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Duet development news

Posted by dc42 
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 04:35AM
Quote
aussiephil
Quote
dougal1957
I Would Echo the concerns with the Titan I put one on My delta and struggled with it to get a decent print without jamming/Stripping.
Went back to the original Mendel Mini extruder and issues disappeared I think the issue came down to the Length of the Bowden Tube (Mine is 800 mm long).

I think as the pressure builds up and the friction of the tube is just to much for the Titan to cope with it seems to lay down the first few layers ok but then starts to skip and then strips the filament unless I slow the whole printer down ie down to something like 25mm/s print speeds It normally runs nearer to 120 (and is capable of faster).

I haven't yet experimented with shorter tube as I am at the minimum really that I can get away with (Printer is 1 mtr tall with 500 mm sides)

on Smaller Deltas with more modest Bowden setups it may be OK.

Doug

Apologies off topic-----

Time to do a flying extruder, at 200mm of tube, the only issues have been actually blockages caused by crappy filament at which point the Titan just eats the filament... I have found that the tension nut needs to be done up a fair way.. This is with PLA... be interesting when i switch to ABS, still waiting on PET tape to arrive from china...

I only use ABS and on the Beast (Similar size to yours) I may well have to go Flying Extruder on that one 1.5 mtr 40x40 V-Slot Verticals and 750 mm horizontals.

Doug

ps. Just paid for my Duet WIFI and PT100 Board.
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 04:41AM
Quote
dc42
Quote
deckingman
Should I be looking at anything special in the way of extruder stepper motors to take advantage of any of this? I'll shortly be ordering 3 off E3D titans (thanks for the idea DC42 although initially I thought they were too expensive) and I was just going add whatever steppers they (E3d) supply.

I should point out that I haven't tried the Titan yet. E3D hardware is generally well-designed; nevertheless you might want to see read some reviews before you commit to buying three of them. Regarding stepper motors, with about 3:1 gearing (same as the Titan) I find 34mm long motors with about 22Ncm torque adequate for driving 1.75mm PLA, although a little more torque won't do any harm.

Thanks DC. I appreciate that you haven't tried the Titan and am fully aware that it wasn't a personal recommendation, just a suggestion on your part as something to look at. I have been doing my homework and looked at dozens of alternatives. All the DIY printable designs seem to have some sort of issue or another, as do a lot of the all metal and non printable offerings as well as being expensive. The Titan seems to tick all the boxes and now that I've done my research, the price doesn't seem to be unreasonable. However, some of the recent posts I've read toady are causing me to re-think. As an aside, I did ask E3D if they would do a discounted price for 3 off but their volume discounts start at 10 units. The question I asked was really about choosing extruder steppers to make use of the new Duet stepper drivers. I guess it doesn't matter.
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 04:49AM
Quote
dougal1957
I Would Echo the concerns with the Titan I put one on My delta and struggled with it to get a decent print without jamming/Stripping.
Went back to the original Mendel Mini extruder and issues disappeared I think the issue came down to the Length of the Bowden Tube (Mine is 800 mm long).

I think as the pressure builds up and the friction of the tube is just to much for the Titan to cope with it seems to lay down the first few layers ok but then starts to skip and then strips the filament unless I slow the whole printer down ie down to something like 25mm/s print speeds It normally runs nearer to 120 (and is capable of faster).

I haven't yet experimented with shorter tube as I am at the minimum really that I can get away with (Printer is 1 mtr tall with 500 mm sides)

on Smaller Deltas with more modest Bowden setups it may be OK.

Doug

Also apologies for being off topic but aussiephil and I have come up with a plan to get short bowden tubes on a 600mm x 600mm x 1 metre tall corexy that I'm planning [forums.reprap.org]
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 06:38AM
Quote
deckingman
The question I asked was really about choosing extruder steppers to make use of the new Duet stepper drivers. I guess it doesn't matter.

It doesn't really matter, but my advice is don't get motors that are much longer/higher torque than necessary. I like to adjust the extruder motor current so that if the nozzle is temporarily blocked, the extruder drive motor skips steps instead of eating the filament. That way, when the blockage is removed, extrusion will continue. The problem with doing this with a long high-torque motor is that you have to turn the current way down, and then the retraction acceleration is limited because of the high rotor inertia. The 40Ncm motor that E3D offers as an optional extra is right at the upper limit of the torque range that I would choose. Unfortunately, E3D doesn't appear to give the full motor specifications, in particular the rated phase current. If I were using a flying extruder, I would definitely choose a shorter motor.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 07:30AM
Brill !!!
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 08:24AM
My opinion of the titan might change, I just discovered mine are defected by birth ... looks like they need replacing. Waiting for e3d to confirm it or not.

Also I follow david advice. For the extruder I use a thinner motor with less torque.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2016 08:25AM by Fpex.


----- Making the world smarter @ www.xetal.eu
----- Helping entrepreneurs @ www.fralke.com
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 08:33AM
Quote
Fpex
My opinion of the titan might change, I just discovered mine are defected by birth ... looks like they need replacing. Waiting for e3d to confirm it or not.

Also I follow david advice. For the extruder I use a thinner motor with less torque.

What problem do you have wonder if mine might be the same I believe that there are 2 different Hobbs that have been produced mine appears to be a narrow cut and I have seen photos of a wider cut one?

Doug
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 08:34AM
The narrow hobb is a faulty one , this is what i just learnt.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2016 08:34AM by Fpex.


----- Making the world smarter @ www.xetal.eu
----- Helping entrepreneurs @ www.fralke.com
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 11:01AM
Quote
Fpex
The narrow hobb is a faulty one , this is what i just learnt.

Thanks for that just emailed them a pic of my hob and a new one has already been shipped out to me.

Less than 1 hour start to finish so fairly impressed (If it fixes the issue?).

Doug
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 11:30AM
Quote
dougal1957
Quote
Fpex
The narrow hobb is a faulty one , this is what i just learnt.

Thanks for that just emailed them a pic of my hob and a new one has already been shipped out to me.

Less than 1 hour start to finish so fairly impressed (If it fixes the issue?).

Doug

Please let us know if it fixes the issue.
Re: Duet development news
June 17, 2016 11:34AM
Certainly will however it will have to be after I have got The DuetWIFI Installed and tested as there is a certain Time constraint on me to do that before Vacation time.

Doug.
Re: Duet development news
June 20, 2016 11:13AM
So with the gory details out in he open now, are you able to talk about to what extent higher step rates have been tested? I have a delta with 1.8 deg/step motors and 15t pullies, 106.666 steps/mm. Running at 24v. I'd like to get at least 64 micro steps if not 128, and I'd like to hit travel speeds of 200mm/sec. I know you run .9deg/step motors with 20t pullies Dave, how high have you pushed your microstepping?
Re: Duet development news
June 20, 2016 12:45PM
Quote
Koko76
So with the gory details out in he open now, are you able to talk about to what extent higher step rates have been tested? I have a delta with 1.8 deg/step motors and 15t pullies, 106.666 steps/mm. Running at 24v. I'd like to get at least 64 micro steps if not 128, and I'd like to hit travel speeds of 200mm/sec. I know you run .9deg/step motors with 20t pullies Dave, how high have you pushed your microstepping?

My delta is currently in pieces while I wait for some crimp pins to arrive. So far I have only done prints on my delta at 16x microstepping with interpolation to 256x enabled - and it is much quieter than it was before. I have yet to optimise the speed of step generation for the Duet WiFi, but I was getting 300mm/sec travel speed with the Duet 0.8.5 so I would expect around 400mm/sec with the Duet WiFi because of the faster processor. I have 160 steps/mm. So with your ~107 steps/mm, I would expect that with x16 microstepping you would achieve 600mm/sec, with 32x you would get 300mm/sec, and with 64x you would get 150mm/sec. Those figures will increase when I optimise the step generation code, and increase even more when I implement dynamically varying microstepping. And of course you can enable interpolation to get most of the benefits of 256x microstepping.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Duet development news
June 20, 2016 01:39PM
Quote
dc42
Quote
Koko76
So with the gory details out in he open now, are you able to talk about to what extent higher step rates have been tested? I have a delta with 1.8 deg/step motors and 15t pullies, 106.666 steps/mm. Running at 24v. I'd like to get at least 64 micro steps if not 128, and I'd like to hit travel speeds of 200mm/sec. I know you run .9deg/step motors with 20t pullies Dave, how high have you pushed your microstepping?

My delta is currently in pieces while I wait for some crimp pins to arrive. So far I have only done prints on my delta at 16x microstepping with interpolation to 256x enabled - and it is much quieter than it was before. I have yet to optimise the speed of step generation for the Duet WiFi, but I was getting 300mm/sec travel speed with the Duet 0.8.5 so I would expect around 400mm/sec with the Duet WiFi because of the faster processor. I have 160 steps/mm. So with your ~107 steps/mm, I would expect that with x16 microstepping you would achieve 600mm/sec, with 32x you would get 300mm/sec, and with 64x you would get 150mm/sec. Those figures will increase when I optimise the step generation code, and increase even more when I implement dynamically varying microstepping. And of course you can enable interpolation to get most of the benefits of 256x microstepping.

All I've seen mentioned was the m305 to set microstepping. Could you point me to where I can read up on interpolation and other settings?
Re: Duet development news
June 20, 2016 05:42PM
[reprap.org]



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Duet development news
June 20, 2016 06:28PM
Quote
dc42
[reprap.org]
Yup, I can't read, totally missed the I term when I read it yesterday. Thanks for your patience and for your continued work!
Re: Duet development news
June 21, 2016 02:01AM
David

When using a PT100 sensor for the Hotend would my M305 be as follows (Assuming using the first port on the RTD Board)

M305 P1 T100000 R4700 B4200 H0 L0 X100

Not sure about the T And R Terms (Suspect that they are not used) also the X term does the first port on the PT100 board default to Ch 100 or could it be 102 assuming that the Thermocouple board also uses 2 channels).

Also is the PT100 polarised in sense of Pos Neg connections? I suspect not but better to be sure before wiring it all up?

Boards had to be collected from the PO Yesterday but basic stand alone config has been done and hoping to get the printer re-moddeled this afternoon work permitting?

Doug
Re: Duet development news
June 21, 2016 03:50AM
The T, R, B, H and L parameters are irrelevant when using a thermocouple or PT100. It doesn't matter which way round you connect a PT100 because it s basically just a very accurate resistor with a known temperature coefficient. Assuming you have only one daughter board fitted, the X parameter for the first PT100 should be 200. For a thermocouple board it would be 100. See [reprap.org] for a little more - but of course it's much easier with the purpose-made daughter boards

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2016 03:51AM by dc42.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Duet development news
June 21, 2016 04:33AM
Quote
dc42
The T, R, B, H and L parameters are irrelevant when using a thermocouple or PT100. It doesn't matter which way round you connect a PT100 because it s basically just a very accurate resistor with a known temperature coefficient. Assuming you have only one daughter board fitted, the X parameter for the first PT100 should be 200. For a thermocouple board it would be 100. See [reprap.org] for a little more - but of course it's much easier with the purpose-made daughter boards

Thanks for that David fills in the missing info nicely.

hopefully will have it ready later this evening to start testing

Doug
Re: Duet development news
June 24, 2016 08:04PM
Mine came in today, just got finished switching over the delta. Wow doesn't quite cover it. I'm using the default 16micro steps with interpolation, and boy is it quiet! Much less vibration at lower speeds too. Before I could feel noticeable vibration in the carriage while holding a finger against it during printing. With these drivers it is greatly reduced. Web setup was easy, and upload speeds are fast. I've got a lot of testing to do this weekend!
Thanks David, and the team at TP3D!
Re: Duet development news
June 25, 2016 09:46AM
I got my test board today. It looks impressive, but unfortunately it may take 6 weeks until I am able to test it. sad smiley
I took a short look at the provided SD-card. There was a readme how to enable Wifi, but how I enter the SSID and WPA2-key?
Sorry, if it was answered before,


Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.
Re: Duet development news
June 25, 2016 10:33AM
Quote
Treito
I got my test board today. It looks impressive, but unfortunately it may take 6 weeks until I am able to test it. sad smiley
I took a short look at the provided SD-card. There was a readme how to enable Wifi, but how I enter the SSID and WPA2-key?
Sorry, if it was answered before,

See the beta test instructions at [www.duet3d.com].



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Duet development news
June 29, 2016 01:50AM
Re Titan Extruder

Pleased to report that the New Hobb/Drive Gear has fixed the issue and I am Now very happy with it.

Doug
Re: Duet development news
June 30, 2016 07:31AM
Quote
dougal1957
Re Titan Extruder

Pleased to report that the New Hobb/Drive Gear has fixed the issue and I am Now very happy with it.

Doug
Any chance of grabbing the issues, I've searched but can't find any details and despite my Titan seeming to be fine I'd like to know what to look for
Cheers
Phil
Re: Duet development news
June 30, 2016 04:16PM
Quote
aussiephil
Quote
dougal1957
Re Titan Extruder

Pleased to report that the New Hobb/Drive Gear has fixed the issue and I am Now very happy with it.

Doug
Any chance of grabbing the issues, I've searched but can't find any details and despite my Titan seeming to be fine I'd like to know what to look for
Cheers
Phil

Phil check out Titan extruder not extruding correctly

about 1/2 way down pg 3 there is a post by Sanjay with pics of what to look for.

Mine is now performing as well as I would have hoped for and I am now very happy with it (Will have another for the Big Delta nicknamed the Beast!!

Doug
Re: Duet development news
July 19, 2016 06:45AM
I have been planning to make a large delta like that of dc42 and others and the recently designed DuetWIFI sounds great. I am very happy with Duet 0.6 board on my small Fisher delta printer, which has been upgraded so that it is now reliable and working well. I was expecting to use the Duet 0.85 board for the newer printer but the DuetWIFI hardware sounds like it will not need to be updated for a longer time and I don't have to use an external WIFI modem. Hence I have preordered the DuetWIFI. This creates a question as to what hardware eg motors (not the extruder) would be best since the current rating for the drivers on the DuetWIFI is higher than the previous boards. I was planning to use motors with 0.9deg step rate, although 1.8 degree would still be considered.
?Any suggestions as to the stepper motor model best suited to the new electronics, both 1.8 or 0.9 deg degree types.
Paul
Re: Duet development news
July 19, 2016 09:09AM
In my blog I give some part numbers for suggested 0.9 deg motors with a 1.68A rated current. For the Duet WiFi you could either use the same motors, or the ones in the same range with 2.0A rated current.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Duet development news
July 20, 2016 05:09PM
Ok thanks .
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