in the last prototype?

Dc42 do you have more details about these smoke detectors? The ordinary ones that will be mounted on the ceiling with a potential free contact or is there a design out there that will be mounted nearby the printer?

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Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.

Quote
uvarovkv
David, which drivers you decided to use in the last prototype?

The first prototype used A4982 drivers, same as the existing Duet. We're not revealing what drivers are on the second prototype until we have done some stress testing and thermal testing, in case they don't meet our expectations and we have to revert to A4982 drivers or choose something else.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Quote
Treito
Dc42 do you have more details about these smoke detectors? The ordinary ones that will be mounted on the ceiling with a potential free contact or is there a design out there that will be mounted nearby the printer?

I can't remember the details. There was a thread about it in the Safety section of these forums, about a year ago AFAIR.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Quote
Treito
Dc42 do you have more details about these smoke detectors? The ordinary ones that will be mounted on the ceiling with a potential free contact or is there a design out there that will be mounted nearby the printer?

Maybe this one or MQ2 gas detector selling by 3DMS ...

Quote
dc42

Quote
uvarovkv
David, which drivers you decided to use in the last prototype?

The first prototype used A4982 drivers, same as the existing Duet. We're not revealing what drivers are on the second prototype until we have done some stress testing and thermal testing, in case they don't meet our expectations and we have to revert to A4982 drivers or choose something else.

but it is so noisy ...as other describe it on this forum

Shame on me! I have an Arduino sensor kit, but I have not taken a deeper look at it and guess what: There is a gas sensor included.
But I also hoped that there is a ready solution. I know there are ordinary smoke detectors for rooms which provide a potential free contact for registering alarms, but that would be oversized.
The gas sensor board would need some sort of additional controller platform (Arduino based?).
I also think that it shouldn't be connected to the Duet itself for safety reasons and I think that theme is done for here and should be discussed seperately if wanted.

---

Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.

Quote
dc42

Quote
Treito
Dc42 do you have more details about these smoke detectors? The ordinary ones that will be mounted on the ceiling with a potential free contact or is there a design out there that will be mounted nearby the printer?

I can't remember the details. There was a thread about it in the Safety section of these forums, about a year ago AFAIR.

I found the thread: [forums.reprap.org]

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

The positioning of a smoke detector is important. If they are mounted in the wrong orientation they can be pretty useless.

Dave