Re: Where is mendel BOM -- This thread is dead

I have spent the evening looking for the Mendel belt and 8mm rod lengths. The closest I can find, that might have this info is this open office document.

The parts lister seems to only contain depreciated Darwin1.0 parts, nothing about the Mendel BOM.


Why is there no PDF of the Mendel BOM!!??? I tried opening this with google docs but all that does is save the file name to a folder, when I try and run export to pdf from google docs I just get the same file back on my local drive.

Why is there no PDF of the Mendel BOM????

When I click on the link to the open office foundation (I really do not want more bloatware on my computer) I get a site is down message with something about upgrade and back in the morning. An important doc like this should have backups in text and pdf. This is a big weakness in cloud computing, when the host site goes down the drain.

I searched the web for blogs, there was one place that gave a possible part number, but the site wanted registration to get the belt size, I get too much guff from these sites as it is and do not want to register.

It is getting late, and I wasted an evening looking for something obvious, What is the length of the Mendel belts? I know the width is 5mm, But I want the length.



-julie

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2010 09:38PM by sheep.

What you want is the Mendel assembly data sheet Mendel_M4_lengths worksheet linked on the Mendel materials procurement page of the Mendel Build Documentation.

BELT SPECIFICATIONS (READ NOTES TA

Belt Name Type Pitch (mm) Width (mm) Length range Length* (mm) Qty US UK NZ
BX x-belt Ended 5 5 Min 1300** 1 click
BY y-belt Ended 5 5 Min 810** 1 split BX
BZ z-belt Continuous 5 5 [960-1008]*** 1 click

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Bob Morrison
Wörth am Rhein, Germany
"Luke, use the source!"
BLOG - PHOTOS - Thingiverse

Thanks, for the numbers. Now I need the rod lengths. The reason I am asking for this is that I am going through some of my spares looking for what may be usable.

Sorry for the frustration, my experience is with firmware and obsolete operating systems. I really do have plans to Babbage's mechanical computer of the late 1830s.

The link to open office is still dead. I have no way to open the assembly data sheet. This information really needs to be in a format anyone can read. Not everyone uses Linux. If I do manage to open the file I will convert it to PDF, so why can the file not be provided in that format.

While the name PDF is trademarked, the language used to encode inside the file is open. This is why apple wrote their own distiller and Ghostscript can read and write PDF type files. Open office on the other hand is worse than someone giving me a M$ file. At least with a M$ file there are enough format readers such a file can be converted.


-julie

I have to disappoint you but Open Office is not dead in fact ODF (open document format) will likely become the standard. In addition it is available for all OS's and the majority of user are Windows users (as am I). Also Open Office supports directly saving to PDF format.

And openoffice.org works fine for me, maybe you should check your internet connection.

Anyway the information you want is:

BAR & JIG LENGTHS (READ NOTES TA

Bar Name ø (mm) Type Length (mm) Qty From 1m stud # From 1m bar #
A Stud-frame-end-top M8 Studding 440 2 1
B Stud-frame-side M8 Studding 370 6 2,3,4
C Stud-frame-end M8 Studding 294 4 5,6
D1 Stud-z-base-beam-short M8 Studding 355 2 7
D2 Stud-z-base-beam-long M8 Studding 418 2 8
E Stud-z-leadscrew M8 Studding 330 2 6
X x-bar 8 Bar 495 2 1
Y y-bar 8 Bar 406 2 2
Z z-bar 8 Bar 330 2 3
J1 ~8 Scrap/stud 290 1 9
J2 ~8 Scrap/stud 234 1 2,3
J3 ~8 Scrap/stud 157 1 4,7
Total number of 1m lengths needed of studding = 9
Total number of 1m lengths needed of bar = 3

INSPECTION DISTANCES FOR SQUARING (PERFECT MODEL) (READ NOTES TA

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Bob Morrison
Wörth am Rhein, Germany
"Luke, use the source!"
BLOG - PHOTOS - Thingiverse

Thanks again. This information is really helpful as I can check the rods and belts I have to see if they will work.

Eventually cloud computing may take hold. There is something wrong with Mendel_assembly_data_sheet becouse I tried a few online translators such as google docs, and these give an error and simply say file can not be converted.

I just checked and refreshed, I am still getting CollabNet is down till 7AMPST it is now 13:41 PST.

Future promises do not satisfy the need today.


-julie

I really do have plans to Babbage's mechanical computer of the late 1830s.
New thread time! Also, I started:
[objects.reprap.org]
but you may want to clean it up a bit.

Eventually cloud computing may take hold. There is something wrong with Mendel_assembly_data_sheet becouse I tried a few online translators such as google docs, and these give an error and simply say file can not be converted.

Open office seems up now. Sorry you had trouble.
[download.openoffice.org]

I have no trouble opening it with open office or with kspread. I'm sure gnumeric can do it too. (MSOffice is designed to "accidentally" have lots of file-compatibility issues to generate MSOffice upgrading. Long story and beyond the scope of this discussion.)

If you're interested in sorting this out, try creating a basic 2 entry spreadsheet with openoffice, then feeding that new spreadsheet into google docs.

But if you're happy with the data you got, it's all good.

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pdfs are an utter nuisance to 'curate' online, as is distributing the same information in multiple formats. I favor embedded-in-the-page inline wiki stuff, but I've also learned that "arguing kills uploads".

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-Sebastien, RepRap.org library gnome.

---

Remember, you're all RepRap developers (once you've joined the super-secret developer mailing list), and the wiki, RepRap.org, [reprap.org] is for everyone and everything!

Thanks Sebastien;

You really do keep order around here. It seems to help, find an answer when I stress some issue or other that is troublesome.

This case was no different. The open office foundation came back up and I was able to find a version which would open the file. Open office may eventually adapt, At present this, like reprap is still much a dream with an alpha release pretending to be a stable beta. If a casual user can not open a document within 7 minutes, I am afraid they will continue to use commercialware, which is mandated by Government decree to maintain back compatibility. (As noted this is outside the scope of these discussions.)

The short is that I was able to convert the file to PDF. I see the format of the sheets are to optimized for that open and well supported file protocol. I am not sure why you feel PDF is a nuisance to curate online, as I tend to like to use it on my own website where appropriate. Perhaps they work more in a static environment, where there are not frequent changes.

I still feel this information would be better served in a wiki type page. I also understand the limits in resources needed to maintain such a page. I have hard enough time keeping my own blog updated. My time spent working on more physical projects.

Alas the rods in my spare bin are on the short side, coming in closer to 245mm than what is needed. At least through the help of members here I am able to get an idea of what is needed.
-julie

PS. Now I need to figure out how to edit the wiki and provide links ...

sheep Wrote:
> At present this, like reprap
> is still much a dream with an alpha release
> pretending to be a stable beta.

Open Office has as much stability, usability, and history, if not more so, than most integrated office productivity applications. What software do you normally use? I'd use open office over microsoft word any day (I lost count of the number of bugs I've hit editing our requirement documents at work with Microsoft Word, Excel, etc.)

I use PDF. Naturally. Hand coded inside of wordpad or teach-text. Postscript is the perfect language. Over 30 years old it has few bugs. [why I have not had steady work these last few years]

Actually mostly I have had to deal with word and excel. The latter I have been using since it was called Multiplan. None of this is my choice, I have to use what my employers, clients and family use. I have never seen a bug in these programs, although I have had to deal with a lot of user ignorance. Just do not get me started on Powerpoint!

I have 30+ years worth of files on my hard drive. [Found the Mona-Lisa graphic program from the Lawrence hall of science. Made the image by suppressing line feeds and banging the teletype keys on top of each other.] Buried on these CDs are probably most versions of these so called office make work tools.

This is a pointless discussion. We should be working on our firmware, Writing blogs, and updating the wiki, rather than having religious discussions.

-julie

PDF is tough for spreadsheets...

I downloaded the file and opened it with Microsoft Excel 2007, which had no problems reading the open document format. I saved as Excel spreadsheets, which are attached in the 2007 and 2003 versions.

sheep Wrote:

> This case was no different. The open office
> foundation came back up and I was able to find a
> version which would open the file. Open office
> may eventually adapt, At present this, like reprap
> is still much a dream with an alpha release
> pretending to be a stable beta. If a casual user
> can not open a document within 7 minutes, I am
> afraid they will continue to use commercialware,
> which is mandated by Government decree to maintain
> back compatibility. (As noted this is outside the
> scope of these discussions.)

RepRap is a research project, it's not a bussiness. Notice the .org Above. Even if RepRap produced a killer app printer, it would still look like this. Have you ever worked on a real research project? They are always scattershot and crazy, because people who care about doing rarely care much about documenting. And documentary rarely are innovators.

As far as Open Office, it's cleaning the clock of Microsoft in the international market. In the BRIC countries, you are lucky to find a paid for copy of Office, and most the school, and government computers use Linux and Open office.

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repraplogphase.blogspot.com

RepRap is a research project, it's not a business. Notice the .org Above. Even if RepRap produced a killer app printer, it would still look like this. Have you ever worked on a real research project? They are always scattershot and crazy, because people who care about doing rarely care much about documenting. And documentary rarely are innovators.

We do have some responsibility to keep things somewhat accessible, and periodically untangle what's up there into present stable and experimental branches.

I'll jot some notes up on pdfs and suchlike up on the wiki, carefully filed such a manner that they don't get in the way of people who want to contribute to the wiki. Mandating file formats = getting fewer uploads.

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-Sebastien, RepRap.org library gnome.

---

Remember, you're all RepRap developers (once you've joined the super-secret developer mailing list), and the wiki, RepRap.org, [reprap.org] is for everyone and everything!

Enough is enough. My questions were answered promptly and I got the information needed.

I was going to start a new thread noting my blog, which like my CNC machine tends to become neglected for years at a time.

My personal blog has been updated with some more sheepish nonsense relating to my experience with some of the abstractions dealt with here.

Anyway the blog is at delectra.com/toys I have created a section calle "Egyptian hall of mystery" in which to place reprap related updates.

As my expertise is with actually making things (and long abstract 19th century style missives) I am not sure how to set up the blog rolls and such to feed into the little boxy things that update through the blog cloud. I am not sure I have the time to edit blog-o-scripts and get things made and coded.


-julie

Julie, let me know if you want to start up a Mechanical Computing Working Group. I'd suggest a thread to begin with, and then grow that into its own forum.

I have a hidden agenda: I want multiple gear families in the wiki as part of RBS. Also, mechanical computing is cool.

Would you like to upload your 3D models of Adding Mechanisms here
[objects.reprap.org]
or here
[objects.reprap.org]

This may supplement or supplant blogging.

---

-Sebastien, RepRap.org library gnome.

---

Remember, you're all RepRap developers (once you've joined the super-secret developer mailing list), and the wiki, RepRap.org, [reprap.org] is for everyone and everything!

sheep Wrote:
> Why is there no PDF of the Mendel BOM!!??? I
> tried opening this with google docs but all that
> does is save the file name to a folder, when I try
> and run export to pdf from google docs I just get
> the same file back on my local drive.
>
> Why is there no PDF of the Mendel BOM????

Because this project is Open Source, which means we even share the sources files for the documentation, so, no need to use PDF.


> When I click on the link to the open office
> foundation (I really do not want more bloatware on
> my computer) I get a site is down message with
> something about upgrade and back in the morning.
> An important doc like this should have backups in
> text and pdf. This is a big weakness in cloud
> computing, when the host site goes down the
> drain.

There are many programs that opens that files - so it's not true what you say about being weakness.

---

---
New cutting edge RepRap electronics, ARM 32 bits @ 100MHz runs RepRap @ 725mm/s:

[www.3dprinting-r2c2.com]

sheep Wrote:
This
> information really needs to be in a format anyone
> can read. Not everyone uses Linux. If I do
> manage to open the file I will convert it to PDF,
> so why can the file not be provided in that
> format.
>
> While the name PDF is trademarked, the language
> used to encode inside the file is open. This is
> why apple wrote their own distiller and
> Ghostscript can read and write PDF type files.
> Open office on the other hand is worse than
> someone giving me a M$ file. At least with a M$
> file there are enough format readers such a file
> can be converted.

If we were dependent of closed sources technologies like the products of M$, we wouldn't simple have any RepRap 3D printer.

Looks like you are the one that had been dead (like closed in a cage) all over this years, not Open Office, but maybe the tools you use instead.

---

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New cutting edge RepRap electronics, ARM 32 bits @ 100MHz runs RepRap @ 725mm/s:

[www.3dprinting-r2c2.com]

Julie does have a point -- it would be better to have both the 'source' document, the ODS file, as well as one or two easy to read formats.

I would suggest TEXT and HTML; both of which, I believe Open Office can save as. For a spreadsheet/table based document, the text would be tab or comma delimited; I would not use PDF, as that is not as open a format.

What would really be nice (something to add to your long list of nice, Sebastian.. ) would be an automated scan of the WIKI that looked for file attachments with specific extensions -- that would add a warning anyone could see... that way, anyone looking at the wiki could notice the warning and fix the problem if they were so inclined --> Continual improvement over time.

Julie does have a point -- it would be better to have both the 'source' document, the ODS file, as well as one or two easy to read formats.

Adrian and Ed have done a good job of doing up a spreadsheet and I'm not going to attempt to push any unnecessary work onto their plates by trying to get them to release in another format.

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Here's a example of a place where we have to be careful not to to try to impose our file-preferences on other folk, or we get nothing.
[dev.forums.reprap.org]

Engineering students like to work on RepRap. But they tend to like to give us my_fabulous_new_improvement.doc because that's the toolset that generated the printed paper that they need.

So I expect cpwebste to parachute in with a msdoc or .zip file of a stunningly good RepStrap and SDM setup, and leave it to us to figure out.

Inkjet example:
[objects.reprap.org]

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We have to be careful not to fill up the wiki with passive agressive notes, or we may get a dogpile of wiki administrators doing everything they can to get in the way of people actually doing the work. Exhibit A:
[en.wikipedia.org]
[en.wikipedia.org]

(Wikipedia has 2 populations - the people who write articles, and the people who make everything work.)

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Nonfavorite file formats are as nothing compared to the issue of trying to get people to do one or two interesting objects or projects and project research notes on the wiki as keeping everything on their blogs and other spaces. Utterly frustrating and confounding, but I have to avoid presenting them with conflict or complexity or those prospective folk just evaporate (even more).

I think what I need to do is just get enough projects into the RepRap wiki that we get a self-sustaining population, along with making wiki-server changes that make this possible.

---

-Sebastien, RepRap.org library gnome.

---

Remember, you're all RepRap developers (once you've joined the super-secret developer mailing list), and the wiki, RepRap.org, [reprap.org] is for everyone and everything!

SebastienBailard Wrote:
> Adrian and Ed have done a good job of doing up a
> spreadsheet and I'm not going to attempt to push
> any unnecessary work onto their plates by trying
> to get them to release in another format.

I agree on passive aggressive warnings; Are there features / tools to do on-the-fly conversions on the server side? Google often has the "view as html" for PDF documents -- that's more in line with pushing the effort to the server instead of lazy (or busy) humans.

SebastienBailard Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Adrian and Ed have done a good job of doing up a
> spreadsheet and I'm not going to attempt to push
> any unnecessary work onto their plates by trying
> to get them to release in another format.

I found it quite easy to convert from .ods to .xls and .xlsx, and posted the files on this thread. I was going to upload them to the Wiki page as well, but for this note:

"Please do not create additional spreadsheets, simply update to the existing data sheet. This keeps the data central."

I interpreted this as a request to not upload my converted files.

The nice thing about a user-edited wiki is that Adrian and Ed don't always have to be the ones doing all the work. =) But in this case, I wasn't sure if I should contribute.

Mendel BOM as a Google Doc

Ooh thread necromancy.

One really does not know what to do when dead threads go zombie?

The thread is dead, the thread is read. viva la thread mortuordum.


-julie