Ebay SINTRON Kossel Mini full kit

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patrol420
mine seems to be working fine now apart from when its doing infill it seems to speed up the extruder too much, when doing solids its fine? ive calibrated the extruder. do i have to change the acceleration value for e in firmware?

Sounds like a slicer setting is wrong, but without a picture.....
-Olaf

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theda1
My Heatbed would not come up to temperature at all. (86Degrees instead of 110)
Larger wire (20 Amp) from Power supply to 12 volt relay the Thermister on the heatbed will cycle Ramps and then the relay to keep the temperature Correct and connect Ramps output to Relay to actuate
All heat problems on the ramps board disappear and full voltage can get to the heat bed.
Car relay is 30 Amps and cheap.

Thanks for posting, theda1!

I have been having problems with my heatbed drawing too much current, even with the duty cycle set low and a fan blowing on the polyfuse. For some reason I never considered a relay. Today I bought a relay, and wired it in with a 15 amp fuse. No more problems with the polyfuse turning off the power at startup. 4:30 to get from room temperature to 100 degrees C. That's not bad, I can live with that.

Did anyone else find that they had to set the MAX_BED_POWER to 275 to stop the relay clicking like a maraca?

Anyway thanks again for posting, I'm pleased as punch with my heatbed now.

I have it moving! took me a while to figure out some error messages, and a bug that caused the printer to shut down immediately because of too high temperature (turns out thermocouplers are set as default....

Just one thing: When the printhead moves to the edge of the print area, my printer emits a noise like its having a severe asthma attack. pretty high pitched wheezing... is it supposed to do that?
link to a video: [www.dropbox.com]

near the end you'll hear my wife saying: "that doesn't sound very healthy...". It may just be something that i'm doing wrong...

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nebbian
Did anyone else find that they had to set the MAX_BED_POWER to 275 to stop the relay clicking like a maraca?

275 doesn't make sense. The highest possible value is 255.
Anyway, with a mechanical relay you have to use bang-bang mode instead of PID_bed_temperature.
Even with a solid state relay, most people use bang-bang, otherwise you have to reduce PWM frequency.
-Olaf

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/17/2015 02:00PM by o_lampe.

thanks Olaf i retweaked slic3r settings and made a fan mount and havnt had a problem since seems to be printing close enough to perfect

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nebbian

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theda1
My Heatbed would not come up to temperature at all. (86Degrees instead of 110)
Larger wire (20 Amp) from Power supply to 12 volt relay the Thermister on the heatbed will cycle Ramps and then the relay to keep the temperature Correct and connect Ramps output to Relay to actuate
All heat problems on the ramps board disappear and full voltage can get to the heat bed.
Car relay is 30 Amps and cheap.

Thanks for posting, theda1!

I have been having problems with my heatbed drawing too much current, even with the duty cycle set low and a fan blowing on the polyfuse. For some reason I never considered a relay. Today I bought a relay, and wired it in with a 15 amp fuse. No more problems with the polyfuse turning off the power at startup. 4:30 to get from room temperature to 100 degrees C. That's not bad, I can live with that.

Did anyone else find that they had to set the MAX_BED_POWER to 275 to stop the relay clicking like a maraca?

Anyway thanks again for posting, I'm pleased as punch with my heatbed now.

Yesterday I've just replaced fuse with the one I ordered since I had to order other things anyway. And so far it seems to have fixed a problem. Though I haven't changed firmware back to full duty cycle, but I can heat bed and print without fanning no problem now. So it seems the fuse they install is crap.

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theda1
I to had this problem..cheap 30 Amp Car relay did the trick and 20 Amp wire (so it does not heat up and become resistive)
Aurduino board operates the relay with Thermister operating Arduino board so temp stays good and No more big Loads on the Ramps or Arduino
I still had to wind up the Power Supply to 13.6 volts to get 100 Degrees

My RAMPS smoked. The poly fuses are terrible and I did the inline Car fuse trick and it works. But I also have a fan blowing on the RAMPS now.

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Tha_Reaper
I have it moving! took me a while to figure out some error messages, and a bug that caused the printer to shut down immediately because of too high temperature (turns out thermocouplers are set as default....

Just one thing: When the printhead moves to the edge of the print area, my printer emits a noise like its having a severe asthma attack. pretty high pitched wheezing... is it supposed to do that?
link to a video: [www.dropbox.com]

near the end you'll hear my wife saying: "that doesn't sound very healthy...". It may just be something that i'm doing wrong...

Mine does that as well. I think its a warning. Mine will also do that one the nozzle is floating about the Z Home. It makes the same high pitched sound. I think its a warning.

But even after I centered my hotend it over shoots on one side and not the other. It internally is not centered? But physically centered on my heat bed?

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hacker

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o_lampe
@nebbian Sorry for OT, but could you put the sloppy Traxxas joints in cooking water for 10mins. and let them cool down in it?
We used to do that with all plastic parts back in RC-Car days...
I´d like to know, if the slop is gone by the treatment..
THX
-Olaf

I ordered two sets and some 5-6 turned out sloppy. Treatment fixed approximately half them.Three are still sloppy.

I tried to fix the metal rods by grinding them. I thought I did a good job. They all measured the same length but my prints started to look funny. I tried to understand this link that you all sent me but I dont understand it. [www.thingiverse.com]
Specifically this:
Look for the next line in marlin_main.cpp:

float delta_diagonal_rod_2 = sq(delta_diagonal_rod);
and add a squared diagonal rod definition for each rod including the size correction

float delta_diagonal_rod_2_x= sq(delta_diagonal_rod*(60.25/60));
float delta_diagonal_rod_2_y= sq(delta_diagonal_rod*(60.31/60));
float delta_diagonal_rod_2_z= sq(delta_diagonal_rod);

I tried typing that in but I got errors when compiling. I dont know how to make that part work. So I gave up. Bought pre made rods from someone on ebay. My prints look great now but I am still having calibration issues.

I have tried the nickle calibration. The hole for the nickle is too small. The 10mm cube calibration. The cube is always 10.5mm? I then tried another cube called the 20mm cube. My cube came out 20.79mm? Its driving me nuts.

I did get my z probe to work. I can make it retract but NOT make it auto deploy.I cant seem to get the settings right to make the z probe scratch against the belts to deploy. So I manually deploy the probe. Type in G29 and it does its thing. Then goes onto a z probe retraction block that I found on thingiverse. [www.thingiverse.com]

My z probe clamp melted since it touched the hotend. So I went back to the original idea. Bought a terminal block on ebay. Took out the metal part and use that. See picture for the idea. Thats not my hotend though.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2015 12:01AM by DRTak.

DrTak,

I've found that the most reliable way to calibrate the output size is to measure your diagonal rods as precisely as you can. You need to measure from the centre of the round ball to the centre of the other round ball. Plug that number in, and then calibrate the smooth rod offset so that you get a flat print surface. Then you're DONE with adjusting those measurements. No more printing, no more measuring, no more adjusting, no more scratching your head. None. Step away from the printer...

I don't know how many of those circular delta calibration prints I printed but it would be more than a dozen. In the end I realised that I was over extruding, which was causing my measurement differences.


For reference I set up a friend's delta yesterday via a video stream and remote desktop session... the technology we have available to us now is amazing. It took 4 hours to go from a freshly built machine to one that prints calibration cubes precisely (well, within 0.1mm when measuring the outside of the cube, which is well within tolerance). In fact the very first cube we printed was perfect, apart from the layer fan cooling the print head too much so the output stopped.

The reason it was so quick was that we followed the method of measuring the diagonal rods as well as we could, then did the paper test lots of times both in the centre of the bed and the edges, which gave us a perfectly flat print surface. Once that was done you are FINISHED with calibrating print sizing.

I'm having the size-Troubles too.
As far as I've figured out, Sintron is selling a 80 Steps/mm configuration.
But in their preconfigured Marlin-Version, it says 79 Steps/mm and 94 for the Extruder. Does not seem correct to me.
I will change the values to 80, calibrate again, print again, measure again.
My diagonal rods are perfectly measured to 1/100mm using a digital caliper.

EDIT:
Z-Probe does work..... sometimes...
Auto-Deployment never worked, but often I've got the problem, the probe gets stuck while probing. I did use sewing machine oil (because it is very clean and fine) but still doesn't work reliable...
So I decided not to do G29 anymore.
I did an extra turn on manual calibration, and now I'm printing nearly perfect quality (except SIZE!) without G29.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2015 02:41AM by Sir_Death.

Does anyone know which thermistor setting to use in the marlin configuration? I seriously don't trust the Sintron guys to know or set up their software properly.

I've been using 1 for the hotend, but am having to go to 255 degrees for printing ABS which seems high to me. If I go lower in temperature then the parts have layer delamination issues when you really stress them. 255 is the lowest temperature where the layers really fuse together properly and you can't separate them with a strong thumbnail jab.

I'm thinking that I've got the wrong thermistor selected, and it's not actually that hot. But who knows. I don't have a thermometer that can reliably measure the hotend properly.

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nebbian
Does anyone know which thermistor setting to use in the marlin configuration? I seriously don't trust the Sintron guys to know or set up their software properly.

I've been using 1 for the hotend, but am having to go to 255 degrees for printing ABS which seems high to me. If I go lower in temperature then the parts have layer delamination issues when you really stress them. 255 is the lowest temperature where the layers really fuse together properly and you can't separate them with a strong thumbnail jab.

I'm thinking that I've got the wrong thermistor selected, and it's not actually that hot. But who knows. I don't have a thermometer that can reliably measure the hotend properly.

Correct.
You have to use much higher temperature, because the filament stays in the hot Zone very short time. To get the ammount of heat-energy into the filament, which makes the filament melt, you have to look at the dwell time multiplied with the temperatur difference --> equals ammount of Energy.
I'm using 210°C for PLA!
The slower you print and the smaller your layer height is, the lower you can go with the temperature.

There is an Homepage at http://3druck.com/lieferanten-haendler/fdm-3d-druck-abs-oder-pla-sind-die-unterschiede-2020380/ explaining this issue - but I'm sorry, it is only in german. :-(

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2015 02:52AM by Sir_Death.

Thanks Sir Death

I'm printing those perimeters at 40 mm/s (20 mm/s for external perimeters, but all of them are delaminating), with a 0.4mm nozzle and 0.1mm layer height.

The level of detail is really nice, repeatability is excellent, the only concern is that I might be getting a bit too hot. If you say that it's normal then I'll just shrug my shoulders and accept that that's just the way to do it I guess.

Thanks for your help.

I'm running my printer with thermistor table 13, because most Chinese hotends come with the 3950 thermistor.
-Olaf

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nebbian
Thanks Sir Death

I'm printing those perimeters at 40 mm/s (20 mm/s for external perimeters, but all of them are delaminating), with a 0.4mm nozzle and 0.1mm layer height.

The level of detail is really nice, repeatability is excellent, the only concern is that I might be getting a bit too hot. If you say that it's normal then I'll just shrug my shoulders and accept that that's just the way to do it I guess.

Thanks for your help.

It is just important, that the cool end stays cool! - Else the Effector might melt.
When you heat up to 255°C and the Hotend cooling fan is on, it must be possible to touch the cool end without burning! - then everything is OK.
Some guys even apply Teflon film on the upper end of the heatbreake (hollow screw) to stop heattransmission to the cool end - I think, this is not necessary.

Right now I'm printing with 0.2mm layer height, and the external Perimeter and Top + Bottom Layer with 5mm/sec (everything else 30mm/sec) 0.4mm nozzle
Level of detail is really good, but I've having to big size :-) 10mm box is 10.55mm - have to check, where it is comming from...

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nebbian
DrTak,

I've found that the most reliable way to calibrate the output size is to measure your diagonal rods as precisely as you can. You need to measure from the centre of the round ball to the centre of the other round ball. Plug that number in, and then calibrate the smooth rod offset so that you get a flat print surface. Then you're DONE with adjusting those measurements. No more printing, no more measuring, no more adjusting, no more scratching your head. None. Step away from the printer...

I don't know how many of those circular delta calibration prints I printed but it would be more than a dozen. In the end I realised that I was over extruding, which was causing my measurement differences.


For reference I set up a friend's delta yesterday via a video stream and remote desktop session... the technology we have available to us now is amazing. It took 4 hours to go from a freshly built machine to one that prints calibration cubes precisely (well, within 0.1mm when measuring the outside of the cube, which is well within tolerance). In fact the very first cube we printed was perfect, apart from the layer fan cooling the print head too much so the output stopped.

The reason it was so quick was that we followed the method of measuring the diagonal rods as well as we could, then did the paper test lots of times both in the centre of the bed and the edges, which gave us a perfectly flat print surface. Once that was done you are FINISHED with calibrating print sizing.

Thanks so much for that input. I went to your older post and you told me the same thing but I didnt listen. So this time, using the newly purchased rods from ebay which are within +/- 0.1mm. I typed in the number of 215mm. And bingo I made a 20mm cube that is 19.97mm. I am not touching that one. Its perfect. I have height issues now. Before I didnt. The cube is 20.5mm high? My z steps are set to the standard Sintron of 94? Should I change it?

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Sir_Death

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nebbian
Thanks Sir Death

I'm printing those perimeters at 40 mm/s (20 mm/s for external perimeters, but all of them are delaminating), with a 0.4mm nozzle and 0.1mm layer height.

The level of detail is really nice, repeatability is excellent, the only concern is that I might be getting a bit too hot. If you say that it's normal then I'll just shrug my shoulders and accept that that's just the way to do it I guess.

Thanks for your help.

It is just important, that the cool end stays cool! - Else the Effector might melt.
When you heat up to 255°C and the Hotend cooling fan is on, it must be possible to touch the cool end without burning! - then everything is OK.
Some guys even apply Teflon film on the upper end of the heatbreake (hollow screw) to stop heattransmission to the cool end - I think, this is not necessary.

Right now I'm printing with 0.2mm layer height, and the external Perimeter and Top + Bottom Layer with 5mm/sec (everything else 30mm/sec) 0.4mm nozzle
Level of detail is really good, but I've having to big size :-) 10mm box is 10.55mm - have to check, where it is comming from...

Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

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DRTak


Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

I'm using Slic3r - where do you change the Perimeter to 1mm?

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Sir_Death

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DRTak


Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

I'm using Slic3r - where do you change the Perimeter to 1mm?

I don't think you can directly, but you can look up the perimeter extrusion width at the beginning of g-code and set the number of perimeters accordingly. But I'm not sure you have the same problem… If it is about extrusion width, maybe you want to do this — [github.com] — with Slic3r.

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hacker

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Sir_Death

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DRTak


Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

I'm using Slic3r - where do you change the Perimeter to 1mm?

I don't think you can directly, but you can look up the perimeter extrusion width at the beginning of g-code and set the number of perimeters accordingly. But I'm not sure you have the same problem… If it is about extrusion width, maybe you want to do this — [github.com] — with Slic3r.

Thanks for the Link - I already thought of the extrusion width, but had no Idea on how to Check it!

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Sir_Death

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hacker

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Sir_Death

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DRTak


Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

I'm using Slic3r - where do you change the Perimeter to 1mm?

I don't think you can directly, but you can look up the perimeter extrusion width at the beginning of g-code and set the number of perimeters accordingly. But I'm not sure you have the same problem… If it is about extrusion width, maybe you want to do this — [github.com] — with Slic3r.

Thanks for the Link - I already thought of the extrusion width, but had no Idea on how to Check it!

I think if it's extrusion width the error stays constant if you print 10x10 and 50x50 cubes. If it's assembly dimensions it should probably be constant percentage.

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hacker

I think if it's extrusion width the error stays constant if you print 10x10 and 50x50 cubes. If it's assembly dimensions it should probably be constant percentage.

I thought of the extrusion width, because it is the same on 10, 25 and 60mm

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Sir_Death

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hacker

I think if it's extrusion width the error stays constant if you print 10x10 and 50x50 cubes. If it's assembly dimensions it should probably be constant percentage.

I thought of the extrusion width, because it is the same on 10, 25 and 60mm

Slic3r calibration might help then. Also make it's a good idea to calibrate e-steps first. Though technically extrusion multiplier and e-steps have the same effect, I believe.

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hacker

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Sir_Death

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hacker

I think if it's extrusion width the error stays constant if you print 10x10 and 50x50 cubes. If it's assembly dimensions it should probably be constant percentage.

I thought of the extrusion width, because it is the same on 10, 25 and 60mm

Slic3r calibration might help then. Also make it's a good idea to calibrate e-steps first. Though technically extrusion multiplier and e-steps have the same effect, I believe.

After some Testing:
E-steps are 100Steps/mm, not 94 as Sintron says.
But:
; external perimeters extrusion width = 0.40mm
Measured: 0.75mm!

First try is setting "External Perimeter" in Slic3r manually to 0.4mm width, if that does not work, I'll try Setting to 50%....

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Sir_Death

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hacker

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Sir_Death

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hacker

I think if it's extrusion width the error stays constant if you print 10x10 and 50x50 cubes. If it's assembly dimensions it should probably be constant percentage.

I thought of the extrusion width, because it is the same on 10, 25 and 60mm

Slic3r calibration might help then. Also make it's a good idea to calibrate e-steps first. Though technically extrusion multiplier and e-steps have the same effect, I believe.

After some Testing:
E-steps are 100Steps/mm, not 94 as Sintron says.
But:
; external perimeters extrusion width = 0.40mm
Measured: 0.75mm!

First try is setting "External Perimeter" in Slic3r manually to 0.4mm width, if that does not work, I'll try Setting to 50%....

My step/mm are 104.027 to the best of my calibration. And the extrusion multiplier is normally within 0.9-1. I think, though, you should look at perimeters, not external perimeters. Not sure why. Or else I'm always doing it wrong ;-) But .75 is still a bit off.

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hacker

My step/mm are 104.027 to the best of my calibration. And the extrusion multiplier is normally within 0.9-1. I think, though, you should look at perimeters, not external perimeters. Not sure why. Or else I'm always doing it wrong ;-) But .75 is still a bit off.

I'm on the way..... 0.6.... next try running...

Seems it was the Filament! - Measured at the beginning: 1.72 - 1.78 --> 1.75 OK
Now: 1.89 to 1.96 --> now I know where the overextrusion is comming from...

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Sir_Death

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hacker

My step/mm are 104.027 to the best of my calibration. And the extrusion multiplier is normally within 0.9-1. I think, though, you should look at perimeters, not external perimeters. Not sure why. Or else I'm always doing it wrong ;-) But .75 is still a bit off.

I'm on the way..... 0.6.... next try running...

Seems it was the Filament! - Measured at the beginning: 1.72 - 1.78 --> 1.75 OK
Now: 1.89 to 1.96 --> now I know where the overextrusion is comming from...

That's quite a difference. But unless it's way to variable (as opposed to having settled at around 1.9something) that's what extrusion multiplier is for.

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Sir_Death

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DRTak


Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

I'm using Slic3r - where do you change the Perimeter to 1mm?

Print Settings > Advanced > Perimeters

However, I have since changed it back to default 0. At 1 the walls are very weak.

Also, I noticed that I was not getting enough filament and my parts were kinda off. Small parts that is. Im trying to print LEGOs which are impossible.

So I changed my setting back to E of 100. It looks like this


// default settings

#define DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT {80, 80, 80, 100} // x 75 87.3 was my default but prints are 10.6mm not 10mm
#define DEFAULT_MAX_FEEDRATE {300, 300, 300, 300} // (mm/sec)
#define DEFAULT_MAX_ACCELERATION {1000,1000,1000,1000} // X, Y, Z, E max

I hope everyone elses looks similar?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2015 05:28PM by DRTak.

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DRTak

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Sir_Death

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DRTak


Ha. Thats the same issue I had. And your unit is perfect. I forgot to mention. I also changed the perimeter to 1mm and that fixed my sizing issue as well.

I'm using Slic3r - where do you change the Perimeter to 1mm?

Print Settings > Advanced > Perimeters

Oops, that's what you meant!