Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 12, 2016 07:04AM
Hello everyone smiling smiley My apologies for asking this probably very common question.

So I'm building a slight variation on the standard D-Bot by Spauda01 and I'm having a hard time choosing which 32bit board and accompanying FW/screen.
Googling for existing discussions has just resulted in me flipping back and forth between things - mainly RADDS/Due and Duet and now I'm stuck yawning smiley, but I'm open to options.

I'll be running the following main hardware if it helps:

Full 24v system
0.9° Steppers (Wantai 42BYGHM810)
'Pancake' stepper (17HS08-1004S) on a Titan DD setup
300w/~12.5A 300x300mm silicone heater
24v E3D V6

- Kind of had my eye on 128 stepper drivers, though I don't see myself actually going that far. It's more about having the option to reduce operating noise and any resolution increase is a bonus. Silencio drivers are a bit pricey for tastes fwiw.
- Was also looking at PanelDue, though I'd be ok with any screen/FW combo that does the job in terms of info and at least basic control.
- Not bothered about wifi/ethernet capability.

I'm not a technophobe, but this will be my first 3D printer and I'd ideally like to be able to work with FW that isn't a total nightmare to get my head around.

Thanks in advance for any advice you can offer, and do let me know if there's any more info that would be helpful.

Oh, and I'm based in the UK if that helps in terms of availability of certain things.

EDIT

I think I've decided on the Duet, so never mind.
Of course, any opinion is still welcome smiling smiley

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/12/2016 10:42AM by Mr Spangles.
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 12, 2016 10:46AM
Have you looked at the new Duet WiFi? It's available to pre-order, and it uses the super-quiet TMC2660 stepper drivers. See [www.duet3d.com] for more.

btw once you've used the web interface on the Duet or Duet WiFi, you'll probably never want to use anything else.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/12/2016 10:47AM by dc42.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 12, 2016 10:54AM
That looks great. Cheers.
Not sure I can wait until the end of August, though it looks like it could be worth it.

Btw, if using a tablet/phone as a controller over the network on this or the 0.8.5 Duet, does that offer all the same or more functionality/control as the PanelDue?
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 12, 2016 11:00AM
Quote
Mr Spangles
Btw, if using a tablet/phone as a controller over the network on this or the 0.8.5 Duet, does that offer all the same or more functionality/control as the PanelDue?

A tablet or smartphone offers a richer interface and a little more functionality than a PanelDue - although there is very little you can't do on a Panel Due, because if necessary you can enter gcodes on the touch keypad.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 12, 2016 11:10AM
Brilliant.

Thanks David.
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 13, 2016 12:40PM
I took the duet and have had to learn the hard way that its firmware has close to zero safety precautions. And no plans to change this.

Read my experience here:

[forums.reprap.org]

The radds has repetier and also a ported web interface. So you get the same but a safer printer. For this reason I would recommend the radds.
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 13, 2016 01:43PM
Quote
LarsK
I took the duet and have had to learn the hard way that its firmware has close to zero safety precautions. And no plans to change this.

Read my experience here:

LarsK, you are the only person who has experienced anything like that. The caused was because you failed to take proper safety precautions when you assembled your hot end, by (a) failing to secure the heater cartridge, and (b) by leaving the heater wires in a position in which they could snag on the print. Because your heater cartridge only came out after the hot end was up to temperature, the usual safety feature of heat-up timeout did not detect the error.

You are wrong in your assertion that the firmware has close to zero safety precautions. It has three that relate at least in part to the heating: (a) the heat-up timeout, (b) a software watchdog that continuously monitors the thermistor for over-temperature and for a disconnected thermistor, and (c) a hardware watchdog that monitors the software watchdog. However, none of thee will catch the situation of the heater cartridge and the thermistor becoming decoupled after printing temperature has been reached.

I admit that in principle the software could detect temperature abnormalities after initial heating is complete, and I have not said that I have no plans to change the firmware in this respect. I object strongly to being mis-represented. In fact I am looking to replace PID by feed forward temperature control. At that time is will be easier to detect abnormalities in the temperature response very quickly, and I will add a check that the temperature is behaving as expected, with heater shutdown if it is not.

RepRapFirmware is fully open-source, so you can of course add whatever additional precautions you want - with the help of the community if you want.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2016 01:45PM by dc42.



Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 13, 2016 03:06PM
Quote
dc42
Quote
LarsK
I took the duet and have had to learn the hard way that its firmware has close to zero safety precautions. And no plans to change this.

Read my experience here:

LarsK, you are the only person who has experienced anything like that. The caused was because you failed to take proper safety precautions when you assembled your hot end, by (a) failing to secure the heater cartridge, and (b) by leaving the heater wires in a position in which they could snag on the print. Because your heater cartridge only came out after the hot end was up to temperature, the usual safety feature of heat-up timeout did not detect the error.

You are wrong in your assertion that the firmware has close to zero safety precautions. It has three that relate at least in part to the heating: (a) the heat-up timeout, (b) a software watchdog that continuously monitors the thermistor for over-temperature and for a disconnected thermistor, and (c) a hardware watchdog that monitors the software watchdog. However, none of thee will catch the situation of the heater cartridge and the thermistor becoming decoupled after printing temperature has been reached.

I admit that in principle the software could detect temperature abnormalities after initial heating is complete, and I have not said that I have no plans to change the firmware in this respect. I object strongly to being mis-represented. In fact I am looking to replace PID by feed forward temperature control. At that time is will be easier to detect abnormalities in the temperature response very quickly, and I will add a check that the temperature is behaving as expected, with heater shutdown if it is not.

RepRapFirmware is fully open-source, so you can of course add whatever additional precautions you want - with the help of the community if you want.


I have at no point tried to diminish the fact that I made a big mistake. I am really happy to hear that you will look into the firmware, in the other thread you actually said that it is up to me to fix it (mechanically by securing the hotend). I know, you know, that the "you are the first to ever experience this" is not a valid argument in safety.

At the end of the day it is not complicated. The state of things is that if a heating cartridge falls down on a print running by Duet then it starts a fire. The RADDS does not. Then Mr Spangles needs to decide how much, if any, weight he will give to that. It is not difficult to take the necessary mechanical precautions and then it won't be an issue anyway.
Re: Which 32bit board/firmware to go for? (sorry!)
July 13, 2016 03:50PM
I do appreciate the warning, Lars.
Having read through both threads, I think that I'll probably be alright though.

My heater cartridge will be properly secured with a grub screw and all wiring to the print carriage will be shrouded in protective tubing that's fixed at two points, with no opportunity to snag on anything.

While you are right in that being the only one to have experienced this issue does not invalidate your concerns about it, the flip side is that the other 99.xx% of Duet owners have got by without having to deal with this as far as I know.

I hope you're back up and running ASAP smiling smiley
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