Which Nema 17 can I use with the duet?

I am attempting to build my own designed printer, based on my ormerod, running the ormerod firmware on a duet board.

Is it possible to use Nema 17 0.9 degree 6 wire stepper motors?
If so how is are they connected and what changes to setup do I need?

another alternative is 1.8 degree 6 wire, or the ormerod 1.8 degree 4 wire.

Any help appreciated.

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appjaws - Core XYUV Duet Ethernet Duex5
firmware 3.1.1 Web Interface 3.1.1
Ormerod 1-converted to laser engraver, Duet wifi
OpenSCAD version 2020.07
slic3r-1.3.0, Simplify3D 4.1.2, Cura-4.4.1

Hello,

You can use every stepping motor which is bidirectional up to 1.5 Amps I think, maybe even higher. You would only have to adjust the stepping/mm settings. If you have 6 wires you simply not connect the two wires which lead to the middle of the coils.
Are you planning a complete new design or an improved Ormerod? In 6 weeks I will start planning a complete new design based on the cartesian principle. After that I know I have fully understood 3D printing.

Best regards,

Sven

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/20/2015 10:50AM by Treito.

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Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.

Yes you can use 0.9deg/step motors, but unless you are building a delta printer then they offer little if any advantage over 1.8deg/step motors IMO. As Sven says, if they are 6 wire motors then leave the two centre tap connections not connected. The ideal current rating is 1.2 to 1.5A, but in practice motors rated at up to 1.7A are often used because it is rarely necessary to run them at full current anyway.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

I am not sure what kind of motors I used regarding the Amps. The only thing I know is that they have a higher rated current as the original ones and they are common and therefore easier to get.
Regarding 0.9deg/step - there should be a slightly difference or not? As you said elsewhere one or two steps may get lost starting the motor and so on. I already bought them for my new printer idea even one for the extrusion, but I do not think that I have there some sort of advantage as others uses direct drive motors with a lower resolution and I even increase it. But they are big, that is a big disadvantage.

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Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.

Hmmmm, just a thought here. Would the 0.9 Degree stepper motors not be more expensive and over Kill for a 3D printer, unless you are planning on using larger pulleys for the Belts that is?
I'm just wondering if your going to be wanting to do more accurate movements, your probably be needing a much smaller diameter nozzle (0.2 / 0.3mm or the like), as the movement will be more accurate than the
amount of Plastic you'll be extruding if you understand what I'm meaning.

I fancy the idea of making a larger printer myself, but would use the same motors as the Ormerod, and DC's excellent Firmware to run it.

Having got 3 printers now I think I'd be in the Dog House with her indoors if I made one thou.... But it would be fun to do....

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Please send me a PM if you have suggestions, or problems with Big Blue 360.
I won't see comments in threads, as I move around to much.
Working Link to Big Blue 360 Complete

Thanks for the replys
It looks as if using a higher spec than the original ormerod motors would offer little benefit.

I am thinking of using direct drives instead of belts
Do you think the amp rating of the original ormerod motors would be sufficient?

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appjaws - Core XYUV Duet Ethernet Duex5
firmware 3.1.1 Web Interface 3.1.1
Ormerod 1-converted to laser engraver, Duet wifi
OpenSCAD version 2020.07
slic3r-1.3.0, Simplify3D 4.1.2, Cura-4.4.1

I maybe will use pulleys with even less tooth and maybe a GT2 belt to get an integer value for the stepping settings. Besides I am still wondering why dc42 said that there would be an improvement if you are using a delta printer, but not much with a cartesian.
I also decided to use a M16 trapezoid threaded rod for the z-axis so a 0.9 steps/mm motor is a good way to compensate the accuracy loss.
At least I paid 12$ per each stepper motor which is interchangeable with the original motors (appjaws I would really suggest to use these instead of the originals or to use one with more depth) and 15$ per each 0.9 steps/mm motor.
And of course I will use a Duet board as the other boards have big disadvantages like selecting the Amps manually, missing configuration files, fake FTDI-chips, way too expensive and so on. But I probably will stay at Duet 0.6 or maybe 0.85 if I decide to use a Dual Extruder.

---

Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.

Quote
Treito
I maybe will use pulleys with even less tooth and maybe a GT2 belt to get an integer value for the stepping settings. Besides I am still wondering why dc42 said that there would be an improvement if you are using a delta printer, but not much with a cartesian.

I said that on the basis that good Z resolution is more critical than good X and Y resolution, in order to get a consistent layer height. On a delta the Z axis has worst resolution than X or Y, typically 80 or 100 steps/mm using 1.8deg/step motors. On a Cartesian printer, you normally use a leadscrew or threaded rod for the Z axis and have a much higher steps/mm.

I guess it's possible that if you have friction in your X and Y axes, then the higher (nearly double) torque from 0.9deg/step motors for small movements might be beneficial in overcoming it.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2015 05:09AM by dc42.

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Large delta printer [miscsolutions.wordpress.com], E3D tool changer, Robotdigg SCARA printer, Crane Quad and Ormerod

Disclosure: I design Duet electronics and work on RepRapFirmware, [duet3d.com].

Okay like I said I will loose accuration if I use a trapezoid M16 thread witch has a pitch of 2mm or 4mm instead of 0.5mm of the original Ormerod. So to compensate this I will use a 0.9 steps/mm motor and another transmission ratio. The M5 threaded rod is to wobbly.
I would prefer to use the same motors for everything or can I get a disadvantage for example regarding the extruder? Okay the motors are muchbigger and heavier, but this can also be an advantage, maybe also a disadvantage. Maybe I will use the 0.9 steps/mm motor for the Z-Axis only.

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Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.

Quote
Treito
...instead of 0.5mm of the original Ormerod..

The pitch of the original 5mm treaded rod is 0.8

Erik

Sorry Erik I mixed it up with the calibration and the M3 screw.

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Slicer: Simplify3D 4.0; sometimes CraftWare 1.14 or Cura 2.7
Delta with Duet-WiFi, FW: 1.20.1RC2; mini-sensor board by dc42 for auto-leveling
Ormerod common modifications: Mini-sensor board by dc42, aluminum X-arm, 0.4 mm nozzle E3D like, 2nd fan, Z stepper nut M5 x 15, Herringbone gears, Z-axis bearing at top, spring loaded extruder with pneumatic fitting, Y belt axis tensioner
Ormerod 2: FW: 1.19-dc42 on Duet-WiFi. own build, modifications: GT2-belts, silicone heat-bed, different motors and so on. Printed parts: bed support, (PSU holder) and Y-feet.
Ormerod 1: FW: 1.15c-dc42 on 1k Duet-Board. Modifications: Aluminium bed-support, (nearly) all parts reprinted in PLA/ ABS, and so on.