Generation 7 Electronics Development

Did you use the FiveD from Gen7's wiki page?

If yes, you'll have to review pins.h and make change

#elif MOTHERBOARD == 1

#ifndef __AVR_ATmega644__
#error Oops!  Make sure you have 'Sanguino' selected from the 'Tools -> Boards' menu.
#endif

to

#elif MOTHERBOARD == 1

#if defined __AVR_ATmega644__ || defined __AVR_ATmega644P__
#error Oops!  Make sure you have 'Sanguino' selected from the 'Tools -> Boards' menu.
#endif

That said, I'm not exactly an expert on FiveD, I'm working a lot more with Teacup Firmware.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Finch, i got the same error when i tried to compile that , did you use fiveD?
but then itried this other version of fiveD,seems to compile but i still dont know if its fully right.
[see attachment]

this is odd,but on the one i downloaded,changed as per Traumflug's instructions,and posted,it says:

#elif MOTHERBOARD == 1

#ifndef __AVR_ATmega644__
#error Oops! Make sure you have 'Sanguino' selected from the 'Tools -> Boards' menu.
#endif

........and compiles without errors,
but if changed to:
#elif MOTHERBOARD == 1

#if defined __AVR_ATmega644__ || defined __AVR_ATmega644P__
#error Oops! Make sure you have 'Sanguino' selected from the 'Tools -> Boards' menu.
#endif
it shows the error Finch got[and i got from the other version]

Quote

this is odd

Indeed!

Now, I simply messed up. You want the Oops not when one of both processors is present, but exactly the opposite.

Simply delete this section:

#ifndef __AVR_ATmega644__
#error Oops! Make sure you have 'Sanguino' selected from the 'Tools -> Boards' menu.
#endif

This section is a safety measurement only, it produces no code, it doesn't alter how the firmware works.

The correct line should be

#if ! defined __AVR_ATmega644__ && ! defined __AVR_ATmega644P__

, but it's always a bit error-prone to suggest something without actually trying it.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

oh,ok,
other thing i wondered was: replicatorG and repsnapper still think its not connected,[i checked the com port etc]
will it connect without the opto endstops and all pololus connected to it?

I try traumflug file but its the same. So I download the test firmware for gen7 from wiki and it seem that something doesnt work. I click upload and it doesnt move from the situation on picture.

[www.shrani.si]

Is maybe something wrong with usb-ttl adapter (I bought it from ebay...cheap one). I tried with reset pin conected and disconnected. Everything is the same as in pictures. All these things are new for me so I have a lot of problems...Thank you!


[www.shrani.si]

[www.shrani.si]

Quote

will it connect without the opto endstops and all pololus connected to it?

Yes. Look at what G-code is exchanged and if your host can't do that, try pronterface, part of printrun.

Quote

something doesnt work

OK, that precisely describes what happens. Change something and it will work.



Did your ATmega come with the SetupTest firmware loaded? If not, try with that first: [reprap.org] . SetupTest shows results without all that host software fluff, so you can actually see what's happening instead of getting generic messages.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

thanks Traumflug,pronterface works,now i just have to check the stepper motor wirings, are they the same as for other generations? is there a reference/diagram of how they wire up,or is it the standard reprap one[the instructions are for nema23]

Steppers are always wired the same, independent from size or other specifications. One coil to the left pair of the four pins, the other coil to the other pair.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Quote
An unnamed person
got a quick question reference the wiring of my Gen 7 electronics!

I'm just at the stage of connecting my axis endstop switches and just wanted to confirm if the below was correct?

Pin 1 (ATmega) - NC contact on switch
Pin 2 (Ground) - Common on switch
Pin 3 (+5V) - NO contact on switch

Pinout is right, with pin 1 being the one closest to the interrupter. These comments however ... an opto endstop isn't a switch. 5V and GND are static, while pin 1 flips between 4V and 0.2V, depending on wether the the interrupter is interrupted or not. 5V doesn't change and you also can't swap pin2 and pin3, like you could with a mechanical switch.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Quote
Traumflug
Pinout is right, with pin 1 being the one closest
to the interrupter. These comments however ... an
opto endstop isn't a switch. 5V and GND are
static, while pin 1 flips between 4V and 0.2V,
depending on wether the the interrupter is
interrupted or not. 5V doesn't change and you also
can't swap pin2 and pin3, like you could with a
mechanical switch.

So basically a mechanical switch can't be used as an endstop with the Gen 7 Electronics, only Opto endstops!

Quote

So basically a mechanical switch can't be used as an endstop with the Gen 7 Electronics, only Opto endstops!

Uh, that's not what I meant. Of course you can hook up mechanical endstops to a Gen7, just like to any other electronics.

I just said an opto endstop isn't entirely like a mechanical switch. One of the differences is, you can't make an opto endstop with a normally 5V signal from an endstop with a normally 0V signal by just swapping some pins. Where "normally" means: the interrupter fork is open.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Quote
git
Date: Sat Oct 29 19:56:15 2011 +0200

Board: remove tha ability to feed 5 V through the serial connector.

This is not of much use and had the unfortunate side effect of
destroying the USB-TTL converter while plugging improperly.

Hi, what about users that are connecting their gen7 to standard serial port via max232 based boards? +5V pin in serial connector was best way how to get power for it.

Quote

Hi, what about users that are connecting their gen7 to standard serial port via max232 based boards? +5V pin in serial connector was best way how to get power for it.

That works? Why is there no wiki description for that?

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Yes. This kind of setup is common in MCU world, I am using it for all my PC-MCU communication, gen7 is no exception. It works well.

OK. So you feed everything 5V through the serial connector and just 12V on the Molex 4-pin in the upper left corner?

A bit a description in the wiki would be kind, so others can learn on how to set this up. ... and developers are aware such a setup works.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

There's a description of the max232 circuit used for Darwin here

[reprap.org]

It is basically just a voltage level converter. Takes +,- 9 V and turns it into 0,5V TTL voltage levels. I think -9V becomes 5V and +9V becomes 0V but I could have that backwards. The max232 chip requires 5V supply to function. It is a simpler and likely more reliable way to do serial comms if you have a real serial port. But with the USB to serial cables being so cheap, it might not save you much money.

Traumflug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> OK. So you feed everything 5V through the serial
> connector and just 12V on the Molex 4-pin in the
> upper left corner?

No, its not possible to get reliable power from PC serial port. I am using option 1 setup, but I have both "ATX24" and "Serial" jumpers shorted (thus breaking "You may jumper one, and only one of them." statement on wiki). This setup allows +5VSB from PSU to get to serial connector, so I can use it to power my max232 board attached there. max232 is just example, this can be usefull to anybody who needs to get standby power for his custom board attached to serial connector. Also please note, so currently there is no other way how to get +5VSB from PSU to aux. boards. MISC connector even lacks GND.

> A bit a description in the wiki would be kind, so
> others can learn on how to set this up. ... and
> developers are aware such a setup works.
I prefer to disscuss and make it clear here first before editing wiki to avoid confusion.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2011 05:33AM by miso.

Quote

I am using option 1 setup, but I have both "ATX24" and "Serial" jumpers shorted

So you use 5VSB to supply your converter board.

The Misc connector is currently in the process to be extended to an extension board connector, which will have 5V, 5VSB, GND and the serial lines, so it'll be trivial to put a MAX232 there.

That said, I'd love to see a built in USB connector on the main board, but implementing this with an ATtiny is not so trivial and perhaps won't make it into the next release. One question to answer is: can communications go through SPI instead of serial.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

i wonder has anyone got a working build of teacup on windows that they would be willing to upload? ive got one mostly working,it would be cool to have a look at what works though.

Download the Github version? The Teacup maintainer and the Gen7 maintainer is the same person, Teacup development is currently happening on a Gen7, which means, each patch is tested on a such before it hits the public repository.

If you'd be a bit more specific about what's not working, someone might be able to help.

That said, there's a thread for discussing Teacup: [forums.reprap.org]

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

ah,ok, thanks.
i downloaded the github version,couldnt get it to run,so googled other peoples versions and found this guys one: [lars.roland.bz]
it does seem to work,pronterface connects and can manually nudge the motors,but not print files for some reason.

Quote

couldnt get it to run

Thank you for this helpful analysis.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Sorry for delay, I was quite busy last week.

Traumflug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So you use 5VSB to supply your converter board.
Yes.

> That said, I'd love to see a built in USB
> connector on the main board,
Why? What`s wrong with current setup?

PS: I have added note to wiki.

Quote

What`s wrong with current setup?

This Sparkfun plugin board isn't replicatable and much more expensive than an ATtiny45 (EUR 0.85).

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

Traumflug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This Sparkfun plugin board isn't replicatable and
> much more expensive than an ATtiny45 (EUR 0.85).

I think so FT232`s cost under 4e, but one may consider this to be cost for "doing it right". While most of bit-banging MCU implementations fall more into "works by accident" category. They can work on one PC but not on other, because they dont obey USB specification. Take Gen7 with option 3 power from USB as example. You have there one 100uF capacitor still connected in circuit while USB spec. allows only 10uF, thus it may work with one host controller/hub but another may disconnect/reset port bacause of overcurrent.

But even if you manage to put "proper" USB on board, why to abandon current modularity? Why not let users to choose which converter board (sparkfun, ATtiby, max232, ...) to use to communicate with PC?

Quote

You have there one 100uF capacitor still connected in circuit while USB spec. allows only 10uF

Thanks for pointing this out. The 100 uF can be replaced, of course.

Quote

why to abandon current modularity?

What's the point of this modularity if the cheapest solution works fine for everybody? Having options just for the sake of having options is, well, the best way to make something more complex, expensive and error-prone than neccessary.

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Generation 7 Electronics	Teacup Firmware	RepRap DIY

That's funny because mine seems to work better when powered from USB (option 3). I get more reliable firmware uploads and less hangs while printing. Of course this is from a fairly short test history as I've only been printing for a few days.

Traumflug Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What's the point of this modularity if the
> cheapest solution works fine for everybody?

Cheapest: Actually, for majority of current users cheapest solution would be current (modular) solution, because if they choose to upgrade they will need to pay for ATtiny & friends while their ftdi boards will be laying useless in drawer.

Works fine for everybody: Somebody, especially someone using mains power for heated bed, may want to put optocouplers on communication lines between PC and reprap. Its much easier to put them on TTL than USB lines.

> Having options just for the sake of having options is,
> well, the best way to make something more complex,
> expensive and error-prone than neccessary.
error-prone: expect same when you replace proven, working design with something new.

That said, reprap isnt final product, (at least some) users like to upgrade it and modify it, modular design greatly enhances this ability. Modular design also simplifies troubleshooting "on place", while modularity costs here only two 6 pin connectors. I admit, this is just my POV, someone else may consider USB on board to be a killer feature, but wouldnt this kind of user already choose some more "final product" style of electronics? Do you want to directly compete with them or provide alternative?